Post Match Discussion - Round 16

[Guest]

To be honest, I think there should be delistings over the next one to two years but another 10 in the space of a preseason? I think wholesale list pruning won't help team chemistry. If we have learnt anything over the last little bit is the place needs a little stability. It makes supporters feel good that the supposed 'shirkers' have been weeded out immediately but it mustn't be particularly reassuring to the blokes there that so many are walking in and out of the club like a revolving door. Ruthlessness mustn't be confused with self indulgence.
I agree with the sentiment that parts of the list need to be turned over but this should be progressive. I guess Byrnes will probably retire at the end of the year. Mitch already has retired. Blease, no matter what he does, seems to have his cards stamped. Tapscott hasn't played a game in the ones this year (please confirm). Pickles Evans has been on the list for nearly 4 years and yet has to crack it for a regular senior game (taking injuries into account). Strauss is in the same boat as Blease and Tappy. I think that should be enough change for one pre-season.
Go through this preseason surely and steadily and continue the process at the end of 2015 then hopefully the process will be complete and the group will have grown sufficiently together.

[Sir Why You Little 36,985]

No I am not, but I don't make outlandish statements and then have to eat humble pie, let me think Dunn, Pedersen and Jetta spring to mind

But there are a myriad of reasons why players have not 'developed', it is not a simple thing, otherwise a group of posters on here would be running a Footy Dept, a Footy Dept that would turn over 20 players a year for the hell of it, but nevertheless a Footy Dept

I just get staggered by some of the toing an froing....Salem being the perfect choice, a couple of weeks ago he was the new saviour, now according to some he is a boy playing a man's game, if you get my drift

My opinion is certainly not outlandish at All in terms of the MFC list. But that is your opinion.

I am looking at the recruiting of this club up to 2012 draft.

We recruited the wrong type of player. Plan and simple.

[Guest]

No I am not, but I don't make outlandish statements and then have to eat humble pie, let me think Dunn, Pedersen and Jetta spring to mind

That's rich, Mr. 'I am down at the club all the time and there is nothing wrong that I can tell'.

[beelzebub 23,313]

Colin..and I ask this seriously Surely team Chemistry is done no favour if you have the wrong ones either ?

[Guest]

Colin..and I ask this seriously Surely team Chemistry is done no favour if you have the wrong ones either ?

Yeah for sure but they don't need to all be gone in the space of one preseason either. It also might be a case that they aren't 'wrong' per se but their development has been stunted. Some might still be able to be salvaged as Pedo and Jetta have been.

I guess I have some names that I think might benefit from being moved on (both from a club point of view and their own) but they are merely my opinion. If I knew all and saw all, I would be employed at AFL level. I would leave as to who the club should move on to those with more insight than me.

I guess my argument would be more about quality of player movement than quantity. There should be no old hard ass, old school cleanouts this time around.

That being said, players leaving the list need not be due to sackings or delistings either. If we can get something for these blokes too then all the better and if they can find a home where they have a better chance to become the player they could be then all the better.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Colin B. Flaubert

[Satyriconhome 10,731]

That's rich, Mr. 'I am down at the club all the time and there is nothing wrong that I can tell'.

That's a myth chap, never ever said that, those words were put in my mouth to benefit other grandstanding posters, notice I never get posts being brought back up to hit me in the face with......feel free to try.....love a challenge

[rpfc 28,263]

I love a challenge, what you have typed above is your opinion, yours and WYL are not facts, you must remember that, mine differs on a few points, considering that Jetta, Dunn and Pedersen have been definite 'get rid ofs'

Spencer has been resigned, obviously the FD's opinion differs to yours

Westrupp....drawing a long bow there, he is not on the list technically

How do you know that some players would struggle to get a game?, your opinion again, not a fact.....perhaps St Kilda or even GWS could use them at the moment

Trengove is fine, I spoke to him, wanting to start an unfounded rumour there

I could go on picking holes but you get my drift

Facts?

We are 16th with 4 wins after winning 6 of the previous 44 matches. That tells you how competitive we are. And I said that those players would struggle to get a game in a 'MIDDLING' side. The Saints and GWS are anything but that.

The VFL reviews by Allison for some of those that I have mentioned have been largely damning.

You are not picking holes in my view that 27 players have not yet proven they are apart of the medium term future of the club. That is what we are talking about - not how many will be delisted at the end of the year - but how many will join the dozen (or just above) AFL standard players we have.

I know Kent, Salem, JKH, and Hogan will join them soon.

I have very little evidence for the other 27 (or 26 if you want to treat Westrupp as a sub-human).

You talk about facts but where is the evidence?

[Satyriconhome 10,731]

Facts?

We are 16th with 4 wins after winning 6 of the previous 44 matches. That tells you how competitive we are. And I said that those players would struggle to get a game in a 'MIDDLING' side. The Saints and GWS are anything but that.

The VFL reviews by Allison for some of those that I have mentioned have been largely damning.

You are not picking holes in my view that 27 players have not yet proven they are apart of the medium term future of the club. That is what we are talking about - not how many will be delisted at the end of the year - but how many will join the dozen (or just above) AFL standard players we have.

I know Kent, Salem, JKH, and Hogan will join them soon.

I have very little evidence for the other 27 (or 26 if you want to treat Westrupp as a sub-human).

You talk about facts but where is the evidence?

Allison's reports aren't damning they are factual, wish we could see more of that on here, what if JKH has reached his ceiling and doesn't develop, who are you going to blame then?

Who knows who the future is....let me think, I will do the hindsight, Gysberts after his first couple of games was touted as the future....er?

I am not treating Westrupp as a sub human, did I say that? I said he is not on the list ,so he can't be counted

This is all your opinion, I don't agree with it

[beelzebub 23,313]

Allison's reports aren't damning they are factual,

Damning and factual need not be mutually exclusive

I suggest they are damning because they are factual

[Sir Why You Little 36,985]

Satyr just sees what he wishes. That is obvious.

I can only hope Roos and PJ are in for the long haul because to right the absolute mess that BP and Schwab left this list in is going to take years.

4 wins will be it this year.

Any more will be a miracle.

[Guest]

Satyr just sees what he wishes. That is obvious.

I can only hope Roos and PJ are in for the long haul because to right the absolute mess that BP and Schwab left this list in is going to take years.

4 wins will be it this year.

Any more will be a miracle.

I think we are decent shakes against the Lions and the Giants but beyond that, I don't like our chances. To be honest, I though 8 wins would have been a pretty good effort so 6-7 is basically where the team is at.

Edited July 8, 2014 by Colin B. Flaubert

[Sir Why You Little 36,985]

I think we are decent shakes against the Lions and the Giants but beyond that, I don't like our chances. To be honest, I though 8 wins would have been a pretty good effort so 6-7 is basically where the team is at.

possibly those two. But it matters not. The skill level of this list under pressure is poor and will remain and they are not mentally strong enough to perform at a tough level over a period of weeks.

Consecutive victories will not happen with our present list.

[Guest]

possibly those two. But it matters not. The skill level of this list under pressure is poor and will remain and they are not mentally strong enough to perform at a tough level over a period of weeks.

Consecutive victories will not happen with our present list.

To be honest with you WYL, I'm not sure it is 'mental toughness' that is the issue here as it is skill level and decision making so I think the former parts of your observation are more accurate than the latter. The boys DO want to win and in most games have been trying their guts out but unfortunately, execution leaves a lot to be desired. Some of our brain fades tend to happen as well when we aren't under pressure.

Point in case: Matt Jones' desperate shot at goal during the last quarter against the Dogs at the G. The kid busted a gut to get that shot but at the end of the day he had ran himself into the ground to get there and the lack of penetration in his field kicking couldn't make up for how tired he was.

I have said my piece on how the list should be managed going forward so won't talk further about that.

[nutbean 8,838]

Facts?

We are 16th with 4 wins after winning 6 of the previous 44 matches. That tells you how competitive we are. And I said that those players would struggle to get a game in a 'MIDDLING' side. The Saints and GWS are anything but that.

The VFL reviews by Allison for some of those that I have mentioned have been largely damning.

You are not picking holes in my view that 27 players have not yet proven they are apart of the medium term future of the club. That is what we are talking about - not how many will be delisted at the end of the year - but how many will join the dozen (or just above) AFL standard players we have.

I know Kent, Salem, JKH, and Hogan will join them soon.

I have very little evidence for the other 27 (or 26 if you want to treat Westrupp as a sub-human).

You talk about facts but where is the evidence?

This is the great unknown and will be a test of Paul Roos' elder wand. So far we have seen , pre Roos, very few footballers take the next step with Nat Jones being the exception. This year we have seen (IMO) 3 players take a really good step forward - Pedersen, Dunn and Jetta. My big unknown is how many more of the pigs ears Roos can turn into silk purses.

Edited July 8, 2014 by nutbean

[Satyriconhome 10,731]

possibly those two. But it matters not. The skill level of this list under pressure is poor and will remain and they are not mentally strong enough to perform at a tough level over a period of weeks.

Consecutive victories will not happen with our present list.

Demonland posters?

[Sir Why You Little 36,985]

To be honest with you WYL, I'm not sure it is 'mental toughness' that is the issue here as it is skill level and decision making so I think the former parts of your observation are more accurate than the latter. The boys DO want to win and in most games have been trying their guts out but unfortunately, execution leaves a lot to be desired. Some of our brain fades tend to happen as well when we aren't under pressure.

Point in case: Matt Jones' desperate shot at goal during the last quarter against the Dogs at the G. The kid busted a gut to get that shot but at the end of the day he had ran himself into the ground to get there and the lack of penetration in his field kicking couldn't make up for how tired he was.

I have said my piece on how the list should be managed going forward so won't talk further about that.

i agree with what you say but for mine a"brain fade" is due to a lack of mental toughness. This club has done it for years at crucial times.

In a top side the brain fade is a rarity.

Hell one of our worst offenders is a captain!!!

Decision making and mental toughness i consider hand in hand.

Edited July 8, 2014 by why you little

[Satyriconhome 10,731]

i agree with what you say but for mine a"brain fade" is due to a lack of mental toughness. This club has done it for years at crucial times.

In a top side the brain fade is a rarity.

Hell one of our worst offenders is a captain!!!

Hawthorn last weekend.....brain fades? Hodge, Mitchell, Burgoyne, Lake......rarity?

[Sir Why You Little 36,985]

Hawthorn last weekend.....brain fades? Hodge, Mitchell, Burgoyne, Lake......rarity?

Oh my God....

[nutbean 8,838]

Hawthorn last weekend.....brain fades? Hodge, Mitchell, Burgoyne, Lake......rarity?

Actually - it is a rarity - that's why it made headlines.

[binman 42,683]

Some pure troll comedy gold in this thread from Satyriconhome - a poster i have blocked but cannot help but still see given surely he is the most frequently quoted person on DL.

The reason i blocked him? Well there was a few but the clincher was his troll behavior and blatant hypocrisy in the thread where seemingly straight faced lauded the overly critical and belittling public comments of Welsh and lambasted posters who had a contrary view.

Compare and contrast that position with the one he is taking in this thread in which he once again is the righteous defender of the maligned demon player nee spuds that DL posters have the temerity to criticise on a fan discussion forum. Gold

#don't feed trolls

Edited July 8, 2014 by binman

[Satyriconhome 10,731]

Hawthorn last weekend.....brain fades? Hodge, Mitchell, Burgoyne, Lake......rarity?

Every single AFL player has brain fades, they are not a rarity, posters on here just like to think they are..it suits their post.......Clinton Young last weekend, if he was an MFC player, a public flogging would be being organised as we type

Some pure troll comedy gold in this thread from Satyriconhome - a poster i have blocked but cannot help but still see given surely he is the most frequently quoted person on DL.

The reason i blocked him? Well there was a few but the clincher was his troll behavior and blatant hypocrisy in the thread where seemingly straight faced lauded the overly critical and belittling public comments of Welsh and lambasted posters who had a contrary view.

Compare and contrast that position with the one he is taking in this thread in which he once again is the righteous defender of the maligned demon player nee spuds that DL posters have the temerity to criticise on a fan discussion forum. Gold

#don't feed trolls

I get lamabasted because I have a contrary view, let me think...hypocrisy, if I am blocked and you don't read how do you know my posts are comedy or I am posting in this topic...gee...foot...gun? Any chance you actually add something to the topic

Edited July 8, 2014 by Satyriconhome

[jnrmac 20,055]

Yawn.........

[Sir Why You Little 36,985]

Jnrmac provides a lot on this discussion board.

[Bossdog 2,002]

It bemuses me, the petty infighting on a footy internet site

We lose......Sack everyone

We win.......What great champions the players are and all will be 200 game players

Watched a few games on the weekend.....We are not the only team that makes mistakes.......Some very experienced players for the higher teams made some glaring errors....Ie...stuffed up kicks,handballs, fumbled

Saty has his opinions, others don't agree..........but posters get into name calling and insults which really is a bit silly because what does it really matter.

It's a mine is bigger than yours thing.

We all have opinion.....we all have our favourite players and the ones we think are not up to it........But to belittle another poster because you don't like what he said is childish and petulant.

Sorry.......Rant over

[Demon Blood 46]

Terrible game for us but at least i am angry at losing again... last year i lost all feeling towards a 10 goal loss, now i feel an anger and, IMO, you can see the players hurting as well.

We have 2 more 'winnable' games in Brisbane & GWS but for the rest i would like to see us compete like we have done against the power and swans.

If we win 5 or 6 games for the years its a great improvement on where we have come from.

If you said to me at the start of the season that we would be breaking even in disposals (contested & uncontested) per game (-6.6), an effective disposal % of 73.4 and improving our I50 count by +10 over last year (still -11 vs opponent) i would have probably put a $50 on it to say you were wrong. But yet here we are at R16 with those numbers, a clear game plan which will act as the base plan on which to build on and a glimmer of hope with the team progressively improving.

It may not be the Port Adelaide turn around we all wanted but its a turn around.

Finally, I feel good when I go to the footy knowing that my team is gonna have a dip, this weekend when i head to the G to watch us against the cats i will go with the belief that if we can keep the score low we have a sniff. Its a good feeling to have back again.