The Greater Western Shambles

[Sir Why You Little 37,124]

That's true but at least they've given us a few wins over the last couple of years !

Yes, but i would prefer to beat real sides.

The draft over the last 3 years has been so depressing!!

Such a waste.

[stuie 7,374]

Yes, but i would prefer to beat real sides.

That's what everyone who plays us says as well you know...

[rjay 25,082]

I agree with the general thought that GWS right now is struggling more so than most would have thought acceptable, and that they're a bit of a shambles. They've managed their list poorly, their senior players are crap, some of their kids haven't lived up to the hype, and their big recruits have also sucked (Scully the perfect example).

But I don't agree with the myopic people who can't see the long-term view on this one. GWS is there to make AFL a sport of choice in Western Sydney. That's not going to happen overnight in areas where NRL and soccer dominate. That's why the team is there, not in Tasmania, where people already play and support AFL.

I posted somewhere on this at the time that they were going to really struggle and for these reasons.

The recruiting process was poor and ill conceived, the idea was to get a club up and running and being competitive within the first few years. Unfortunately they got greedy with the thought of all the young talent on offer and pitched for an early premiership.

They needed senior talent not a great batch of young kids and added another kid, Scully as their big money recruit, a decision that has been a disaster of the highest order. That money needed to go to an established player.

Apart from that in their lead up year they had their team running around in a local competition when GC in their lead up year played VFL football which was a great grounding for Swallow, Smith and a few of the others, a bit like the grounding Hogan is getting with us this year.

The AFL were asleep at the wheel on this and should have applied the brakes and directed the club's recruiting strategy. They have been to smart for themselves by half.

Following on your point about Tassie, I think you are right there as well and I'm pretty sure the money for the broadcast deal wouldn't have stacked up with them in the competition . GWS has brought the money in, money that is now there to help save our club, if they don't get it right though that money will evaporate next deal.

[Demonsterative 3,020]

The AFL have thrown millions more to GWS than the MFC. The money the MFC had received is conditional. In other words, they will give us money if you spend it in a way the AFL wants us to. Why has this condition not occurred with The Suns and Giants? It seems to me the Suns have spent millions on senior players that have mentored their youth. GWS spent 6 million on Scully (add more for Fat Scully for recruitment). That's more than 100% than what what we are getting. As it has turned out GWS has wasted 4 million on Scully at best. That 4 million could have been spent on other clubs equallying up FD expenditure.

IMO, the money we have received from the AFL is justified considering the waste GWS has spent on its senior players, Scully included. No matter how the Scully contract is justified, a third year player with 30 games experience should never have become in the top 5 best paid players on the league.

It's an injustice to the AFL's elite players playing elsewhere

[bush demon 2,062]

I agree with the general thought that GWS right now is struggling more so than most would have thought acceptable, and that they're a bit of a shambles. They've managed their list poorly, their senior players are crap, some of their kids haven't lived up to the hype, and their big recruits have also sucked (Scully the perfect example).

But I don't agree with the myopic people who can't see the long-term view on this one. GWS is there to make AFL a sport of choice in Western Sydney. That's not going to happen overnight in areas where NRL and soccer dominate. That's why the team is there, not in Tasmania, where people already play and support AFL.

I agree with the idea of spreading the gospel by it was a blunder to instal Sheedy as Chef de mission, he had/has too many axes to grind and never put in place a balanced playing list, relying totally on youth. The afl will be propping up the bottom quartile of the comp in perpetuity and they have effectively set up the GWS to fail, big time.

[rjay 25,082]

It seems to me the Suns have spent millions on senior players that have mentored their youth. GWS spent 6 million on Scully (add more for Fat Scully for recruitment).

No matter how the Scully contract is justified, a third year player with 30 games experience should never have become in the top 5 best paid players on the league.

It's an injustice to the AFL's elite players playing elsewhere

I agree with the idea of spreading the gospel by it was a blunder to instal Sheedy as Chef de mission, he had/has too many axes to grind and never put in place a balanced playing list, relying totally on youth. The afl will be propping up the bottom quartile of the comp in perpetuity and they have effectively set up the GWS to fail, big time.

Agree with these points but will say that Sheedy had accomplices in Gubby & SOS. I think the AFL were asleep at the wheel and only realised way to late installing their man as CEO to sort the mess out.

[whatwhat say what 22,933]

With the sheer talent on their list, GWS should be a powerhouse by 2016.

Of course, I recall plenty of commentators saying the same about the MFC in 2011...

[John Crow Batty 8,878]

GWS were created to be a rival for the Swans. But the natural order of things has made them our peers. A horrible reality. I hope things change with our new regime. The AFL's support of us is an indication of realisation to the horrible mistake they have made. I hope the shift is now to bolster the grass root clubs and territories rather than badly timed expansion. I expect GWS to go to Tassie in the future. Perhaps when the the burning of money becomes unsustainable.

Edited July 17, 2013 by america de cali

[whatwhat say what 22,933]

No chance.

GWS are strategically vital.

[S.R.J 418]

The AFL will bank roll them to be successful no matter what. They dont admit to stuff ups

[Moonshadow 17,677]

With a real coach and an injection of a 2-3 experienced good players such as Buddy or someone like an Ablett, GWS will become a very good team. There is simply too much talent in their list. That is, assuming they hang onto them.

I too think Tassie deserve a team, but financially and in terms of growth of the game, it's a no brainer - western Sydney has to succeed. Massive population growing rapidly, numbers = money, bigger growth potential for the game than Tassie, need to establish a foothold in the soccer strong land. If they do it right, it will pay for itself in due course.

Tassie has a small population, it's economy is stuffed, it is economically and geographically isolated. It would survive only because of continual Tas State Govt and AFL support. What it does have going for it is a passion for the game, which is obviously hugely important.

Couldn't read the article, not an Oz subscriber.

[beelzebub 23,382]

No matter what some here are saying regarding the talent or other wise of GWS , it willtake at least 5-6 years before they decently competitive. In all that time they are, and forever will be playing a foreign game in that locale. To argue otherwise is to simply be either ignorant of sydney or bold faced delusiolnally optimisitc about its attractiveness there. Its not. Never will be. Bit like trying to tell the French that others can make better wines . Its irrelevant that they can or cant its perception ( ooh theres that word again lol )

GWS is simply an AFL sink hole.

Footy is as much about the atmosphere and such as it is the game proper. Watching footy in the west of Sydney would be akin to attending a "pie night" ata catholic Choirs Enclave. Not overly entertaining....a bit devoid of ambience.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,909]

In 1986 there were plenty of doomsayers who predicted the national expansion of the then VFL would be a failure. And for a while Brisbane as the Bears were dreadful.

People should not confuse the merits of expanding into NSW with the methodology used. In my view, the AFL has made two mistakes. They should have started a second team in NSW at least 5 years sooner. And they allowed local GWS management too much control in some of the key implementation decisions. I am in no doubt the AFL expected GWS to have a greater mix of moderately experienced and young players from day 1 - not young players blended with retirees such as Power, McDonald, Brogan and Cornes. That playing list decision was a local idea which may pay off in the future in terms of performance but has tragically damaged the GWS and AFL brands in western Sydney in the meantime.

[beelzebub 23,382]

But theyve got a history of playing footy in Qld (SE ). It makes for a huge difference in the public psych.

[Outside fifty 967]

GWS will survive on life support as long as long as Vlad is in charge. Once he has gone I believe they will eventually relocate. My guesstimation is that they will move to Canberra, interestingly enough they are already jumper sponsors. GWS was born out of a perceived need to fill a void in advertising and marketing. The west of Sydney is one of the largest advertising catchment areas in oz. In terms of AFL it was a black hole and the TV networks knew it, and as such could discount the broadcast deal. From the get go the AFL embarked on possibly the most difficult of all marketing tasks, marketing a product that no one wanted. A build it and they will come philosophy was adopted. The execution from the start was poor and was driven more by a need to beat soccer into the new area rather than establishing proper foundations. GWS will fail because it has no underlying support. Without that core support of welded on supporters this club will fail. Tasmania's only real vice is that it is irrelevant in terms of marketing and advertising. i have little doubt that a team from Tassie could survive in much the same way as Geelong has survived and prospered. Unfortunately todays game is governed as much by TV networks as it is by the AFL.

[beelzebub 23,382]

Insome respects it took the merger of Fitzroy into the Numb-bears to get the Numbers to make it work. ( apol, a little convoluted there )

Possibly a merger of a relocated underperformer/struggler might make the difference to legitimacy. It would have a history.

Just how far NORTH of MELBOURNE is Blacktown ??? hmmmm !!!! lol

[beelzebub 23,382]

GWS will survive on life support as long as long as Vlad is in charge. Once he has gone I believe they will eventually relocate. My guesstimation is that they will move to Canberra, interestingly enough they are already jumper sponsors. GWS was born out of a perceived need to fill a void in advertising and marketing. The west of Sydney is one of the largest advertising catchment areas in oz. In terms of AFL it was a black hole and the TV networks knew it, and as such could discount the broadcast deal. From the get go the AFL embarked on possibly the most difficult of all marketing tasks, marketing a product that no one wanted. A build it and they will come philosophy was adopted. The execution from the start was poor and was driven more by a need to beat soccer into the new area rather than establishing proper foundations. GWS will fail because it has no underlying support. Without that core support of welded on supporters this club will fail. Tasmania's only real vice is that it is irrelevant in terms of marketing and advertising. i have little doubt that a team from Tassie could survive in much the same way as Geelong has survived and prospered. Unfortunately todays game is governed as much by TV networks as it is by the AFL.

Canberra Giants.... they might just work. Hmm used to be a team called the North Melbourne Giants too.. all things falling into place...lol

[deanox 9,989]

They will be terrible for a while but won't fail. It took 20 years for Sydney to have an impact.

This is a generational thing, it is about providing a team in the region for kids to loosely support. In 20 years those kids will be having kids of their own. A lot of the population are migrants, the next generation will be aussies and they'll be all over it.

They will be a sink hole for 20 years but they have the potential to be a strong club in the long term based on supporter base size.

The interesting thing to me is that they have made the same mistake Melbourne did: youth, youth and more youth. Hoard the best kids at the size of experience.

[DeeZee 7,445]

They made a huge mistake in drafting too many kids.....never going to win a hostile crowd over, if you are non competitive.

The kids have no leaders, no one to develop them. Like Melbourne but ten times worse.

[mrtwister 652]

Canberra Giants.... they might just work. Hmm used to be a team called the North Melbourne Giants too.. all things falling into place...lol

North Melbourne Giants were a NBL team. They merged with Melbourne Magic to form Melbourne Titans (a titan being a magical giant). What do you get when you cross a giant and a demon? Hope we don't find out.

[Weedster 174]

Adding to this, there is no way the AFL is going to let it go like this for five years and think 'oh, we gave it a shot but it'll never work so we'll demolish the lot'. They will make GWS a marketable side and a (at least moderately) successful side, no matter how much it costs and no matter the concessions that have to be made.

Bottom line though - they could win the damn thing and no-one would care.

News flash - not everyone has to follow AFL

A shambles

Edited July 18, 2013 by Weedster

[sue 9,140]

Canberra Giants.... they might just work. Hmm used to be a team called the North Melbourne Giants too.. all things falling into place...lol

The AFL has missed its chance in Canberra. They should have done something years ago when a large fraction of the population were ex-Melbourne exiles and AFL was quite popular. But by doing nothing while the Rugby types set up the successful Raiders and then the Brumbies, these are now seen as the local teams and code to support. (Also the population is now about the same as Tassie, so too small. At least in Tassie 100% want AFL, in Canberra it is an unknown number and likely to be around 30% of that if you do no more than just divide up the 3 codes (plus soccer...) which is probably generous.

[dpositive 1,677]

I agree with the general thought that GWS right now is struggling more so than most would have thought acceptable, and that they're a bit of a shambles. They've managed their list poorly, their senior players are crap, some of their kids haven't lived up to the hype, and their big recruits have also sucked (Scully the perfect example).

But I don't agree with the myopic people who can't see the long-term view on this one. GWS is there to make AFL a sport of choice in Western Sydney. That's not going to happen overnight in areas where NRL and soccer dominate. That's why the team is there, not in Tasmania, where people already play and support AFL.

This is probably true

WA, SA were footy inclined same as tassie, NSW and Qld were alternative code

the AFL expanded from its Vic base to grow its reach and market and therefore finances, It ploughed money into Qland and Stdney as they did not have a healthy state base but the AFL clubs really didnt explode until the state based club won a flag. Eagles Crows and Swans all won a flag and improved their support base and income streams

Port also improved with a flag.

Bbane had prolonged flag success to establish itself.

It is no surprise that Freemantle GWS and Suns would be ahead of us on the list "must win flag" to ensure code survival

MFC must win despite these and as "Melbourne" can encourage and leverage off the interstate rivalry to compete for those flags better than the suburbs or confected dogs roos etc. It could be our best hope???

[praha 11,240]

This article is hilarious and oh-so-true.

Gold Coast I could understand because they have one of the biggest amateur teams in the country down there. But GWS? A Canberra team would have been a better option.

Also, the drafting hand-outs were a bad choice. They should have run an expansion draft: each team selects two uncontracted players to enter into the expansion draft, and the expansion team can select one, or neither, of the two players.

It seemed like the logical thing to do.

GWS is basically on the path Melbourne took: no true leaders, young, inexperienced young tikes fighting it out against men.

Only problem is Melbourne is 150 years old and people care about the club.

[bush demon 2,062]

With a real coach and an injection of a 2-3 experienced good players such as Buddy or someone like an Ablett, GWS will become a very good team. There is simply too much talent in their list. That is, assuming they hang onto them.

I too think Tassie deserve a team, but financially and in terms of growth of the game, it's a no brainer - western Sydney has to succeed. Massive population growing rapidly, numbers = money, bigger growth potential for the game than Tassie, need to establish a foothold in the soccer strong land. If they do it right, it will pay for itself in due course.

Tassie has a small population, it's economy is stuffed, it is economically and geographically isolated. It would survive only because of continual Tas State Govt and AFL support. What it does have going for it is a passion for the game, which is obviously hugely important.

Couldn't read the article, not an Oz subscriber.

You can back-door this article still by pasting the URL address into google, that's what I did.