All I'm saying is I'd rather keep watts then go to the draft with a mid range 2nd round pick, god knows what will get with that. The kids 23, played in one of the worst sides in the history of the game over his career. His 3 or 4 years off his prime football..

I don't know if I'll be able to keep my sanity if I have to watch Jack Watts for another 3 or 4 years before he becomes a reasonable player.

Someone will have to be tasked with keeping the sharps away from me!

thanx for the welcome, Im sort of defending him, but I will be [censored] of if we trade him, and he flourishes with another team off our hardwork in training him and we are left with some dud who takes another 4-5 years to come good. I think he will cop a real flogging come preseason I hope!

Thanks for writing an insightful post and backing it up with some key points/stats.

I just don't think he has it in him to become a great player. You can [censored] him all you like, you can build his arms/torso up as much as you like. You can give him as much time as you like to become good but if you are not born/raised with the mentality that you want to tackle people and take the game on you never will learn that no matter how many floggings you get.

on a totally side note, I was watching the pre game drills and tom McDonald doing 40 - 50m pinpoint accuracy bullet passes, yet in match time he looks like he really struggles with his kicking?

He hit a couple nice passes during the game I thought. Couldn't remember to many shanks. I have faith he will get better.

start again, Jack full forward

I hate it when you're right and I'm a dill.

I presumed, yes I know, I must be getting dull.

has been a long season ManDee...the shine well and truly worn off !!

Ouch. Feel free to create threadspolls about the others. Some ive actuaaly suggested as trades in other threads. This ones about Jack . Cheers

Trade

Easy decision

Interesting that only 15% think he is a definite keep

Looked more like 41% later in the day old dee.

Looked more like 41% later in the day old dee.

Looks like all his family got on later in the day BM.

Jokes aside I was surprised at 15% but it was very early in the poll I guess.

100% keep.

Easy decision.

We should be judging Watts as if he was just another recruit. The no.1 pick next to his name can and does cloud people's thinking.

So ... imagine there was no draft and he came from a zone or an academy and he was tied to the club. Would you persevere with him or trade him? Would other clubs see any value in him right now?

I'd give Jack 1 more year to prove himself. Maybe 2 years. He has some "nice" skills but playing footy requires a lot more than that. Roos might try and make him into a player or he might trade him. Our problems run much deeper than Jack Watts though. Up to half our list have question marks against their name.

Just on the draft ...

When assessing a 17 year old, how can one measure drive and ambition? Leadership skills? Raw courage? Ability under real AFL like pressure? A winning mentality? A never say die attitude? Beep tests and other "athletic" type tests will only tell you so much.

Selwood should have been a lock at no.1 if the above qualities were taken into account. He went at no.7.

100% keep.

Easy decision.

Obviously a fan RB

Cannot say I share your unbounded enthusiasm

100% keep.

Easy decision.

An easy decision indeed Ron. In a present team lacking in real skill we can ill afford to trade Jack of all people. It would be sickening if he went to top side and absolutely killed us with his reading of the play and pin point kicking. His tackling count is rising too so he is improving his defensive skills which is what many of us want to happen.

There seems to be an unhealthy amount of Jack Watts discussions on these boards...

Personally i wouldn't trade him because he's one of the few players we have, that has AFL level skills...

Also I'd say a stronger club wants him and are using the media to push their agenda...

He couldn't tackle a 3 year old mouse.

http://www.afl.com.au/video/2014-08-17/watts-shows-his-class

This video highlights Watts' entire career in the first 15 seconds.

Absolutely abysmal attempt to mark. Didn't put himself between Mumford and the ball at all, neither did he have the skill to launch over Mummy for the mark. All that said the ball still got to his hands and he still couldn't mark it. More than likely to his eyes off the ball when Mumford comes across him.

Luckily when the ball hits the deck Jamar cleans it up and wins the hard ball. Watts then evades Patton well and kicks a beautiful snap. A play that not everyone in our team can make.

And there in lies the problem. Whilst he'll always be good at kicking the nice snap goal he's been on the list for 6 years and hasn't shown any improvement with doing physical things like standing under a high ball with a ruckman bearing down and taking the mark.

Most impressive bit about that clip was Gawns quick turn of speed.

Has to be our number 1 ruckman next year.

Further to what I said earlier:

People have commented this season that Watts has changed as a player and is on the way up. He had a couple of impressive games early in the year but truth be told, he has hardly improved. This seems to be his consistent pattern, like many before him.

Agree. Someone suggest how many games this year he was in the best 3 or even 5 players!

I have balanced between Yeah and Neigh!

I think

He is one of the very very few on our list who can...

KICK

MARK

HANDBALL

HARDLY WASTE A POSESSION

So on that he STAYS!

FWIW I think more than a few on this site might be Westgate Bridge bound at midnight if he goes somewhere else and plays the type of footy which I know he can play!

I see him eventually as a cross between a better mans Kochitzke , poor mans Riewoldt and a very handy Brendan Goddard type

Most impressive bit about that clip was Gawns quick turn of speed.

Has to be our number 1 ruckman next year.

Gawn looks terribly awkward, but he's always had ticker and gets my support. More like him please.

He has had three coaches try different things to extract his competitive spirit.

Three coaches and we are still trying to find his position.

IMO we've gone past trying to find a position for him to where can we hide Jack Watts.

Where can we hide him so his deficiency isn't so glaring and we can use his skills.

Yes he is an outside player but outside players need to win contests too.

Too often, 50-50, even 70-30 contest, Watts just can't win them.

Watts tackles but he never has any momentum in tackles.

He does what some big kids do in u10's.

bigger kids in u10's tend to stop and then wrap their arms around so they won't hurt the opposition.

This is the big leagues Jack, tackle with some intent.

Tackle to hurt?

Jack too nice for that.

start again, Jack full forward

need to be able to take a contested mark for that possie

We should be judging Watts as if he was just another recruit. The no.1 pick next to his name can and does cloud people's thinking.

So ... imagine there was no draft and he came from a zone......

Quite right Macca. And you went on to support keeping Watts for 1-2 years more. My contention is that Watts has played every game this year when others have come and gone, some multiple times (M Jones, Gawn, JKH etc.). Why hasn't Watts been treated the same way? I want the FD to stop treating him like a protected species, and he might just start playing like its survival of the fittest.

As at now, he's not showing me that he can step up and earn his spot on merit alone rather than on some fantasised potential. Lets all just forget what pick number he was!

Colac south and Terang have shown interest,But they want a cardio stress test before looking any further.

I reckon the CDFL would be too rough unless he played for the Bay who are bit soft.

need to be able to take a contested mark for that possie

you're right, i just thumped my forehead for you, i was dreaming. Trade him for Barry Hall he looks even better now than when he was playing, make him co captain, anyone not giving 100% can explain why not to Baz in a special sound proof room

Quite right Macca. And you went on to support keeping Watts for 1-2 years more. My contention is that Watts has played every game this year when others have come and gone, some multiple times (M Jones, Gawn, JKH etc.). Why hasn't Watts been treated the same way? I want the FD to stop treating him like a protected species, and he might just start playing like its survival of the fittest.

As at now, he's not showing me that he can step up and earn his spot on merit alone rather than on some fantasised potential. Lets all just forget what pick number he was!

My main reason for wanting to keep Watts is I believe that Roos may be able to turn him into a footballer.

Also, I'm not sure he has a great deal of currency and if we could only get (at best) an early 2nd round draft pick for him, that pick could be a complete bust (unless we traded that pick for a Vince type but again, there's still a fair bit of luck involved with that sort of deal)

The end result could be that Jack might play 100+ games for another club whilst we could end up with another player we might have to delist after 2 years.

I don't place a lot of faith in the draft and let's face it, in previous years, we would have probably had more success if we'd drawn a number out of a hat. I'm being entirely serious.

I can fully understand the angst with Jack but there's plenty who I'd let go before him. Those with currency who aren't getting much better would be better options to trade (that's apart from any straight delistments)

Jack has more upside than most but whether we'll ever see that upside is debatable. I'd persevere for now but he'd want to be playing a lot better by the time he's 25 years old. I still reckon he's best suited across the half back line (with an instruction to kick the ball to position when he gets it)