Interesting look into club culture

[dee-luded 2,958]

To be honest, I think the stuff with Norm Smith and Checker Hughes has been done to death.

The current stuff would be intriguing. I would love to see Bailey tell things as they really were. He wanted to tip the bucket at the presser but didn't. It would be interesting to see how Cuddles and Schwab try to justify the unjustifiable.

No it hasn't, re the culture. I want all to see & understand, the culture changes back then, & the culture softening since Smith finished, so the whole club can understand it,

& learn from it,,, because we haven't learn't.

We had the culture fix done to us,,, via Checker Hughes, but the club didn't learn the mechanics of it.... we keep making the same mistakes. someone comes in to fix it, & then its left to sour again.

[dee-luded 2,958]

I would love to see Bailey tell things as they really were. He wanted to tip the bucket at the presser but didn't. It would be interesting to see how Cuddles and Schwab try to justify the unjustifiable.

this would teach us nothing... this isn't about our culture problems... & nothing would be learn't from this. this was just about mistakes by people who didn't know better. a symptom of the sad situation the club has become, Because of the culture problem...

to go over the list management rebuild, would be just to put a bandaid on.

[Sir Why You Little 34,926]

I have read The Red Fox...i want to know what happened in the 80's onwards....from the MCC split....it has never been discussed.

[Moonshadow 16,409]

And while we're at it, get rid of the stars and 13th place for a star on the back of the jumpers. Maybe replace them with wooden spoons?

[Bitter but optimistic 21,556]

And while we're at it, get rid of the stars and 13th place for a star on the back of the jumpers. Maybe replace them with wooden spoons?

You're nice and positive today Moon!

[Bitter but optimistic 21,556]

Thought I'd put my sister's pic up Moon - like a date?

[Guest]

this would teach us nothing... this isn't about our culture problems... & nothing would be learn't from this. this was just about mistakes by people who didn't know better. a symptom of the sad situation the club has become, Because of the culture problem...

to go over the list management rebuild, would be just to put a bandaid on.

Firstly, I'm not talking about making a documentary in order to fix the MFC. It would be just that, a documentary. It's broad aim would be to inform, not to repair the MFC.

Secondly, I think it's going to be a bit hard to talk about that era because most of the blokes who were key players in it have passed on.

Thirdly, give up on trying to take things back to the days of Checker Hughes and Norm Smith. The world has changed. FCS, when those blokes were around the Soviet Union was still in business, we were using pounds, black and white TV was still in use (and in Checker's case, hadn't even been invented) and banks weren't hiring Catholics.

[Guest]

Thought I'd put my sister's pic up Moon - like a date?

You won't be offended if I say that's she's 300 pounds (or over)?

[Bitter but optimistic 21,556]

You won't be offended if I say that's she's 300 pounds (or over)?

She's a good conversationalist.

[Return to Glory 7,795]

She looks quite bashful.

[Return to Glory 7,795]

And yet bewitching

[Crompton's the man 635]

I know this isn't Melbourne Demons related specifically but I found this fascinating. I usually find Iron Mike an absolute muppet but this was very well done. I wonder if they will ever do a doco. on the events from 2009 until the end of 2013 at the MFC? I think that would be a brilliant documentary.

It just does go to show that culture does matter. And it's not just the culture among the players. How a club functions and what it's expectations and values are from top to bottom are important.

Fascinating

Thanks

[dee-luded 2,958]

Firstly, I'm not talking about making a documentary in order to fix the MFC. It would be just that, a documentary. It's broad aim would be to inform, not to repair the MFC.

Secondly, I think it's going to be a bit hard to talk about that era because most of the blokes who were key players in it have passed on.

Thirdly, give up on trying to take things back to the days of Checker Hughes and Norm Smith. The world has changed. FCS, when those blokes were around the Soviet Union was still in business, we were using pounds, black and white TV was still in use (and in Checker's case, hadn't even been invented) and banks weren't hiring Catholics.

knowledge, truth information, is a healer... by its nature. even if painful.

so the truth in understandable terms of how we continually fail, would shine the light,,, to many anyway. not everyone would successfully be able to grasp the concept.. some would turn away from the story finding it confrontingly uncomfortable to watch, listen, read.

no knowledge, no information is no growth.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Firstly, I'm not talking about making a documentary in order to fix the MFC. It would be just that, a documentary. It's broad aim would be to inform, not to repair the MFC.

Secondly, I think it's going to be a bit hard to talk about that era because most of the blokes who were key players in it have passed on.

Thirdly, give up on trying to take things back to the days of Checker Hughes and Norm Smith. The world has changed. FCS, when those blokes were around the Soviet Union was still in business, we were using pounds, black and white TV was still in use (and in Checker's case, hadn't even been invented) and banks weren't hiring Catholics.

You have to to compare, to show the contrast of before Checker's time,,,, during Checker's time,,, & since Smiths sacking, so people can see it. That is the whole Idea, or if no one is able to form the images necessary to see the story & understand how it works, then they won't be able to learn it.

& we'll just continue to go round in everlasting circles.

[Guest]

You have to to compare, to show the contrast of before Checker's time,,,, during Checker's time,,, & since Smiths sacking, so people can see it. That is the whole Idea, or if no one is able to form the images necessary to see the story & understand how it works, then they won't be able to learn it.

& we'll just continue to go round in everlasting circles.

Do you ever read other people's posts mate?

Again...

If the doco is made, it wouldn't necessarily be made for the club's benefit. I don't think Fox Footy made that documentary to help Richmond. It would be made to be informative.

I'm not going to get into the other stuff. I'm sick of repeating myself.

[Earl Hood 5,821]

Thought I'd put my sister's pic up Moon - like a date?

BBO. Here is a picture of my brother, he is a pretty good on the tennis court. He does like big women as well. He might be up for a date. She could be a ball boy perhaps?

[dee-luded 2,958]

Do you ever read other people's posts mate?

Again...

If the doco is made, it wouldn't necessarily be made for the club's benefit.

I am talking about a hypothetical Doco about Melbourne. that IS what I suggested. I am NOT talking about the Richmond Doco.

Do you ever read other people's posts mate?

Again...

If the doco is made, it wouldn't necessarily be made for the club's benefit. I don't think Fox Footy made that documentary to help Richmond. It would be made to be informative.

I'm not going to get into the other stuff. I'm sick of repeating myself.

again your not hearing my words about said Doco.

If its about the truth of the Melbournefc, & it uncovers all these culture issues in detail, then it should paint an accurate picture, which inturn would educate us all about what did, & what didn't, take place in those times...

... so the said hypothetical Doco, as Doco's do, or are supposed to do, is inform, show & teach us. Hopefully about what went wrong in times of MFC troubles so we could learn something, & make necessary adjustments to improve our lot.

if its just a money grabbing sensationalist piece of flash & pop, designed to appease senses, more than thought, then your right.

Edited August 26, 2013 by dee-luded

[DemonFrog 1,347]

She's a good conversationalist.

Yes Yes Yes but can she play in the Mid field?

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Do you ever read other people's posts mate?

Again...

If the doco is made, it wouldn't necessarily be made for the club's benefit. I don't think Fox Footy made that documentary to help Richmond. It would be made to be informative.

I'm not going to get into the other stuff. I'm sick of repeating myself.

That was vey interesting viewing and I recall a lot of the events they talked about; never liked the Richmond crew, I always thought that G Richmond was a bit of a thug and Wilson not far behind.

It was also an insight in to how Schwab was indoctrinated in to Football and I guess one day it will all come out about what happened at Melbourne since he returned and during his time with us. It won't happen until all the players involved, coaches, footballers and administrators, have got nothing to lose; at the moment none of them can afford to tip the bucket or they will become persona non grata.

The events at Richmond have an eerie similarity to that which Melbourne have been going through, with the constant change to satisfy the supporters and the lack of courage to stay the course, if you thought you'd made the right decision in the first place you should continue on.

Problem is we have been so amateurish we have made the wrong decisions, most of the time; I wonder what might have been if we had chosen Hardwick instead of Bailey, who was a left field choice.

Unfortunately we gave Schwab unfettered power, because no one on the board knew what they were doing and no one on the previous board had a clue either, so when Bailey fell out with Schwab it was curtains for him.

You have to wonder what would have been if we had continued on with the previous board, and what will be because we continued on for too long with Schwab

[Guest]

That was vey interesting viewing and I recall a lot of the events they talked about; never liked the Richmond crew, I always thought that G Richmond was a bit of a thug and Wilson not far behind.

It was also an insight in to how Schwab was indoctrinated in to Football and I guess one day it will all come out about what happened at Melbourne since he returned and during his time with us. It won't happen until all the players involved, coaches, footballers and administrators, have got nothing to lose; at the moment none of them can afford to tip the bucket or they will become persona non grata.

The events at Richmond have an eerie similarity to that which Melbourne have been going through, with the constant change to satisfy the supporters and the lack of courage to stay the course, if you thought you'd made the right decision in the first place you should continue on.

Problem is we have been so amateurish we have made the wrong decisions, most of the time; I wonder what might have been if we had chosen Hardwick instead of Bailey, who was a left field choice.

Unfortunately we gave Schwab unfettered power, because no one on the board knew what they were doing and no one on the previous board had a clue either, so when Bailey fell out with Schwab it was curtains for him.

You have to wonder what would have been if we had continued on with the previous board, and what will be because we continued on for too long with Schwab

I was wondering if Cameron was going to make an appearance as he famously criticized the Richmond culture as having gone from 'eat 'em alive' to 'eat your own'. That was after he had been sacked as CEO in 1994 when Mal Brown publicly called him out on the Sunday Footy Show. I'm guessing that he is still keeping a low profile.

The amateurish behavior is consistent with what happened at Richmond in the '80's. But where did our propensity for board room and administrative shenanigans come from? Can some of the older Demons tell me what happened post Norm Smith's sacking? I knew the playing side collapsed but I never heard of a great deal about infighting during the '70's and '80's (wasn't born in the 70's and was too young to understand in the 80's). It seemed somewhere in the '90's, strife at board level became endemic. (And no Deeluded, please don't tell us yet again about the Northern Stands, how Checker and Norm were able to scream at people but subsequent admins were too genteel and politically correct and how the MCG corrupts people. If I hear that again, I will put my fist through the screen).

If I were a producer, I think that stuff would need to be briefly touched on (though I personally want to know about it). The main cause of the current downfall of our club came post Daniher and with the complete botching of the rebuild, tanking and a boys club mentality that created a 'caste' system of insiders and outsiders and that is what I would cover. That story in itself is fascinating.

It is kind of hard to say if it was curtains for Bailey the second he fell out with CS. It looked like he was actually going to win the political battle against Schwab until Round 19, 2011 (I'm not going to use the other name for that event that is used on Demonland). However, it changed the complete dynamic (for the worse). I think Schwab's operation was exposed for what it was but as soon as that loss occurred, some time was bought for him. I think it says a bit about his mindset that he even wanted to stay on. A lot of blokes would have seen that the board, players and coaching staff wanted him to go and, rightly or wrongly, would have recognized that their position was untenable. Why in God's name couldn't Cameron see that and why didn't he just walk away? Were things so poisonous that he was hellbent on getting 'revenge' on Bailey? Was it because he 'loved' the club so much he just couldn't? What was his thinking process?

Edited August 26, 2013 by Guest

[Young Dee 1,303]

Of course culture is important - just look at Geelong they have achieved prolonged success through a rich winning culture. This culture has not only enabled success but also enabled them to develop youth at a very high standard.

Culture effects everything - training standards, game day results, development (mental/physical) etc.

We seem to be the only club without a decent culture and it is all a result of previous mistakes (tanking). We need to get some real leaders into the club (and get Clark and Dawes on the field).

There is no quick fix - like Craig has said we are used to losing and losing is easy.

MFC

The rest of AFL

[Sir Why You Little 34,926]

Watched that show again last night. Fascinating.

There must be some similarities between us and them (up until last year!!)

We need the best people to come from outside.

[beelzebub 22,324]

Watched that show again last night. Fascinating.

There must be some similarities between us and them (up until last year!!)

We need the best people to come from outside.

Just found time to watch it. Quite fascinating as you say. Unfortunately I also was thinking they might as well be talking about us half the time.

At times you have to wonder if we haven't been just as reactionary.. Hopefully we are now moving into a proactive period of our history....hopefully.

[old dee 22,982]

Just found time to watch it. Quite fascinating as you say. Unfortunately I also was thinking they might as well be talking about us half the time.

At times you have to wonder if we haven't been just as reactionary.. Hopefully we are now moving into a proactive period of our history....hopefully.

Big Word bb

[beelzebub 22,324]

Big Word bb

its the only one we have left OD