19 minutes ago, Salems Lot said:

  (This excludes Nutbean who is clearly totally in touch with his inner Nut!)

I am in touch with my inner nut...wait...what ???

Just now, nutbean said:

I am in touch with my inner nut...wait...what ???

Might want to get that checked out.

 

2 hours ago, hardtack said:

Nonsense... as has already been mentioned in this "discussion", the news that Hogan would like to remain a Demon is NOT new information at all... it was in the press on July 21 and the only difference is that GNF is claiming that he got the info from the inner sanctum:

http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/melbournes-jesse-hogan-shuts-down-dockers-advances-20160720-gqaa8f.html

None of the quotes from Hogan in that article definitively indicate he wants to stay at Melbourne. Poetic license from the journo and the subbie.

1 hour ago, nutbean said:

Hmmm... the somewhere else i have to be is my couch and watching the last game of the year 1987  - Melb vs Doggies ( no spoilers please - I dont know how it ends)

For me it ended with tears of joy.

Edited August 5, 20168 yr by ManDee

2 hours ago, hardtack said:

Nonsense... as has already been mentioned in this "discussion", the news that Hogan would like to remain a Demon is NOT new information at all... it was in the press on July 21 and the only difference is that GNF is claiming that he got the info from the inner sanctum:

http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/melbournes-jesse-hogan-shuts-down-dockers-advances-20160720-gqaa8f.html

This is a quote from Jesse from that article:

                     The 2015 AFL Rising Star is not out of contract until the end of 2017 and told Fox Sports he hopes to resolve his next contract deal within the next six months.

                     "There will be a time when I want to sign or whatever the case may be and that time could be sooner rather than later.

                     "I'm not entirely sure when the time will be but hopefully sometime over the next six months or whenever it happens to come about, I can get it done."

Clearly, what he's saying on July 21 is that he's definitely not going anywhere else, but he hasn't started talking contract with Melbourne yet.

GNF says he's now indicated he's ready to start talking. Yes, it's not a big thing, but it's still a significant step forwards in the process, which wasn't there on July 21. It's authentic because it doesn't give much, but what it does give is significant.

It wouldn't have been authentic if GNF had, for example, written anything about the terms being negotiated, because anybody in a position to know that certainly would keep it confidential. But "he's told us he's ready top start talking" is OK to put on a fan site, so his insider contact would be happy to pass it on.

And for those who have argued that the 6-month thing proves that it's not authentic - well, there it is, straight from the horse's mouth.

I know that for some people it burns that others have access to (limited) inside info that they don't. But you just gotta be adult about it and not sook.

31 minutes ago, Akum said:

This is a quote from Jesse from that article:

                     The 2015 AFL Rising Star is not out of contract until the end of 2017 and told Fox Sports he hopes to resolve his next contract deal within the next six months.

                     "There will be a time when I want to sign or whatever the case may be and that time could be sooner rather than later.

                     "I'm not entirely sure when the time will be but hopefully sometime over the next six months or whenever it happens to come about, I can get it done."

Clearly, what he's saying on July 21 is that he's definitely not going anywhere else, but he hasn't started talking contract with Melbourne yet.

GNF says he's now indicated he's ready to start talking. Yes, it's not a big thing, but it's still a significant step forwards in the process, which wasn't there on July 21. It's authentic because it doesn't give much, but what it does give is significant.

It wouldn't have been authentic if GNF had, for example, written anything about the terms being negotiated, because anybody in a position to know that certainly would keep it confidential. But "he's told us he's ready top start talking" is OK to put on a fan site, so his insider contact would be happy to pass it on.

And for those who have argued that the 6-month thing proves that it's not authentic - well, there it is, straight from the horse's mouth.

I know that for some people it burns that others have access to (limited) inside info that they don't. But you just gotta be adult about it and not sook.

" or what ever the case may be"

1 hour ago, Akum said:

This is a quote from Jesse from that article:

                     The 2015 AFL Rising Star is not out of contract until the end of 2017 and told Fox Sports he hopes to resolve his next contract deal within the next six months.

                     "There will be a time when I want to sign or whatever the case may be and that time could be sooner rather than later.

                     "I'm not entirely sure when the time will be but hopefully sometime over the next six months or whenever it happens to come about, I can get it done."

Clearly, what he's saying on July 21 is that he's definitely not going anywhere else, but he hasn't started talking contract with Melbourne yet.

GNF says he's now indicated he's ready to start talking. Yes, it's not a big thing, but it's still a significant step forwards in the process, which wasn't there on July 21. It's authentic because it doesn't give much, but what it does give is significant.

It wouldn't have been authentic if GNF had, for example, written anything about the terms being negotiated, because anybody in a position to know that certainly would keep it confidential. But "he's told us he's ready top start talking" is OK to put on a fan site, so his insider contact would be happy to pass it on.

And for those who have argued that the 6-month thing proves that it's not authentic - well, there it is, straight from the horse's mouth.

I know that for some people it burns that others have access to (limited) inside info that they don't. But you just gotta be adult about it and not sook.

His quote doesn't mention MFC at all, only his next contract. There are thousands of different ways to look at all this stuff, and we appear to get them all on here.

FWIW I'm feeling more confident now that he'll stay than I did before the season began.

2 hours ago, ManDee said:

For me it ended with tears of joy.

followed 3 weeks later with an equal an opposite amount tears of pain.! Man, what a roller coaster those couple of months were. We may never have a ride like that again. Hopefully our next big journey will just be  a  top two finish a couple of game clear of third, and then a GF win by a comfortable 60+ points. 

1 hour ago, Wells 11 said:

followed 3 weeks later with an equal an opposite amount tears of pain.! Man, what a roller coaster those couple of months were. We may never have a ride like that again. Hopefully our next big journey will just be  a  top two finish a couple of game clear of third, and then a GF win by a comfortable 60+ points. 

I was at the G' for the first 2 finals.

The best 2 days of my life, football wise.

If Jesse needed to see what improvement we made, yesterday was the definitive answer!  

I remember Roos' words a few months back:  '1 player can't win a grand final, it takes 22', when discussing contract worth.  Winning without him vs Geelong and now Hawks would bring this message home to the young man.  He now knows he is not our saviour and we can take big scalps without him. 

He may be desperately looking for a pen today!  Well, maybe not but I wouldn't be surprised if he signs up very soon on the back of yesterday's win.

I think it showed that we can be too Hogan-centric when he is there, and he needs to be treated by the group at just another link in the chain or another option to use if it presents. And he will just be one that excels more often than not when he does get used.

3 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

I think it showed that we can be too Hogan-centric when he is there, and he needs to be treated by the group at just another link in the chain or another option to use if it presents. And he will just be one that excels more often than not when he does get used.

Is the team too Hogan-centric or is Hogan too Hogan-centric? 

1 minute ago, america de cali said:

Is the team too Hogan-centric or is Hogan too Hogan-centric? 

The team.

It's great to have him as a bail-out option when going forward, but I think it has lead to laziness and just bombing it to him at times when other options are available, or should be, but other players haven't worked as hard because they know he's there or they know they'll get ignored.

Not sure why you'd be putting the blame on Hogan himself. He's not the finished article, but he's a great deal better than Pedersen.

Don't do the Scully thing where you turn the kid into a pariah ahead of time in case he leaves...

8 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

The team.

It's great to have him as a bail-out option when going forward, but I think it has lead to laziness and just bombing it to him at times when other options are available, or should be, but other players haven't worked as hard because they know he's there or they know they'll get ignored.

Not sure why you'd be putting the blame on Hogan himself. He's not the finished article, but he's a great deal better than Pedersen.

Don't do the Scully thing where you turn the kid into a pariah ahead of time in case he leaves...

 I sometimes wonder what the chemistry is between him and the playing group. Though his visible attitude has improved, his sullen and demanding moods are still there. Something does not gel with his presence on the forward line. There has been criticism of his defensive work and he doesn't bust packs like he did last season to take big contested grabs. Just content to sit passively under the ball at times. Not in injury prevention mode I hope.

Edited August 6, 20168 yr by america de cali

I think many of us including myself, expect too much of this kid. He will be a great player and hopefully for us and for a long time. He is still young and I suspect is carrying a few niggles, of course not unlike others and that may be hampering a bit. He has had a good year as far as possessions and work rate, maybe not as good as we had hoped with goals and tackles.

He has attitude, but that might be part of what makes him what he is.

I saw him play a game against Essendon VFL side 2 years ago and declared then he was the closest thing to a young Carey I had seen. That led me to expect a lot from him. Probably unrealistically.

Jesse will be a very good player and as we get better and other players have to be watched, he will get even better.

I would just like to see his signature on a long contract with us, then the rest will take care of itself. 

10 minutes ago, america de cali said:

Is the team too Hogan-centric or is Hogan too Hogan-centric? 

Can't help but think that he will mature a lot this year. 

His contemporaries (Boyd, Daniher, McCartin, Moore) are all showing signs of being great forwards and some commentators are putting a few of those guys ahead of Jesse as the 'best forward of his generation'.  Of course we know they are wrong!  Tom Lynch (GCS) just a few years older is being touted as one of the best players in the league, in contention for the Coleman and ranks top 10 in the AFLCA votes.

That these discussions are happening, that Jesse has not built on last years performance and that we have taken two big scalps (Cats 2015, Hawks 2016) without him would give him some food for thought.  It may even cross his mind that he could be dropped if he has a string of poor games...

I wonder whether winning the RS and all the hype put too much pressure on him to star every week and maybe overly fed his ego a little bit.  But his year should bring him down to earth, not with a thud but with a gentle bounce. 

He just has some growing up to do.  I think we will see a better, smarter, fitter Jesse next year.

I think he is, by necessity, being forced to play deeper than he ideally would. He's a CHF, not a FF. With the emergence of Watts, and with the continued development of Weideman, who is more of a FF, we will see the best of Jesse.

5 hours ago, Mickey said:

I think he is, by necessity, being forced to play deeper than he ideally would. He's a CHF, not a FF. With the emergence of Watts, and with the continued development of Weideman, who is more of a FF, we will see the best of Jesse.

Pretty much this. His best games are when he gets involved up the ground.

5 hours ago, Mickey said:

I think he is, by necessity, being forced to play deeper than he ideally would. He's a CHF, not a FF. With the emergence of Watts, and with the continued development of Weideman, who is more of a FF, we will see the best of Jesse.

But Leigh Matthews told me he's a stand and compete forward. Was Leigh wrong?

22 minutes ago, Chook said:

But Leigh Matthews told me he's a stand and compete forward. Was Leigh wrong?

Never...

While our forward line looks a lot better on paper with Jessie there at FF/CHF, it hasn't functioned that well over the past 10 weeks with him there. With Weideman's impressive debut and having Watts and Pederson in the forward line I wonder whether Goodwin will experiment and try Jessie in the midfield over summer. He is a similar size to Bontempelli and Fyffe and has the same smarts. imagine what impact he would have.

we don't NEED Jesse to be a good side, and i think that's the best possible thing for the club, he's an asset not a savior, i love the idea of Jesse being able to get up the ground and have an impact and have Wiederman dominating deep forward, let them play to their strengths :D 

1 hour ago, Abe said:

we don't NEED Jesse to be a good side, and i think that's the best possible thing for the club, he's an asset not a savior, i love the idea of Jesse being able to get up the ground and have an impact and have Wiederman dominating deep forward, let them play to their strengths :D 

A bit like Franklin and Hawthorn. 

So this is the Jesse Hogan who has played less than 50 games and spent a year out with a debilitating back injury right?    

3 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

So this is the Jesse Hogan who has played less than 50 games and spent a year out with a debilitating back injury right?    

Your point is? 

None of the posts have criticised Jesse.  Posters are just throwing ideas around and explaining why...isn't that what a fan forum is for?