weitering zones off and reads the play as well as mackie, and his kicking is probably as good.

1 minute ago, PaulRB said:

Add Tyson and Garlett who earned RS noms at their first clubs...

Why? We didn't draft or initially develop them, which was your argument.

From 2008-2011, the 9 nominees we had are either at another club, no longer playing AFL or are not in our best 22. 

 

5 minutes ago, mo64 said:

Why? We didn't draft or initially develop them, which was your argument.

From 2008-2011, the 9 nominees we had are either at another club, no longer playing AFL or are not in our best 22. 

 

My point was about this years crop being a good sign. Your point was about the 2008-2013 period (now revised to 2008-2011), and the validity of the RS nom as a talent indicator... 

I'm not really getting your point, or what you think we're "debating" here? 

 

Rising star nominations still on list C Garland, J Grimes, J Trengove, J Garlett (@ Blues), J Melksham (@ Dons), TMac, D Tyson (@ GWS), J Viney, A Brayshaw, J Hogan, C Petracca, C Oliver, J Harmes, OMac.

Aside from the first three on that list who appear to be struggling, it (the RS) seems a good pick of top 22 talent. 

13 minutes ago, PaulRB said:

My point was about this years crop being a good sign. Your point was about the 2008-2013 period (now revised to 2008-2011), and the validity of the RS nom as a talent indicator... 

I'm not really getting your point, or what you think we're "debating" here? 

 

Rising star nominations still on list C Garland, J Grimes, J Trengove, J Garlett (@ Blues), J Melksham (@ Dons), TMac, D Tyson (@ GWS), J Viney, A Brayshaw, J Hogan, C Petracca, C Oliver, J Harmes, OMac.

Aside from the first three on that list who appear to be struggling, it (the RS) seems a good pick of top 22 talent. 

You said the fact we had lots of nominations this year meant the recruiters had been doing a good job.

He is saying we had more nominations in a period that has proven to be one of absolutely shocking recruiting.

His point therefore is that nominations do not equal good recruiting. It just means that young players have been good both times.

The difference, in my view, is that this young crop will be developed properly, whereas the 2008-2011 crop got their nominations before they were Melbournised.

And under different circumstances you could argue that Trengove, Jurrah and Wona would all been very good players for us. Not to mention that little sh!tbag Scully. 

8 minutes ago, Undeeterred said:

You said the fact we had lots of nominations this year meant the recruiters had been doing a good job.

He is saying we had more nominations in a period that has proven to be one of absolutely shocking recruiting.

His point therefore is that nominations do not equal good recruiting. It just means that young players have been good both times.

The difference, in my view, is that this young crop will be developed properly, whereas the 2008-2011 crop got their nominations before they were Melbournised.

I think if you look at the players from that period there are several aspects to why so many failed or were nominated and failed to develop

Liam and Aussie struggled with footy lifestyle (and were speculative, high pick - high risk projects)

Gysberts and Blease were entitled kids who needed a strong club culture to have them do the work required to succeed at this level, the fact both continued to fail at other clubs indicates to me that their character flaws were the predominated feature of their being unable to realise their talents at AFL level.

Trengove and Grimes were of good character and found themselves in a club devoid of leaders burdened with leadership at the expense of getting their bodies and footy right.

Agree we appear to be doing things better these days.

50 minutes ago, DemonAndrew said:

2016 thus far:

oliver

harmes

petracca

o mac

 

2015:

brayshaw

hogan

 

2014:

none

 

2013:

viney

 

2012:

tom mcdonald

sam blease

 

2011:

gysberts

blease

 

2010:

trengove

scully

gysberts

 

2009:

grimes

jurrah

 

2008:

wonnaemirri

garland

morton

 

2007:

petterd

jones

 

so 21 out of a possible 249, but two players twice.

 

of that lot one is our skipper, one our best chb, one our next skipper, and then a further 6 best 25 players. that's not bad to have 9 of our best 25 nominated in the 19 players nominated we've had i don't think.

 

hopefully the last 8 will play a lot of quality football for us for a long time too.

Some of those names highlight how misleading this award can be.

2 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

Some of those names highlight how misleading this award can be.

Others highlight how spot on it is as well.

3 hours ago, stevethemanjordan said:

I sure hope you're not deducing that they are at a similar level of playing ability from that..

Because they're incomparable.

Weitering is streets ahead in almost every facet of the game.

No I am not at all and I didn't imply that. I simply compared their stats for the year. 

 

12 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

Some of those names highlight how misleading this award can be.

 

9 minutes ago, PaulRB said:

Others highlight how spot on it is as well.

Is it actually possible for something to be both "misleading" and "spot on"?

Stats Comparison for Hunt, McDonald and Weitering shows McDonald is first followed by Hunt.

The award is nice. It gives young guys a pat on the back and says well done. You might not turn out to be a superstar or play 100 games but you are having an impact on the game. I bet that Oscar will be focused on training but he'd be celebrating with the parents and brother tonight on the nomination and as he should be. There are about 30 other guys who played this weekend who were eligible to get nominated and he did. 

Now they dont all turn out to be stars (or play more games) and that is fine. It's like goal of the week - its a nice little recognition, it has a ceremony at the end of the year, and the winner gets to feel good about himself. 

I cant see a way that one of our boys wins it this year, but I'm very proud that we've had 6 of the last 36 nominations and that all 6 are playing regular senior football. Because at the end of the day, that is all we really want. That all our youngsters are good enough to play best 22 for our club (and we win more than we loose). 

15 hours ago, Forest Demon said:

During the game on Saturday night, I found myself subconsciously standing up every time he got the ball.

 

Viagra will do that to you sometimes

12 hours ago, jnrmac said:

I think Oscar stacks up against Weitering very well going purely by stats. Not that stats are the be all and end all.

 

12 hours ago, Clint Bizkit said:

My guess the result will be:

1. MIlls (the academies are the biggest rort in the AFL)
2. Daniel
3. Parish
4. Petracca
5. Weitering

I think I rate Weitering higher than most here. For me he is doing things no 19 y.o key back should be doing. He is to Carlton what Jesse was to us last year but without the two years development. I would give the rising star to him. 

45 minutes ago, fndee said:

 

I think I rate Weitering higher than most here. For me he is doing things no 19 y.o key back should be doing. He is to Carlton what Jesse was to us last year but without the two years development. I would give the rising star to him. 

...and Mills is marshalling the troops in defence for a team that could be the premiers.

He's pretty impressive.

This one may go down as a super draft in years to come. Happy for us to get Oliver & Weideman in the top 10.

I'm sure this has been asked before, but do they judge RS award on which of the nominees they think has performed best over this year, or on which of them they think will be the best prospect in the years to come?

I love Jayden Hunt. There I said it.

This kid has been a revelation, one not many saw coming (from memory Redleg was a fan of his after seeing him tear it up at training last year/over preseason). Whether he gets a RS nomination or not is really irrelevant because he's going to be a damaging player for us for the next decade.

16 hours ago, PaulRB said:

My point was about this years crop being a good sign. Your point was about the 2008-2013 period (now revised to 2008-2011), and the validity of the RS nom as a talent indicator... 

I'm not really getting your point, or what you think we're "debating" here? 

 

Rising star nominations still on list C Garland, J Grimes, J Trengove, J Garlett (@ Blues), J Melksham (@ Dons), TMac, D Tyson (@ GWS), J Viney, A Brayshaw, J Hogan, C Petracca, C Oliver, J Harmes, OMac.

Aside from the first three on that list who appear to be struggling, it (the RS) seems a good pick of top 22 talent. 

If you followed Casey (who had a 100+ point win over Werribee last weekend), you will find that the first three on the list are hardly struggling and Trengrove was BOG in our record win. We just seem to have a bit of depth at present and great youth development.

Not only is this year uncannily like 1987 as far as the finals situation , but it's eerily similar in that we have a crop of young stars all coming together at the same time

9 hours ago, Akum said:

I'm sure this has been asked before, but do they judge RS award on which of the nominees they think has performed best over this year, or on which of them they think will be the best prospect in the years to come?

It's judged on how they performed this year. That's why Weitering, Petracca and Oliver will be lower down, as they have missed a decent amount of games at AFL level. 

18 hours ago, PaulRB said:

Others highlight how spot on it is as well.

It's more Gysberts and Blease winning it twice that I was referring to.

19 hours ago, Undeeterred said:

You said the fact we had lots of nominations this year meant the recruiters had been doing a good job.

He is saying we had more nominations in a period that has proven to be one of absolutely shocking recruiting.

His point therefore is that nominations do not equal good recruiting. It just means that young players have been good both times.

The difference, in my view, is that this young crop will be developed properly, whereas the 2008-2011 crop got their nominations before they were Melbournised.

So you're saying it's all about development, not recruiting?

Gysberts, for example, was a poor recruit because he wasn't a contested bull and he didn't have the right attitude. No amount of development would have made him a star, IMO.

I'm in the it takes good recruiting and development to make a good player camp.

11 hours ago, rjay said:

...and Mills is marshalling the troops in defence for a team that could be the premiers.

He's pretty impressive.

This one may go down as a super draft in years to come. Happy for us to get Oliver & Weideman in the top 10.

I think it's fair to say McVeigh is the one who marshalls the troops back there for Sydney. But I've had Mills in my supercoach team all year. He's a gun. I think Weitering is a big chance as a KPB, but given the Hogan/Cripps rivalry with Carlton last year I hope Carlton miss out again. That'd be funny.

3 hours ago, CBDees said:

If you followed Casey (who had a 100+ point win over Werribee last weekend), you will find that the first three on the list are hardly struggling and Trengrove was BOG in our record win. We just seem to have a bit of depth at present and great youth development.

There's absolutely no argument that can be mounted to say Garland, Grimes and Trengove aren't struggling. 

They're not struggling in the VFL, but are they on an AFL list to play VFL or are they there for another reason? Each time they've come up to AFL level their flaws have been painfully evident. I think it's completely fair to say they're struggling.

1 minute ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

I think it's fair to say McVeigh is the one who marshalls the troops back there for Sydney. But I've had Mills in my supercoach team all year. He's a gun. I think Weitering is a big chance as a KPB, but given the Hogan/Cripps rivalry with Carlton last year I hope Carlton miss out again. That'd be funny.

I just hope Hogan beats Weitering every time they play on each other over the next decade or so.

Purely from a generic AFL interest point of view that match-up might be the most enticing since Carey/Jakovich.