On 12/1/2015 at 7:00 PM, Peter Griffen said:

this time last year he was sprinting and kicking because he had to try and pass a medical at Richmond, and the crows wanted one as well, this year we've locked him in and are in no rush, i'd rather see him not play til mid year and make it back then us take any risks with Jack, he's way to good to risk it.

He won't be risked and he won't be played with us, until he is fully fit and can show consistent form with Casey.

2 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

I am not including JT in our best 22. If he did get back to fitness, his availability in 2017 would push MFC midfield into one of best in the league.

Steady on.

 

We were 18th in the midfield this year. That would be a leap of ridiculous proportions.

I am absolutely certain he will get a game when and if he is ready and wins a spot, and not until then.  If it takes a month, two, four, six or twelve then so be it.

If / when this happens it will be a huge bonus and a huge day for us all.

2 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Steady on.

 

We were 18th in the midfield this year. That would be a leap of ridiculous proportions.

jones
vince
viney
trengove
tyson
vandenberg
salem
brayshaw
petracca
oliver

enough to have some confidence in, surely

8 hours ago, Curry & Beer said:

jones
vince
viney
trengove
tyson
vandenberg
salem
brayshaw
petracca
oliver

enough to have some confidence in, surely

There is a large leap from "some confidence" to "one of the best in the league".

 

10 hours ago, Curry & Beer said:

jones
vince
viney
trengove
tyson
vandenberg
salem
brayshaw
petracca
oliver

enough to have some confidence in, surely

 

Vince and vandenBerg aside, all first rounders.

It's only fitness holding Trengove back. Some people seem to have forgotten that he was a bloody good footballer, a natural fooballer too.

 

Viney would've been a first rounder despite (technically) being a second round father son pick.

 

If Jones and Vince are not A-Graders they aren't far off.

I think Viney will be A-Grade next year, his improvement has been consistent for 3 years and I expect him to go another level, he looks so determined.

Tyson had a great first year (for the Dees) but stagnated last year due to injury, not sure how high his ceiling is.  

Brayshaw and Salem are just about the most impressive 1st & 2nd players I've seen at the club in the past 15 years.  

Nobody can know if Trengove will get back to his best, i'm an optimist with him.  I hope he can come back to something near the best he showed in his first couple of years.

Vandenberg will be a solid contributor, I think his hardness gets the opposition nervous and gives our guys a lift.  

Petracca and Oliver are pure potential but the noises out of the club, particularly around Petracca, have me very bullish.  

Curry & Beer left out a few others that look pretty handy; ANB, Stretch, Bugg and Harmes who at the least appear servicable.  

 

If I was to crystal ball it, i'd guess that at least 2 of Viney, Brayshaw, Salem and Petracca will go a level from B+ to A+ (A+ being "Star" of the game)

Vince, Jones will remain solid B+ players, age being the issue for them now, Tyson, Vandenberg and Bugg potentially match them at some stage.

Question marks remain with Trengove, Oliver, ANB, Stretch and Harmes.  

The critical things they all bring are competitiveness and hardness.  This is something we haven't seen for a number of years. 

 

I'm bloody excited to be honest.

10 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said:

Viney would've been a first rounder despite (technically) being a second round father son pick.

 

Pick 7 was bid on Viney, so he most certainly qualifies as a top 10 talent.

I'm black or white with Trengove*.  His first 2 years were terrific.  I love Brayshaw, but the facts are Trengove had a better debut season while being nearly 9 months younger.  And he's never had brilliant coaching or development.

The only reason Trengove became a hack was his body.  If his body gets back to 100% he can develop into an A-grader.  If not he's finished.  I don't see any in between.  

 

 

 

 

*I also didn't like how he was coached under Neeld.  He stopped hunting the footy and was just led around at stoppages by the player he was shadowing.

2 hours ago, nutbean said:

There is a large leap from "some confidence" to "one of the best in the league".

 

Maybe not so much - the best midfields are made of stars and I am confident we have a few in development

25 minutes ago, Curry & Beer said:

Maybe not so much - the best midfields are made of stars and I am confident we have a few in development

Haven't we played this record a few times before ? I believe we have never been better placed with the coaches and structures we have to maximise all the ability in these youngsters however potential means nothing if you don't do anything with it and at this stage we have an abundance of potential.

  

30 minutes ago, nutbean said:

Haven't we played this record a few times before ? I believe we have never been better placed with the coaches and structures we have to maximise all the ability in these youngsters however potential means nothing if you don't do anything with it and at this stage we have an abundance of potential.

  

I get where you are coming from 'nut', trying to hose it down...but in your private moments even you must be excited with this group. All competitors who hunt the ball and love the contest, a bit different from the past.

35 minutes ago, nutbean said:

Haven't we played this record a few times before ?

  

we certainly have

1 hour ago, ProDee said:

*I also didn't like how he was coached under Neeld.  He stopped hunting the footy and was just led around at stoppages by the player he was shadowing.

I had dinner with an assistant coach from another club who said exactly the same thing.  Under Bailey he was a pure mid, hunt the footy and create play.  Under Neeld he played high half forward which is a position that didn't suit him.  He said he wasn't fast enough to play any sort of outside role and was a pure inside mid. 

I'm a huge fan of Trengove as a person but was never as keen as some on his footy as it seemed to me that he was a tall in a small body.  His major highlights were contested marks and whilst he got the ball a bit he didn't seem to be all that damaging to me.  Perhaps time has dulled my memory but he strikes me as being a solid accumulator.

I also disagree with your view that Trengove had a better first couple of years than Brayshaw.  Perhaps in possessions he did but Brayshaw to me has as much footy smarts as any first year player I've seen.  He knows where players are, he invariably takes the best options and he works so hard off the ball.  15 Brayshaw possessions are as good as 25 from most others.  I must confess to being a little underwhelmed by Brayshaw initially but as the season went on he just showed so much and was so clever.  I think Brayshaw will be elite whereas if Trengove gets back he will be an accumulator who ends up with 25 possies a game that you don't much notice.

 

48 minutes ago, Baghdad Bob said:

I had dinner with an assistant coach from another club who said exactly the same thing.  Under Bailey he was a pure mid, hunt the footy and create play.  Under Neeld he played high half forward which is a position that didn't suit him.  He said he wasn't fast enough to play any sort of outside role and was a pure inside mid. 

I'm a huge fan of Trengove as a person but was never as keen as some on his footy as it seemed to me that he was a tall in a small body.  His major highlights were contested marks and whilst he got the ball a bit he didn't seem to be all that damaging to me.  Perhaps time has dulled my memory but he strikes me as being a solid accumulator.

I also disagree with your view that Trengove had a better first couple of years than Brayshaw.  Perhaps in possessions he did but Brayshaw to me has as much footy smarts as any first year player I've seen.  He knows where players are, he invariably takes the best options and he works so hard off the ball.  15 Brayshaw possessions are as good as 25 from most others.  I must confess to being a little underwhelmed by Brayshaw initially but as the season went on he just showed so much and was so clever.  I think Brayshaw will be elite whereas if Trengove gets back he will be an accumulator who ends up with 25 possies a game that you don't much notice.

 

I agree that Brayshaw has a better footy IQ and makes better decisions.  I reckon Brayshaw will become a brilliant midfielder.

That said, Trengove was also strong, brave and had good skills for a teenager.  Trengove has missed tonnes of development and I remain confident he has the potential to be A-grade if his body allows.  We've never seen anything like his best footy.

Hope you're right.

As funny as this sounds, Brayshaws first year was in a better team.

12 minutes ago, Gorgoroth said:

As funny as this sounds, Brayshaws first year was in a better team.

My thoughts exactly.

Not sure what it means though.  Does that mean he had a better or worse year than Trenners'?

 

I'm not that into comparing debut seasons between players. But if you ask me about Trengove's first year with us, it was pretty impressive IMO from what I can recall. We knew here we had a good'un. Form since through injury or whatever over time IMO may have clouded some views. 

Not at all sure if he can get back, but I'd welcome it with open arms.

10 minutes ago, AzzKikA said:

My thoughts exactly.

Not sure what it means though.  Does that mean he had a better or worse year than Trenners'?

 

I'd say different.

trenners had to become one of our inside mids and one of the better ones straight away.

Brayshaw had no expectations.

So we probably thought more of what he did cos he wasn't expected to lift the club by himself. Trenners did not have that luxury, we needed him and Scully to become our best players from day one.

28 minutes ago, Gorgoroth said:

As funny as this sounds, Brayshaws first year was in a better team.

It is funny because based in wins alone, it's factually incorrect.

We also had two AA players in Trenners first year and belted Sydney with some very exciting footy.

 

19 minutes ago, McQueen said:

It is funny because based in wins alone, it's factually incorrect.

We also had two AA players in Trenners first year and belted Sydney with some very exciting footy.

 

also had a draw and 1pt loss to the eventual premiers

It's funny because all of that is true, but I would pick this years team over that one any day of the week.

would be great to see JT back next year,  we'll have to be patient though.  

he hasnt played a game for 2 years and is coming off a zero base.  hopefully he will be right for casey in round one.  play a couple of months and not get any soft tissue injuries and be vying for a spot for the Dees by mid year

Id be staggered (and elated) to see him in the AFL before round 10