I just meant 'not be the sub'...

And, 'first selected'? He would be down the list quite a bit...

He'd be one of Clint's first selected.

(And mine...mancrush confirmed)

I know that, and what I'm saying to you is that if you think Dawes and Frost are miles apart in their ability to ruck, then we differ in our opinion. Dawes isn't a great second ruck, granted, but neither is Frost on current evidence.

Frost doesn't deserve to go, but someone has to, and on reflection dropping either of JKH or Kent is robbing the side of much needed speed and skill on the outside which made a difference on Saturday.

The problem is, as TDI/Saty will attest, they have done some ruck work at training with Frost - they haven't done it with Dawes.

Jamar/Frost looks to be the preferred pairing until Gawn knocks down the door...

I know it is only 20 mins a game but it is tough to throw someone a role they haven't been prepared for, and for the mids to be given a ruck they haven't worked with.

Fair call.

Well, I'm stuffed if I know what they're gonna do to squeeze him in. Dawes will want to play well cause whoever he replaces will be stiff.

It is a tough one 'P-man', but I do think Frost is a fair way ahead of Dawes in the ruck. He didn't win a lot but he did nullify and where he is streets ahead is in the pressure he puts on when the ball hits the ground. His blocking and tackling were a real asset, he lands on his feet and is so agile.

I wouldn't want to see us go in unbalanced with too many talls but Frost, Watts and Hogan are pretty agile, Frost is also very quick. That may balance things out with Dawes. It's going to be an interesting selection and game this week.

I am really glad he says it but same old same old to me.

Not happy with Roos?

Is he telling porkies old dee? Why would he do that?

He'd be one of Clint's first selected.

(And mine...mancrush confirmed)

Get on board the vandenFyfe bandwagon.

Too soon?

Not happy with Roos?

Is he telling porkies old dee? Why would he do that?

Not suggesting he is Macca.

And in the end I am sure his opinion holds more weight than mine.

I just don't see an AFL player at this point.

I have not seen anything in the four games this year that suggests he should have a position in next weekends game.

Get on board the vandenFyfe bandwagon.

Too soon?

Just a tad. A few more weeks and I'm there, although I think I might prefer "Oxenberg".

But it's certainly ahead of "Petraccattack".

Are there any example of a big second ruck type playing back when not in the ruck?

I'd prefer not to have Hogan, Dawes, Watts/Vandenberg AND Frost in the forward line at the expense of a crummer (Garlett, Kent, JKH)...

So can we slot Frost down back, where he trained all pre-season, with cameos in the ruck?

Interesting idea. The Back 6 was traditionally a settled and predictable unit but that is less and less relevant these days. I am still yet to see why everyone is so convinced by Frost's Ruck or Forward prowess, he is significantly undersized and will get beat up as a Ruck and he does not appear to have the physicality or goal sense of a Forward. If he is going to offer anything I think it will be in Defence which may be the club's plan long term anyway.

this thread has gone in circles of repetition for about 200 posts and it's only Tuesday

Not suggesting he is Macca.

And in the end I am sure his opinion holds more weight than mine.

I just don't see an AFL player at this point.

I have not seen anything in the four games this year that suggests he should have a position in next weekends game.

For what it's worth, I have him out for Vince but that is not the point I'm making. What the selectors actually do is anyone's guess.

Too many here want to drop a player in a hasty/lashing out way when in reality, it never actually happens that way at any level of sport. Well, it shouldn't happen that way. Dropping a player should always become a mechanism for improving a player.

Dropping a player should not be specifically designed to punish - that stuff rarely, if ever, works.

3 practice games (which Roos used for specific purposes) and 27 minutes last Saturday is nowhere near enough of a sample size.

For what it's worth, I have him out for Vince but that is not the point I'm making. What the selectors actually do is anyone's guess.

Too many here want to drop a player in a hasty/lashing out way when in reality, it never actually happens that way at any level of sport. Well, it shouldn't happen that way. Dropping a player should always become a mechanism for improving a player.

Dropping a player should not be specifically designed to punish - that stuff rarely, if ever, works.

3 practice games (which Roos used for specific purposes) and 27 minutes last Saturday is nowhere near enough of a sample size.

I think it is at this point.

but only my opinion time will tell I guess

On the AFL website, Adam Curley, in his match preview, is predicting a 29 point win to GWS next week. We are starting as the underdogs against the expansion teams of superstars for consecutive weeks. Bring it on!

Unless he cops a training injury Dawes is a lock to be selected this week. Not so sure about Vince. Just think that he had a interrupted pre season with that shoulder op and they might decide to give him another game at Casey and two more weeks on the track and get him cherry ripe for round three.

I would like them to stick with the Toump. In fact i'd like them to start him on the ground and make Brayshaw the sub. I admit he didn't seize the day on sat but had limited time on the ground. I know Viney played great but for some perspective made 6 clangers, a game high by a mile (across both teams) and both Jones and Watts made a couple of howlers.

Given that i'd drop Frost, albeit acknowledging he'd be stiff.

Have to look at a players contribution over 4 Q in making selection decisions rather than cast them out based on one or two mistakes. Need to select the best team for next week. For me, the best team has Dawes in it.

The sooner we get Hogan, Watts and Dawes playing together the better. I expect that it will take time for these 3 guys to get their act together. W

I think it is at this point.

but only my opinion time will tell I guess

If Dawes and Vince weren't available, would you drop Toumpas?

If so, who comes in?

I feel like that kick hasn't got the love it deserves. It was Hawthorn-like.

It was so I Melbourne like it wasn't funny. I reckon it was my highlight of the game.

I say leave the side as it is.

If Dawes and Vince weren't available, would you drop Toumpas?

If so, who comes in?

I'd genuinely consider dropping him for Bail, Matt Jones or even Billy Stretch.

Because it's damn hard to play your way in to the side from the sub role and that's all he'd be, he's clearly 22nd picked from the side that ran out on Saturday.

changes for round 2

losing team 1 replaced with losing team 2

Will be interesting to see how Roos & Stafford et al counter Mumford. Didn't he give Jamar a spanking last year?

If that happens again, we'll need a Plan B. And whether that involves Frost or not is also tricky. Maybe Mummy knows what Frost will be like as an opponent; maybe he doesn't.

Edited April 7, 201510 yr by Akum

I'd genuinely consider dropping him for Bail, Matt Jones or even Billy Stretch.

Because it's damn hard to play your way in to the side from the sub role and that's all he'd be, he's clearly 22nd picked from the side that ran out on Saturday.

I wouldn't and I highly doubt whether Roos would either

old dee ... do you need some names?

Fitzy? Terlich? McKenzie? Grimes?

Edit: Grimes is one player who I'd like to see work his way back into the seniors

Edited April 7, 201510 yr by Macca

Will be interesting to see how Roos & Stafford et al counter Mumford. Didn't he give Jamar a spanking last year?

If that happens again, we'll need a Plan B. And whether that involves Frost or not is also tricky. Maybe Mummy knows what Frost will be like as an opponent; maybe he doesn't.

Therein lies the problem. Jamar cannot ruck all day and Mummy will be just too strong for Frost!

If Dawes and Vince weren't available, would you drop Toumpas?

If so, who comes in?

Michie.

Michie.

Fair enough ... again, I highly doubt Roos would.

Seriously think the people saying if Dawes comes in we are too tall are delusional.

Too tall means too many big slow immobile dinosaurs, who will get run away from. There is absolutely nothing immobile about our big blokes. Dawes is known as one of the hardest running KPF's out there. Hogan and frost both move bloody well as well. VDB and Watts as mobile midsize with garlett and kent/jkh making up the fwd mix is a good combo of size, speed footy smarts and will have any slightly underdone backs absolutely [censored] themselves at the thought of it, with the improved midfield able to give it to advantage

I agree with this. You can afford to be tall particularly with 3 or even 4 if you put 2 genuine smalls nipping at their heels. Previous we have played tall and not had natural small forwards in the other positions. This is even more the case with the defensive work rate of the talls and the mobility of Watts and Vanders. If I was a selector it would be Toumpas and Brayshaw for Vince and Dawes. Kent's role on Malceski was excellent and JKH I expect to sub.

I wouldn't and I highly doubt whether Roos would either

old dee ... do you need some names?

Fitzy? Terlich? Mckenzie? Grimes?

Injury only list players Macca.

We have had 3 -4 years of watching them.

They are VFL level Talents.