This is from the website. On his performance, Viney said he believed his start to the season had been “solid without being spectacular”.“I feel like I’m playing my role within the team at the moment and doing what’s required and popping up here and there, doing some good things,” he said. “I’m certainly looking to keep getting better and improving throughout the year.”

If I remember he had a late start to pre season post op which my explain the slow start. I guess we want more from him than "solid".

We also don't know what this role is and maybe that is the issue, he is following coaches orders. I do know that we seem unable to curtail the opposition stars in the midfield this year. I thought Viney tagged Steven's in game 1 to good effect but Murphy, Dangerwood and Fyfe have all dominated us in the last 3 weeks. I still feel that the coach is tinkering with the team composition and game plan and isn't overly worried at the moment about finals.

Melbourne supporters are just scarred.

We have no idea whether or not Viney's form over the first four rounds has anything at all to do with the captaincy call.

The only thing that we know to be true is the following:

- Viney had hip surgery pre-christmas and has therefore had an interrupted pre-season. If not for the captaincy call, this would be the next excuse in the barrel. Without a doubt. 

- As history suggests, many players can have a less than satisfactory season following their best and whilst that is not a great sign, it's definitely been a trend for many players at Melbourne. 

- We're four rounds into the year. He wouldn't be the first player within the AFL to end up having a great year after an average start.

By far an unViney like start to the season but i still think the best is ahead of Jack and much room for improvement. I reckon Jack needs a chop out from others around him though to see some clear air and start playing at the level we know he's capable of. The return of Lewis should help a little, although he tends to play a more mid/back role and Tyson who is a fair way off it and has had a pretty ordinary start. Brayshaw being out and off his game at present hasn't helped either and the Jones Boy had a rare off match against the Dockers. Doubt we'll see 2 in a row from the Co-Captain.

For the record the weighted averages of select stats i look at each week still has JV in our top 5 players as follows after week 4.....

1. Clarry 5.55 (weighted average score)

2. The Jones Boy 5.28

3. Salem 4.01

4. Stretch 3.95

5. Viney 3.89

Petracca is nipping at JV's heals with 3.63 in 6th place which is great to see. A budding star slowly on the rise

There is no doubt to me that Jack has gone away from his natural game, and what comes instinctively to him. I am guessing that as a result of assuming the captaincy, he is looking to lead by bringing his teammates into the game and take on less himself.

I'd like to see him be the person to run and carry the football himself, and attack the game, rather than looking for others to do so. Running straight at opponents and looking to dish off a handball is not working, and opponents have found him out.

I also think a run with role is the way to go - get Cotchin to take him to the footy, make a few big tackles and he'll be up and about again.

Questioned the decision at the time and his form certainly hasn't swayed me from that position.

It's however a good sign that we could easily be 4-0 with arguably our best mid playing terribly.

On 15/04/2017 at 5:33 PM, dino rover said:

Like young players dlanders panic at moments of adversity

A balanced view is that he is one player

I dont know what his roles have been what his opponents have done or what his coaches view is

I doubt captaincy is some cross he carries

Im as gutted as the rest of you just struggling to maintain some perspective

 

Would have qualified for post of the year if we'd played on Good Friday.

Never a fan of dual Captaincy,I don't think any of the them are decent captain. If the captain is constantly out of form he needs to be dropped.You can't have one rule for one player and another rule for another.

If Viney does just one thing this week I hope it is to grab that arrogant bikie offspring by his outstretched hand and pull out his shoulder.  That would be a big contribution.

16 minutes ago, monoccular said:

If Viney does just one thing this week I hope it is to grab that arrogant bikie offspring by his outstretched hand and pull out his shoulder.  That would be a big contribution.

or given it's ok the smash someone's ribs a nice rib-breaker special (or two) from jack would do

37 minutes ago, daisycutter said:

or given it's ok the smash someone's ribs a nice rib-breaker special (or two) from jack would do

Being a Melbourne player Jack would get life.

39 minutes ago, deebug said:

Being a Melbourne player Jack would get life.

Actually...for what though. As i suggest elsewhere should a don't-argue be proffered simply grab with same sided hand and slam your shoulder (gool ol hip-shoulder style) into  Chopsticks   chest flattening him . Nothing actually wrong in that. Unusual yes.... Unlawful...no.

Bloody effective

( Just dont leave the ground (jump ))

Or just fend his arm aside and continue slam

Need this ferocity back. Still my favourite tackle.

 

Jack is still averaging over 7 tackles a game, which shows his defensive side is still there, hes only 3-4 possies off his output last year. Have to remember last year we also didnt have Oliver getting 30+ possessions a week, so hes taken some off Jack there, ANB also wasnt even getting a game hes getting 25+. Jack simply isnt the sole person extracting the ball anymore. When Jack has 3 under 20 possession games and only 3 tackles per game, then we should get on his back. The kid is 4 games into the season, and has had an interrupted pre season.... give him a break.

19 minutes ago, Luther said:

Need this ferocity back. Still my favourite tackle.

 

that's why they call jack an army

1 hour ago, Luther said:

Need this ferocity back. Still my favourite tackle.

 

So that's what happened to mavs face! Didn't think it could get that way on its own

Something is clearly not right. The captaincy issue, the potential impact of our game-plan, and some of Jack's natural limitations and areas for improvement are clouding the issue. I think people are somewhat forgetting his previous contributions. This time last year, he was in the top four in the AFLCA votes - keeping company with Mitchell, Parker, Dangerfield and Robbie Gray (on par this year with Dusty Martin and Ollie Wines). He looked ready to break into that absolute Brownlow-baiting elite category. While his numbers may be down, it's his lack of intensity that is the major concern for me as it seems so fundamentally uncharacteristic. My MFCSS is worried we have another Trengove's foot with regard to Viney's hip. My hopeful side thinks it's just another bone fracture he's not yet aware of.

He's been playing a couple different roles from what I can see this year. Pretty sure he ran with Neale a bit on Sat and was he manned up on Selwood last week (I was there but pretty full so struggling to remember)

Also, Clarry seems to be the extractor this season which was Vineys bread and butter last year.

In my opinion he's just warming up and will be back to his best soon

9 minutes ago, deeko said:

He's been playing a couple different roles from what I can see this year. Pretty sure he ran with Neale a bit on Sat and was he manned up on Selwood last week (I was there but pretty full so struggling to remember)

Also, Clarry seems to be the extractor this season which was Vineys bread and butter last year.

In my opinion he's just warming up and will be back to his best soon

I have always thought that Jacks main attribute is he is hard at it. He is not blessed with an excess of skill.

So when you take him away from his hard at the ball get it at all costs game then he struggles.

IMO he is not a negating player. 

 

17 minutes ago, deeko said:

He's been playing a couple different roles from what I can see this year. Pretty sure he ran with Neale a bit on Sat and was he manned up on Selwood last week (I was there but pretty full so struggling to remember)

Also, Clarry seems to be the extractor this season which was Vineys bread and butter last year.

In my opinion he's just warming up and will be back to his best soon

Spot on.

He has played certain roles this season as opposed to the extra freedom he had last year.

Also anyone who thinks the captaincy is weighing on his ability need only look back at his 'talk' to the players in his first season back in the dark days.... The kid was born to lead. In fact he is not doing anything he hasn't done in previous seasons anyway. He just now has the captaincy badge. 

19 minutes ago, old dee said:

I have always thought that Jacks main attribute is he is hard at it. He is not blessed with an excess of skill.

So when you take him away from his hard at the ball get it at all costs game then he struggles.

IMO he is not a negating player. 

 

Yeah definitely agree Old. He doesn't have a lot  of different tricks in his armoury but the ones he owns (aggressive inside mid) he's on par with some very good players in the comp.

Anyway he's still so young and I don't mind him learning a new skill set (whether they are run with roles or as a bit more of an outside receiver) so we have a better balance and allow greater rotations going forward.

I don't mind him going the hard tag, he's done a couple jobs in the past and has been ok. I'd rather Vince in that role however as he seems to only hurt the opponent but hurt them on the scoreboard

 

5 hours ago, daisycutter said:

or given it's ok the smash someone's ribs a nice rib-breaker special (or two) from jack would do

I've had broken ribs (x 7). I would not wish that on anyone. 

I felt Cloke's pain watching that incident the other day. 

4 hours ago, Luther said:

Need this ferocity back. Still my favourite tackle.

 

He would get six weeks for that outrageous tackle this year

29 minutes ago, monoccular said:

He would get six weeks for that outrageous tackle this year

Only if we were playing Carlton. All other clubs don't [censored] on the medical reports

5 hours ago, deeko said:

He's been playing a couple different roles from what I can see this year. Pretty sure he ran with Neale a bit on Sat and was he manned up on Selwood last week (I was there but pretty full so struggling to remember)

Also, Clarry seems to be the extractor this season which was Vineys bread and butter last year.

In my opinion he's just warming up and will be back to his best soon

I've read this sentiment a bit now and I just don't buy it. I'm sorry. Just because there's another player 'taking his touches', doesn't mean he should be down on touches. Has Selwood been down on possessions since Dangerfield arrived? I think it's a load of crap.

We can keep making excuses or we can be honest about the situation. Jack is struggling. He might be playing a new role and doing his bit for the team, but there's no doubt he's not as dynamic as he was last year and Oliver has nothing to do with it. 

I watched Jack come back onto the ground at one stage on Saturday and I've no doubt he's carrying an injury or the remnants of his hip surgery is not allowing him to reach full flight. He could barely run in a straight line the other day. I'm surprised he was cleared to play, but I'm no doctor, so they obviously think he can play a role, despite not being at full capacity. 

I hope we get to see some of his 2016 form again this year, but it always seems to be an uphill battle for most players when they have those interrupted pre-season's.

On 18/04/2017 at 3:42 PM, beelzebub said:

Actually...for what though. As i suggest elsewhere should a don't-argue be proffered simply grab with same sided hand and slam your shoulder (gool ol hip-shoulder style) into  Chopsticks   chest flattening him . Nothing actually wrong in that. Unusual yes.... Unlawful...no.

Bloody effective

( Just dont leave the ground (jump ))

Or just fend his arm aside and continue slam

Lets hope he comes out breathing fire and making those #%$ *&^#* cry.