Not mocking, but in the scheme of things Gillies doesn't even register compared to using pick 12 on a guy who wasn't good enough to play a single senior game. Not one game.

I am truly sorry if you think I am mocking you jr.

Usually don't do that.

I just think Pedersen is a VFL standard player.

If he turns into a useful player in 2014 I am happy for you to say ITYS.

Think I am fairly safe however.

Gents, we're loving our footy talk on the eve of Xmas....how good is that?

No stress.

One of my highlights this year in a season of lowlights was seeing Pedo put Scully on his arse! That little bugger got up gingerly.

All the best for the festive season

Pedo....... as they say, you can't polish a turd, but you can roll it in glitter!

Neeld should never have dropped him after that round 1 incident..

Neeld never should have played him round 1 (or traded for him for that matter)

In a side that miles off the pace even in the bottom quartile we can get excited about someone who is going to be "solid depth"

Good Grief.

Given we have had seven bad years at MFC, there is a terrible trait to eulogise the bog ordinary footballer.

Only SEVEN bad years??

More to the point, how many GOOD years have we had since circa 1964?

Wish I wasn't so old that I can recall (most of) them !

Let's hope 2014 starts an upward trend............

It's easy to sit in the stands and accuse a player who baulks at a 'hard ball get' of cowardice. I agree that it doesn't look good when a player 'squibs' a contest, but the important thing is how he reacts to similar incidents in the future.

the Australian cricket team baulked at the hard stuff just a few months back... its not easy coming into a fractured unit & shine, but its easy to have self doubt in that environment. Lets see how he develops over the next 2 YRS.

Steven Stretch 'pulled out' of a contest and was immediately labelled a coward by some 'supporters'. Stretch went on to play many great games for MFC and obviously used this incident to spur him on.

Hopefully Pedersen will do likewise.

As I see it, Pedersen's a depth player, and only qualifies as that (as opposed to being delisted) due to his three-year contract.

He plays outstanding football at VFL level, but as is regularly the case for MFC players, he can't transfer that form to the AFL.

He'll be the depth player to come in if we get injuries to McDonald/Frawley/Garland down back, or Hogan/Dawes/Clark up forward. Won't be a regular, won't be best 22, but will be that player to use if we need it.

I sat on the wing/flank in the Essendon game which was 1st or Second match of the year IIRC.

I saw him and Gillies were not in shape and it showed .

For all Neelds talk neither of these guys were ready for an AFL game.

I think the big anti-Neeld feeling comes from the fact that he tore up the list and got these two in as well as Byrnes.

He tried to break everyone down mentally and physically in an attempt to build them in his own image.

The gameplan was negative and when Clark went ,the plan was redundant.

Pedo is either a sweeper or a pinch hitter up forward.

Anyway he is contracted and I have seen worse players get to 50 or 100 games of AFL.

He has no hope of a game on the forward line and key back line positions are filled. There SHOULD be a role as a back pocket playing on the tall forwards, Hale etc but several times on the back line he was simply pathetic. Didn't seem able to spoil marks. Frustrating because he is a lovely kick ( I also recall that lovely goal when he ran from the back pocket and kicked beautifully) But overall I just doubt that he is up to it

Walked past him at the shops.. he was admiring my physique and stared me down, when all I could do was laugh at his on the inside.. and he is a professional athlete. LIFT CAMERON!

Who actually knows: Roos has a knack of getting some surprises out of some who are perceived as ordinary players.

Maybe he will be able to do the same with Cam - I won't hold my breath waiting, but likewise wouldn't write him off completely.

Will be gone at the end of his contract.

I hope, anyway.

Pedo looks fit and tried to keep up with the midfield running group the other day at training.

He couldn't of course, but neither could Dunny, and nor should they be expected to match that group which included Jonesy, Toumpas, Vince, Trengove and Cross who will all start Rd 1 injury permitted.

The group was led by Tom Mc, who continues to set high endurance fitness standards and makes Pedo and Dunny look slow by comparison.

Roosy went for smallish defenders at Sydney which is why you would think Tom Mc, Col and Frawley will again be our three pillars for our opponents three bigs.

But Pedo is going to be a very handy back-up if they get injured and I envisage him playing a bit as there are no other options, especially given Hoges won't be able to pinch hit down back because both Dawes and Clark are so injury prone that he will be needed up forward.

I know everyone was highly critical of him last year because he was given a pretty cushy three-year deal and failed dismally early as a forward, but as a defender he is a bit of a Jamie Duursma - a useful back-up role player and unlike Duursma he has a weapon with his thumping kick.

You're comparing him to Jamie Duursma, who on one leg beat Sticks and Dermie.

Pfffft!

It's hard to believe that we actually won that trade

By winning I mean we ended up with having to pay a useless list clogger for three seasons.

Yay us

I'd be surprised if Pedersen gets a game next year; if he does it will mean one of two things.

We are still crap.

We have a heap of injuries.

Or a combination of both which is pretty standard for Melbourne.

Seen plenty of decent AFL players do it on occasion.

Say Enright do it last season, but it was largely overlooked because everyone likes him and knows he's a star.

All are prone to a momentary lapse.

Spot on, Machsy.

I was watching a very old replay in which the great John Nicholls dropped his head twice in 5 minutes defending in the goal square with the pack behind him.

Peter Moore did it a dozen times every match.

I wouldn't write Pedersen off for that effort. Besides, he did knock the ball down effectively to one of our crumbers,as I remember it, before he ducked his head.

Personally I think Pedersen has potential under the new coach.

The one who I reckon is useless is Byrnes. Shouldn't get a game ever again.the worst player on our list.

Can a mod correct his name on the thread title?

(bit hypocritical from someone who misspelt Trengrove for too long)

I think some might be surprised by Pedo. I'm told he's doing well at training and is thriving under the new coach (not suggesting he's training the house down though).

I think some might be surprised by Pedo. I'm told he's doing well at training and is thriving under the new coach (not suggesting he's training the house down though).

both good signs. Pedos training and your restraint.

I was told when we recruited him,by a North supporter mate who attends all matches, that we had certainly got the better of the deal and that Pedo had heaps of potential. My mate was very disappointed with both players development but still felt that Pedo was capable of more. He will also be watching for any improvement under Roos as he felt Neeld was limited in his ability.

. Besides, he did knock the ball down effectively to one of our crumbers,as I remember it, before he ducked his head.

I can't recall the incident, but if the above is true, what the heck is all the fuss about? It is perfectly reasonable to protect your body after you have done what needs to be done for the team. Or are people saying he should have marked it (and then ducked) rather than knock it down? Anyone have the vision?

I can't recall the incident, but if the above is true, what the heck is all the fuss about? It is perfectly reasonable to protect your body after you have done what needs to be done for the team. Or are people saying he should have marked it (and then ducked) rather than knock it down? Anyone have the vision?

It's on youtube Sue if you search for Cam.

There was no contest and it looks amazingly soft.

I think he has been giving a harsh run of it. Has flaws, has strengths.

Statistics are interesting; comparable to James Frawley on most counts, even comparable on 1%ers, both being a big step down from Garland and McDonald, interestingly.

On disposal efficiency there's little difference between the two despite Pederson having a higher clanger count.

Pedersen even comes out ahead on contested possessions and contested marks.

Frawley has a couple of extra total disposals a game, and particularly rebound 50s, which Pedersen is a solid notch behind most of our main defenders (Frawley, McDonald, Garland and Terlich and Dunn are all around 3.5 a game, Pederson 2.5.) However, that reflects Pedersens use as a utility at times, with the rebound 50 + inside 50 count comparable. Also reflecting this, Pedersen contributes on the scoreboard occasionally, with a 'midfielders' typical tally of half a goal a game.

In fact, after going through all the statistics I could find, my conclusion is that Pederson is seriously unfairly maligned.

Only a small improvement would make him a regularly useful contributor as a tall utility and back-up defender. Certainly it wouldn't take much for him to become more useful, and more versatile, than Lynden Dunn. Pedersen has the advantage there of actually being able to stand a tall forward, whereas Dunn kind of takes up the 'role space' that Frawley and McDonald could use to better effect, rebounding from 50.

In a choice between Pedersen or Dunn, I'd go with Pedersen right now.

I can't recall the incident, but if the above is true, what the heck is all the fuss about? It is perfectly reasonable to protect your body after you have done what needs to be done for the team. Or are people saying he should have marked it (and then ducked) rather than knock it down? Anyone have the vision?

Great effort in his first game.

I think he has been giving a harsh run of it. Has flaws, has strengths.

Statistics are interesting; comparable to James Frawley on most counts, even comparable on 1%ers, both being a big step down from Garland and McDonald, interestingly.

On disposal efficiency there's little difference between the two despite Pederson having a higher clanger count.

Pedersen even comes out ahead on contested possessions and contested marks.

Frawley has a couple of extra total disposals a game, and particularly rebound 50s, which Pedersen is a solid notch behind most of our main defenders (Frawley, McDonald, Garland and Terlich and Dunn are all around 3.5 a game, Pederson 2.5.) However, that reflects Pedersens use as a utility at times, with the rebound 50 + inside 50 count comparable. Also reflecting this, Pedersen contributes on the scoreboard occasionally, with a 'midfielders' typical tally of half a goal a game.

In fact, after going through all the statistics I could find, my conclusion is that Pederson is seriously unfairly maligned.

Only a small improvement would make him a regularly useful contributor as a tall utility and back-up defender. Certainly it wouldn't take much for him to become more useful, and more versatile, than Lynden Dunn. Pedersen has the advantage there of actually being able to stand a tall forward, whereas Dunn kind of takes up the 'role space' that Frawley and McDonald could use to better effect, rebounding from 50.

In a choice between Pedersen or Dunn, I'd go with Pedersen right now.

This is where stats don't tell the story. I don't think they keep stats for the number of times he didn't involve himself in the play or go to help a team mate instead of meander around the back line showing little endeavour or purpose in his play unless it suited him or the ball fell his way.

A major improvement in these areas would make him useful.

Great effort in his first game.

Thanks. I don't think it is conclusive. I've watched it several times and tried to approximate slow motion. It is clear he knocks it down before he ducks and then goes backwards and sideways. It seems to me possible he was trying to be clever by using a a fast play to the crumber and then shepherd the oppo player coming towards him. And looked clumsy.

In any case, the oppo player was a long way back, not running fast (in fact he was pulling up) and Pedo wasn't running backwards, so it would be an unusual situation for a whimpish 'duck' in any place.

So while I wouldn't stake my life on it, I'd certainly give him the benefit of the doubt.

Agreed, sue. He's moving backwards, has already knocked the ball to advantage, and knows there's a player behind he's likely to collide with. If he did intentionally duck his head, that seems like a pretty good idea to me.