On 28/01/2016 at 06:11, sue said:

ASADA does not have the resources and probably has better things to do than follow the detailed behaviour of all the banned players.  I'd be very surprised if they could nail anyone with half a brain.  What are they going to do - see a player running laps, corner him and ask him how he knows he should be running at just at that speed?  And if he meets his trainer at a random oval or gym somewhere, does ASADA have the resources to spot that?  Even if there is a risk of being caught, being idle for a year and then hoping to play AFL again is probably a bigger risk.

 

Sue this has been the single biggest single code violation  in WADA history. The sporting eyes were very much upon Australia. It was quite interesting to see how much so when travelling recently.  If yo think they will just walk away from this now and not keep an eye on whether said punishments are adhered to properly then you , like any club trying it on are in for a surprise.. This one goes on WADA"s mantelpiece !!

......and still no word from Moms and Dads.

  On 28/01/2016 at 06:26, Bombay Airconditioning said:

Should we have gone after Carilse too?

Ha! 

Just imagine the boards here if we'd also given up pick 7 for the other Jake. 

As it stands, we were seemingly always going after a KPF with that pick. 

Anyway, that's 9 years ago now (the Roos comment re testing players weekly/twice weekly)

I wonder what brought him to say such a thing? Would any coach say it now? 

  On 28/01/2016 at 06:47, Macca said:

Ha! 

Just imagine the boards here if we'd also given up pick 7 for the other Jake. 

As it stands, we were seemingly always going after a KPF with that pick. 

Anyway, that's 9 years ago now (the Roos comment re testing players weekly/twice weekly)

I wonder what brought him to say such a thing? Would any coach say it now? 

To be honest I didn't read the whole article, wasn't aware it was that old. 

Macca I hope the answer would be an overwhelming yes.

  On 28/01/2016 at 06:47, willmoy said:

......and still no word from Moms and Dads.

I still find this very odd

 

must be keeping their powder dry 

  On 28/01/2016 at 07:19, Bombay Airconditioning said:

To be honest I didn't read the whole article, wasn't aware it was that old. 

Macca I hope the answer would be an overwhelming yes.

And there's no better time for the coaches to make a statement than right now. 

 

  On 28/01/2016 at 07:30, Macca said:

And there's no better time for the coaches to make a statement than right now. 

 

I found that article quite damning of the league. Theyve obviously turned a blind eye to this for yonks and who knows who else was warned !!

  On 28/01/2016 at 07:34, beelzebub said:

I found that article quite damning of the league. Theyve obviously turned a blind eye to this for yonks and who knows who else was warned !!

The aftermath isn't coming as a complete surprise bub ... a few here (Sue, LH?) alluded to what might occur. 

Let's face it, the AFL is big business and they are acting like many a big business would. 

  On 28/01/2016 at 07:43, Macca said:

The aftermath isn't coming as a complete surprise bub ... a few here (Sue, LH?) alluded to what might occur. 

Let's face it, the AFL is big business and they are acting like many a big business would. 

and the public and kids under their charge be damned !!

Remember the AFL response to Dale Lewis....Former Sydney player Dale Lewis first exposed drug use in AFL in ...

  On 28/01/2016 at 09:29, bazza226 said:

Remember the AFL response to Dale Lewis....Former Sydney player Dale Lewis first exposed drug use in AFL in ...

Baz was that more party drugs than PEDs?

  On 28/01/2016 at 06:29, beelzebub said:

I dare say Sue the NRL understand things somewhat clearer than the Loopholers. They know  ( at least at the top ) that there is not only a problem  but that the public know theres a problem and want it seen to.

Contrast this to the Australian Football Laughingstock. Gill and his Dills don't concede much of any problem. What little there is  ( npi ) has been dealt with , indeed they , if you ask them ( the AFL ) help and co-operated with the relevant authority   In teh manner of the Emperor and his new clothes all is right with footy

The complacency the AFL has exhibited is just staggering, and appear to continue to think they have so much power all they need to do is to manipulate and spin any situation they come across for their own ends. 

As the biggest and most powerful sporting code in the country, they have become equivalent to many fat and lazy, and immensely powerful multi national corporations - they come to suffer from hubris. There can be no greater demonstration of this than the Essendon saga and this is at a time when their main rivals for the leisure dollar are getting stronger not weaker. 

It think I am right in saying that of the largest top 50 corporations in the world 30 years ago, less than 50% of them have that status now. Through their arrogance and complacency, and aversion to change, they eventually wither and die: or worse, become irrelevant. 

For those of us who love Australian football, this also helps explain why a number of us have spent so much time and effort on here advocating that justice be done in this saga, and why local institutions had to act appropriately. This is more than can be said for the AFL. Thank goodness for the integrity of the men and women of ASADA, WADA and CAS who inspite of immense political and media pressure stood firm and eventually delivered a just outcome. 

  On 28/01/2016 at 17:48, Dees2014 said:

The complacency the AFL has exhibited is just staggering, and appear to continue to think they have so much power all they need to do is to manipulate and spin any situation they come across for their own ends. 

As the biggest and most powerful sporting code in the country, they have become equivalent to many fat and lazy, and immensely powerful multi national corporations - they come to suffer from hubris. There can be no greater demonstration of this than the Essendon saga and this is at a time when their main rivals for the leisure dollar are getting stronger not weaker. 

It think I am right in saying that of the largest top 50 corporations in the world 30 years ago, less than 50% of them have that status now. Through their arrogance and complacency, and aversion to change, they eventually wither and die: or worse, become irrelevant. 

For those of us who love Australian football, this also helps explain why a number of us have spent so much time and effort on here advocating that justice be done in this saga, and why local institutions had to act appropriately. This is more than can be said for the AFL. Thank goodness for the integrity of the men and women of ASADA, WADA and CAS who inspite of immense political and media pressure stood firm and eventually delivered a just outcome. 

Well said Dees2014.

  On 28/01/2016 at 06:32, beelzebub said:

Sue this has been the single biggest single code violation  in WADA history. The sporting eyes were very much upon Australia. It was quite interesting to see how much so when travelling recently.  If yo think they will just walk away from this now and not keep an eye on whether said punishments are adhered to properly then you , like any club trying it on are in for a surprise.. This one goes on WADA"s mantelpiece !!

Bold statement, bb. What parameter are you using? The number (34) of players? Or something else? What about the Russian athletics team? Isn't that a WADA code violation? I would have thought banning a whole team from competing at the Olympics might be perceived to be a bit bigger.

  On 28/01/2016 at 21:50, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Bold statement, bb. What parameter are you using? The number (34) of players? Or something else? What about the Russian athletics team? Isn't that a WADA code violation? I would have thought banning a whole team from competing at the Olympics might be perceived to be a bit bigger.

Reread

Largest single code . 

The Russian Athletics was across a number of sports effectively. The EFC debacle is the largest number of players in a single code at a time.

I see your thinking however. 

  On 28/01/2016 at 22:10, beelzebub said:

Reread

Largest single code . 

The Russian Athletics was across a number of sports effectively. The EFC debacle is the largest number of players in a single code at a time.

I see your thinking however. 

Oh. I read "single code" as adjectives qualifying "violation". (Not that I've watched much of it, but "code violation" seems to be a term used a lot at the tennis which may have influence my thinking). Now I know what you mean.

  On 28/01/2016 at 23:39, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Oh. I read "single code" as adjectives qualifying "violation". (Not that I've watched much of it, but "code violation" seems to be a term used a lot at the tennis which may have influence my thinking). Now I know what you mean.

Both interesting transgressions for WADA to deal with. 

Just as interesting in a way how the recipients took it.

  On 28/01/2016 at 10:37, Cards13 said:

Baz was that more party drugs than PEDs?

What are party drugs? They are all drugs. And mostly illegal.

Ben Cousins was supposedly on 'party drugs' as you put it and he would have run through a brick wall. You can't tell me they are not performance enhancing.

 

  On 28/01/2016 at 17:48, Dees2014 said:

The complacency the AFL has exhibited is just staggering, and appear to continue to think they have so much power all they need to do is to manipulate and spin any situation they come across for their own ends. 

As the biggest and most powerful sporting code in the country, they have become equivalent to many fat and lazy, and immensely powerful multi national corporations - they come to suffer from hubris. There can be no greater demonstration of this than the Essendon saga and this is at a time when their main rivals for the leisure dollar are getting stronger not weaker. 

It think I am right in saying that of the largest top 50 corporations in the world 30 years ago, less than 50% of them have that status now. Through their arrogance and complacency, and aversion to change, they eventually wither and die: or worse, become irrelevant. 

For those of us who love Australian football, this also helps explain why a number of us have spent so much time and effort on here advocating that justice be done in this saga, and why local institutions had to act appropriately. This is more than can be said for the AFL. Thank goodness for the integrity of the men and women of ASADA, WADA and CAS who inspite of immense political and media pressure stood firm and eventually delivered a just outcome. 

	TOP 24 COMPANIES IN AUSTRALIA
	1990			2016
	Company	Mkt Cap ($Bn)	Company	Mkt Cap ($Bn)
1	BHP	14.1	CBA	133
2	CRA	7.3	Westpac	102
3	BTR Nylex	6.9	NAB	71.4
4	NAB	6.0	ANZ	69.9
5	Westpac	5.2	Telstra	68.3
6	Elders	4.9	CSL	49.8
7	ANZ	4.8	BHP	48.4
8	Coles Myer	4.5	Wesfarmers	47.1
9	Fletcher Challenge	4.4	Woolworths	31.1
10	News Corp	4.2	Macquarie	24.9
11	CSR	4.1	Scentre Group	23.1
12	Western Mining	4.0	Transurban	21.8
13	Pacific Dunlop	3.9	Westfield	18.8
14	Brambles	3.2	Woodside	18.6
15	Boral	3.1	Brambles	17.5
16	Brierley Investments	3.0	Rio Tinto	16.5
17	Lend Lease	2.6	AMP	15.7
18	Amcor	2.4	Amcor	15.2
19	Comalco	2.3	Sydney Airport	14.7
20	Adsteam	2.3	Suncorp	14.7
21	Woodside	1.8	QBE	14.5
22	Pioneer Concrete	1.7	IAG Insurance	12.5
23	TNT	1.7	AGL	12.3
24	Goodman Fielder	1.7	Newcrest Mining	10.6

 

Here is a snapshot of corporate Australia from 1990 to now. Fair to say a number of entities have disappeared off the radar screen......not all hubris and lots of takeovers but interesting nonetheless......

  On 29/01/2016 at 00:24, jnrmac said:

What are party drugs? They are all drugs. And mostly illegal.

Ben Cousins was supposedly on 'party drugs' as you put it and he would have run through a brick wall. You can't tell me they are not performance enhancing.

 

Many of those 'party drugs' are counted as performance enhancing but the issue with tested for them is that it only lasts in your system for a day or two so the window to catch people is slim. Given the little amount of testing that is done in the AFL it is no wonder people get away with it. 

  On 29/01/2016 at 00:24, jnrmac said:

What are party drugs? They are all drugs. And mostly illegal.

Ben Cousins was supposedly on 'party drugs' as you put it and he would have run through a brick wall. You can't tell me they are not performance enhancing.

 

I think you are being facetious jnr. I was trying to clarify my recollection of Lewis comments which I believe related to players getting on the gear and when on nights out. Rather than him flagging a trend for players getting into PEDs to enhance performance.

I can't imagine playing on Cousins fav, or any other party drugs and it enhancing performance but I could very well be wrong as I've not really tried them.   

I used to watch Cousins and his incredible intensity and just assumed he had a good mental game. But it could have been stimulants.

Amphetamines = stimulants. For players who need a bit of a gee-up. Marijuana = depressant. For players who get too keyed up before a game and waste energy.

Party drugs can most definitely enhance performance.

  On 29/01/2016 at 01:30, Ted Fidge said:

I used to watch Cousins and his incredible intensity and just assumed he had a good mental game. But it could have been stimulants.

Amphetamines = stimulants. For players who need a bit of a gee-up. Marijuana = depressant. For players who get too keyed up before a game and waste energy.

Party drugs can most definitely enhance performance.

of course they can. only need to ask a medic in a hospital when ice addicts come in and it takes 5 people to subdue them. soldiers have been taking amphetamines for ages.

  On 28/01/2016 at 07:43, Macca said:

 

Let's face it, the AFL is big business and they are acting like many a big business would. 

 

Great read here from the UK's Simon Barnes about how the almighty dollar, corruption, and doping are threatening to undermine the essence of sport.

  Quote

 

"Adidas sponsors the kit of Manchester United in a deal worth £75 million a year. This month Herbert Hainer, the Adidas CEO, dropped a careful hint to Süddeutsche Zeitung that Manchester United’s current style of play did not meet their approval. ‘We are satisfied but the actual way of playing is not exactly what we want it to be.’

In other words, the team’s current cautious style — which has them fifth in the Premier League despite last Saturday’s defeat — doesn’t help Adidas to make money. Message: if you want the contract renewed after 2025, play sexy football."

 

 

  On 29/01/2016 at 01:38, daisycutter said:

of course they can. only need to ask a medic in a hospital when ice addicts come in and it takes 5 people to subdue them. soldiers have been taking amphetamines for ages.

DC taking 5 people to bring down an ice head and that person going out to play high level sport... I just can't correlate it.