On 22/08/2014 at 12:59, AdamFarr said:

It's pretty rich from a club who still gets a free rid from the AFL. Pay no attention to it though. He's another that simply doesn't understand the rules. He's used the word 'deserve'.

Makes me despair, all of this. I just see no way out of it. The odds are so heavily stacked against us. I've waited 50 years to see a premiership. Barring our stumbling across a freak like Ablett, I can't see us ever winning one. I'm not greedy. Just one, so I could know what it felt like.

  On 22/08/2014 at 13:08, Jara said:

Makes me despair, all of this. I just see no way out of it. The odds are so heavily stacked against us. I've waited 50 years to see a premiership. Barring our stumbling across a freak like Ablett, I can't see us ever winning one. I'm not greedy. Just one, so I could know what it felt like.

Unfortunately, we have to put our faith in those who are in charge at the club currently. I won't deny though that my love for the code is dwindling. Given I've missed one game in Melbourne in the past decade, if I'm feeling this way, I'm sure there are many, many others out there. Our perpetual insipidness is driving me away from the game. I'd much prefer to watch Liverpool and any neutral English Premier League game than I would, a neutral game of AFL.

  On 22/08/2014 at 08:37, Wunders said:

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-08-22/demons-dont-deserve-a-priority-pick

GWS - "We would say that Melbourne doesn't deserve another pick, because then where does it stop?"

I think this quote says it all.. Imagine all the priority pics being handed out in the next few years because of us getting one.. Wait no other club has got a record like ours, they may in 5-6 years if they keep loosing.

I think it would've been more rationale to argue this: "where does it start?, Melbourne has been on the bottom for __ years and if anyone deserves one they do. If they don't get one then i can't realistically see anyone else ever getting one!"

We will say nothing though and just cop it on the chin- the Melbourne way- weak on field, weak off it. God I wish McChins was an MFC supporter, at annoying as the chubster is for all his bite Collingwood are a powerhouse.

Has anyone even heard PJ speak? seems to have the same presence as McClardy

  On 22/08/2014 at 09:43, Toorak said:

Is the draft effective? David King made the point during the week,..eg. St Kilda. Gets pick 1, Swans pick 18, St Kilda pick 19, Swans pick 36, St Kilda pick 37............St Kilda effectively get one pick more than the Swans. It's going to take some time for bottom teams to climb the ladder.

Very good point

Where is the bleating in the media about Carlton??

4 PPs in 10 yrs, 3 number 1 draft picks, highly paid premiership coach, belted by over 100 points and still a shiite footy team. What a soft ride they get. They have had a lot more benefits than us from the AFL.

Yeah but we are the basket case that should merge or relocated blah blah blah.....FMD

As was pointed out, without PP's bottom teams effectively only get one extra early pick which is no guarantee the player will be any better than one taken at 20. Couple that with the manipulated draws and timeslots, FA, etc and it is clear the AFL is facing a fork in the road with the EPL model on one fork.

Sadly it is also clear that the AFL heavies and top clubs are comfortable with the EPL model. The financial wheeling and dealing and associated big salaries and strutting about on the stage is just as attractive to AFL heavies with an EPL as it is with an equitable competition, possibly more so since the money is more concentrated.

The question for many of us is do we follow our Division 2 teams or just take up another sport.

  On 22/08/2014 at 22:11, sue said:

As was pointed out, without PP's bottom teams effectively only get one extra early pick which is no guarantee the player will be any better than one taken at 20. Couple that with the manipulated draws and timeslots, FA, etc and it is clear the AFL is facing a fork in the road with the EPL model on one fork.

Sadly it is also clear that the AFL heavies and top clubs are comfortable with the EPL model. The financial wheeling and dealing and associated big salaries and strutting about on the stage is just as attractive to AFL heavies with an EPL as it is with an equitable competition, possibly more so since the money is more concentrated.

The question for many of us is do we follow our Division 2 teams or just take up another sport.

One of the big appeals of the NFL is the drive for parity and the way all clubs are treated on an equal playing field. As an example they have private owners who profit from their teams yet still sign up to pool most of their revenue. They also have a schedule which is fixed over a period of years and due to the division/conference structure you are competing for a playoff spot with teams who have had an almost identical schedule to your own.

The NFL is the model we should be working towards however the AFL is influenced too heavily by partisan interests and therefore employs some token equalisation measures whilemail failing to address the underlying structures and policies which create the disparity in the first place meaning we are more likely to end up an EPL style league rather than NFL.

The people on this site keep blaming our club culture and our woeful players for our place on the ladder. It is the AFL that is killing off our club, year by year, and it is using our own supporters and media acolytes (Wilson, Quayle) to hasten the process. Our club culture would change overnight if AFL rationalisation (not equalisation) was stopped. I for one would not follow a code that gifts year on year premiership success to four or five clubs, just so we can copy england's pathetic footballing code. who cares if the afl basks in record $$$ and tv rights deals if the price is watching a host of fake franchises being given the best footballers, and with the essendrugs hawthorns and geelongs of the world hoovering up all the free agent players.

One Priority pick ? LOL

We need a dozen just to make us competitive .

The AFL should take in to account us long suffering supporters .

Maybe they could charge every Melbourne supporter a extra $50.00 for those picks .

Im sure most would be happy to pay

  On 19/08/2014 at 02:25, Scoop Junior said:

Exactly right. Barrett calls Melbourne embarrassing, yet I reckon his failure to understand the situation is embarrassing.

As soon as someone says 'doesn't deserve a priority pick' I instantly think they have completely failed to grasp what is a relatively easy concept.

It's not about 'deserving' at all. It's not a prize given out to a good performer. It's simply about 'need' - the question is simply whether the club needs assistance.

It gets even more embrrassing when these journos state the reasons why we have been on the bottom for 8 years. Do they seriously fail to comprehend that THE reason why we have been on the bottom for 8 years is because we have stuffed up? Based on their reasoning, the corollary is that clubs should only get a priority pick when they draft well, develop well and make other good decisions (in which case you'd be sitting pretty in the finals). So on Barrett and others' logic we should give priority picks to successful teams.

The other inherent failure in the argument that Melbourne has wasted draft picks before so a PP won't help is that why are you then so concerned about giving Melbourne a PP? If it hasn't helped before and won't help now, why bleat about it and get so uptight about it?

That they bring up tanking is also a joke - firstly we have already been punished for that and secondly the conduct only occurred in one season, we have still been rubbish for the other 7 years.

Then Barrett really raises his lack of intelligence to unprecedented heights by saying that we will already be getting a first round pick for Frawley. That has about as much relevance to the PP issue as the current fuel price. What Barrett is telling us is that because we are losing our fourth player to free agency and are getting compensated for that under a completely separate regime, we should not get a PP based on 8 years of poor performance. Again, the corollary is that if Frawley stays, we are more deserving of a PP.

It is genuinely baffling how these people can just completely fail to grasp the concept. If they had half a brain what they would do is state the criteria for a PP and apply the criteria - because that's simply all that matters.

Patrick Smith has done this and on SEN this morning he was of the view that we should get a PP. Even Caro on Footy Classified said there is a good case for one.

Also good to see Evans has pre-judged the situation by commenting on it generally without assessing the merits of a particular case.

I really like how you have highlighted how ilogical and biased Barrett is, u can add Denim to the list.

  On 22/08/2014 at 12:59, AdamFarr said:

It's pretty rich from a club who still gets a free ride from the AFL. Pay no attention to it though. He's another that simply doesn't understand the rules. He's used the word 'deserve'.

"In fact they've probably had more access to young talent than most clubs over the last 10 years." - another quote from GWS about how we don't "deserve" a PP. How many round 1 picks have they had again???? Interestingly they and Collingwood are 2together in opposing us getting one. So now GWS join Collingwood as the 2 teams that I dislike the most .Whereas b4 I appreciated the fact that they took $cully, now I hope they do a Collingwood and repeatedly fail.

  On 22/08/2014 at 21:37, jnrmac said:

Where is the bleating in the media about Carlton??

4 PPs in 10 yrs, 3 number 1 draft picks, highly paid premiership coach, belted by over 100 points and still a shiite footy team. What a soft ride they get. They have had a lot more benefits than us from the AFL.

Yeah but we are the basket case that should merge or relocated blah blah blah.....FMD

We are a basket case. Carlton made it to week 2 of the finals last year (albeit as a result of Ess disqualification). They are getting some grief in the media, but no where near what we get or what we deserve IMO.

I'm not sure Carlton are a good comparison jnr.

Wow, has anyone read the giants reasoning behind us not getting a priority pick?

Mfc just happen to be an outlier and that's the nature of an 18 team comp...

How many extra draft picks and advantages have you clowns been given and continue to be given? Fairly comfortably say it's more than we have.

  On 22/08/2014 at 22:35, bush demon said:

The people on this site keep blaming our club culture and our woeful players for our place on the ladder. It is the AFL that is killing off our club, year by year, and it is using our own supporters and media acolytes (Wilson, Quayle) to hasten the process. Our club culture would change overnight if AFL rationalisation (not equalisation) was stopped. I for one would not follow a code that gifts year on year premiership success to four or five clubs, just so we can copy england's pathetic footballing code. who cares if the afl basks in record $$$ and tv rights deals if the price is watching a host of fake franchises being given the best footballers, and with the essendrugs hawthorns and geelongs of the world hoovering up all the free agent players.

And if it transpires that GWS, GCS are at the top for awhile, and combined with prolonged strong club - weak club mismatches, who will care and who will tune in? What will that do to ratings and the ability to leverage TV rights going forward?

Personally I believe that crowds attending the game are the real lifeblood of the sport and a key indicator of passion and interest, and I think the AFL have a problem brewing. It would be easy to dismiss my perspective as that of a jaundiced Melbourne member, and so to try and bring some objectivity to it, Iet's look at the crowds of the home games of a 'power club' in contention for a finals berth - Collingwood. How passionate were their members about turning up for home games? The stats are real food-for-thought:

Collingwood membership base: 79,579 members:

V BULL 28,339 = 35.6% membership base* (*not taking into account that a proportion of the crowd will be opposition supporters)

V CAR 40,936 = 51.4% membership base*

V ADE 41,482 = 52.1% membership base*

V POR 32,804 = 41.2% membership base*

V BRI 32,926 = 41.4% membership base*

The argument has been wrested from us the minute they use the word deserve in place of entitled. This then creates a discussion upon bias and emotion as distinct from one of reason which it should be.

There will be no pp if this is the nature of the debate for there ought not even be a debate. Should simple be a question of qualification.

Does the club fulfill the requirements as set out.

? Yes/no

We would proffer YES. Finis, pp awarded.

Won't happen I'd suggest.

  On 22/08/2014 at 22:35, bush demon said:

The people on this site keep blaming our club culture and our woeful players for our place on the ladder. It is the AFL that is killing off our club, year by year, and it is using our own supporters and media acolytes (Wilson, Quayle) to hasten the process. Our club culture would change overnight if AFL rationalisation (not equalisation) was stopped. I for one would not follow a code that gifts year on year premiership success to four or five clubs, just so we can copy england's pathetic footballing code. who cares if the afl basks in record $$$ and tv rights deals if the price is watching a host of fake franchises being given the best footballers, and with the essendrugs hawthorns and geelongs of the world hoovering up all the free agent players.

Gil cares. Because that's how he is renumerated.

  On 22/08/2014 at 23:51, Moonshadow said:

We are a basket case. Carlton made it to week 2 of the finals last year (albeit as a result of Ess disqualification). They are getting some grief in the media, but no where near what we get or what we deserve IMO.

I'm not sure Carlton are a good comparison jnr.

I guess one point is critics are saying we don't deserve a PP. Carlton have had more help than us.

Carlton were a basket case. Not so much now although not far off one IMO. They did win 3 spoons in a row. Even at our worst we haven't done that.

  On 22/08/2014 at 08:37, Wunders said:

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-08-22/demons-dont-deserve-a-priority-pick

GWS - "We would say that Melbourne doesn't deserve another pick, because then where does it stop?"

I think this quote says it all.. Imagine all the priority pics being handed out in the next few years because of us getting one.. Wait no other club has got a record like ours, they may in 5-6 years if they keep loosing.

I think it would've been more rationale to argue this: "where does it start?, Melbourne has been on the bottom for __ years and if anyone deserves one they do. If they don't get one then i can't realistically see anyone else ever getting one!"

That quote was Pert actually, from Collingwood.

GWS' quote was gold:

"Personally, I don't see Melbourne in an extraordinary circumstance.

"You've got 18 teams in the competition. Someone's going to finish 18th, 17th, 16th … I don't think their problem has been access to young talent.

"In fact they've probably had more access to young talent than most clubs over the last 10 years.

"I think the important point that people miss sometimes is there are cycles you go through.

"St Kilda is at the bottom at the moment, but probably had eight-to-10 years when they were right in contention.

"That's what the system is designed to do.

"You have outliers like Geelong who for some reason defy gravity, and then you have outliers like Melbourne who haven't been able to get up.

He starts off with the 'they've had their fair share of high draft picks' 'argument', which of course goes to show how many years we've finished at the bottom of the ladder.

Then he says we're an 'outlier' who hasn't been able to climb the ladder.

Outlier.

That's exactly what the PP is there for.

What a moron.

GWS are the AFL

those thoughts are straight from AFL house

we wont be getting a PP

I have an alternative that is far easier and more palatable than giving us a PP. The AFL should tell the other clubs to simply forget about nominating Billy Stretch.

That way we pick him up for our last pick and can use the earlier pick on someone else or trade it.

The clubs could say they simply forgot to bluff the Dees and no one would care as we weren't getting a PP.

Chances of happening -nil.

Given our recent form these silly little scenarios are the only thing giving me any interest in the MFC ATM.

  On 23/08/2014 at 23:02, Redleg said:

I have an alternative that is far easier and more palatable than giving us a PP. The AFL should tell the other clubs to simply forget about nominating Billy Stretch.

That way we pick him up for our last pick and can use the earlier pick on someone else or trade it.

The clubs could say they simply forgot to bluff the Dees and no one would care as we weren't getting a PP.

Chances of happening -nil.

Given our recent form these silly little scenarios are the only thing giving me any interest in the MFC ATM.

Not sure if you're being serious with these ridiculous suggestions Redleg- I hope not but if you are I fear for your wellbeing. Should probably take a bex have a good lie down and remove yourself from anything footy related for the next few weeks.

I have changed my mind we will get a PP

The team will lose the last two games by an average of 14 goals and finish last.

Frawley will be off and Roos will fail to talk for the month of August.

The AFL will be forced to act.

Three picks in the top ten is on the way

  On 23/08/2014 at 23:35, old dee said:

I have changed my mind we will get a PP

The team will lose the last two games by an average of 14 goals and finish last.

Frawley will be off and Roos will fail to talk for the month of August.

The AFL will be forced to act.

Three picks in the top ten is on the way

you feeling ok OD ?

  On 23/08/2014 at 23:38, beelzebub said:

you feeling ok OD ?

It is a lock bb

Onward and upward for the dees in 2015.

Eight new players, six to seven wins and No 10+ goal losses.

That will be achieved take my word for it

  On 23/08/2014 at 23:35, old dee said:

I have changed my mind we will get a PP

The team will lose the last two games by an average of 14 goals and finish last.

Frawley will be off and Roos will fail to talk for the month of August.

The AFL will be forced to act.

Three picks in the top ten is on the way

...and another vein will appear on PJ's head.