Sacking people is not the answer

[dees_rule_4eva 22]

I am reading post after post of "sack Neeld, McLardy, Schwab, the Board, everyone".

Do the people posting this stuff actually love our club? I assume you all do, because you are spending time venting your frustration here. What some people are failing to recognise is that by sacking all these people, our Club won't exist. Do you actually want that? I know I don't. I appreciate we are at one of the lowest points in memory, but I still love our Club, and I still want to go to the footy next week.

I'm as frustrated as anyone on here, and Sunday was downright pathetic, disgusting, unacceptable, and all of the other words that have been used. But the answer is not to sack everyone. It doesn't achieve anything - the last 7 years should have taught you that. Sacking Daniher got us nowhere. Sacking Bailey got us nowhere. Sacking Neeld won't help either. Neither will sacking McLardy. Now more than ever the Club needs unity and stability on the inside. Sacking people will only make it worse (and yes, it can get worse).

I can tell you exactly what happened on Sunday. An attitude problem. The entire Club was guilty of believing their own crap. "We've had a fantastic pre-season". "We're setting elite standards on the track". "The training & rehab programs are unrecognisable to last year". "The wheel turns quickly". Etc. Etc.

That may all be so, but what all the players and coaching staff seemed to forget was that you still have to work hard and play the game to get a result. It seemed as if everyone rocked up to the ground thinking "We're so much better than last year, we'll cruise to a win today".

I am hoping that it was just a massive reality check for them all. Just because you set high standards in training, and you train really well, doesn't mean everything will "just click" on game day. Work hard on game day, and maybe you will see some results. Don't turn up and expect things to happen, because as we saw on Sunday, thats crap.

There may be many problems after Round 1, but sacking people is not going to fix the attitude problem that we saw on Sunday.

I'm rambling now - my two cents worth anyway. Agree with me or don't!

[Fat Tony 4,479]

I am reading post after post of "sack Neeld, McLardy, Schwab, the Board, everyone".

...

One man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter.

We all want a successful MFC. Some think we should persevere with the status quo. Others think the current lot are tried and failed leaders and don’t deserve a third attempt to rebuild the club.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

I am reading post after post of "sack Neeld, McLardy, Schwab, the Board, everyone".

Do the people posting this stuff actually love our club? I assume you all do, because you are spending time venting your frustration here. What some people are failing to recognise is that by sacking all these people, our Club won't exist. Do you actually want that? I know I don't. I appreciate we are at one of the lowest points in memory, but I still love our Club, and I still want to go to the footy next week.

I'm as frustrated as anyone on here, and Sunday was downright pathetic, disgusting, unacceptable, and all of the other words that have been used. But the answer is not to sack everyone. It doesn't achieve anything - the last 7 years should have taught you that. Sacking Daniher got us nowhere. Sacking Bailey got us nowhere. Sacking Neeld won't help either. Neither will sacking McLardy. Now more than ever the Club needs unity and stability on the inside. Sacking people will only make it worse (and yes, it can get worse).

I can tell you exactly what happened on Sunday. An attitude problem. The entire Club was guilty of believing their own crap. "We've had a fantastic pre-season". "We're setting elite standards on the track". "The training & rehab programs are unrecognisable to last year". "The wheel turns quickly". Etc. Etc.

That may all be so, but what all the players and coaching staff seemed to forget was that you still have to work hard and play the game to get a result. It seemed as if everyone rocked up to the ground thinking "We're so much better than last year, we'll cruise to a win today".

I am hoping that it was just a massive reality check for them all. Just because you set high standards in training, and you train really well, doesn't mean everything will "just click" on game day. Work hard on game day, and maybe you will see some results. Don't turn up and expect things to happen, because as we saw on Sunday, thats crap.

There may be many problems after Round 1, but sacking people is not going to fix the attitude problem that we saw on Sunday.

I'm rambling now - my two cents worth anyway. Agree with me or don't!

Your points are valid and I would hate for some knee jerk reaction, simply to be seen to be doing something

Having said that, there is an old fashioned term called "accountability" and that applies to any endeavour in life. Regardless of any extenuating circumstances, if you can't turn up to "play", at the start of a new season, given your previous season, something is wrong. If your best player, in a team which, by every KPI, was abysmal, is a first year player by the name of Jack Viney, then you have a serious and endemic problem.

Regardless of who is at fault, all I want to know is who will be accountable? Who will stand up and say, to hell with the problem, let's just fix it and be part of the solution?

Put simply, something is intrinsically wrong at this footy club. Who will stand up and be accountable?

Today's football world will not wait and will be clinically brutal if you are a recidivist offender. That is just the reality. We ignore that reality at our own peril.

Edited April 2, 2013 by iv'a worn smith

[jabberwocky 2,301]

Your points are valid and I would hate for some knee jerk reaction, simply seen to be doing something

Having said that, there is an old fashioned terms called "accountability" and that applies to any endeavour in life. Regardless of any extenuating circumstances, if you can't turn up to "play", at the start of a new season, given your previous season, something is wrong. If you best player, in a team which, by every KPI, was abysmal, is a first year player by the name of Jack Viney, then you have a serious and endemic problem.

Regardless of who is at fault, all I want to know is who will be accountable? Who will stand up and say, to hell with the problem, let's just fix it and be part of the solution?

Put simply, something is intrinsically wrong at this footy club. Who will stand up and be accountable?

Today's football world will not wait and will be clinically brutal if you are a recidivist offender. That is just the reality. We ignore that reality at our own peril.

Well said.

Put this on everyone's desk/locker etc

[Sir Why You Little 34,752]

Your points are valid and I would hate for some knee jerk reaction, simply to be seen to be doing something

Having said that, there is an old fashioned term called "accountability" and that applies to any endeavour in life. Regardless of any extenuating circumstances, if you can't turn up to "play", at the start of a new season, given your previous season, something is wrong. If your best player, in a team which, by every KPI, was abysmal, is a first year player by the name of Jack Viney, then you have a serious and endemic problem.

Regardless of who is at fault, all I want to know is who will be accountable? Who will stand up and say, to hell with the problem, let's just fix it and be part of the solution?

Put simply, something is intrinsically wrong at this footy club. Who will stand up and be accountable?

Today's football world will not wait and will be clinically brutal if you are a recidivist offender. That is just the reality. We ignore that reality at our own peril.

ABSOLUTELY SPOT ON IVA....

[dees_rule_4eva 22]

Your points are valid and I would hate for some knee jerk reaction, simply to be seen to be doing something

Having said that, there is an old fashioned term called "accountability" and that applies to any endeavour in life. Regardless of any extenuating circumstances, if you can't turn up to "play", at the start of a new season, given your previous season, something is wrong. If your best player, in a team which, by every KPI, was abysmal, is a first year player by the name of Jack Viney, then you have a serious and endemic problem.

Regardless of who is at fault, all I want to know is who will be accountable? Who will stand up and say, to hell with the problem, let's just fix it and be part of the solution?

Put simply, something is intrinsically wrong at this footy club. Who will stand up and be accountable?

Today's football world will not wait and will be clinically brutal if you are a recidivist offender. That is just the reality. We ignore that reality at our own peril.

Yep, appreciate all of that IWS.

I certainly want the Club to do something to fix what happened on Sunday, I'm just not a fan of the old "sack them" mentality, as if that will really solve anything. Completely agree with your point that if you can't "get up" for the first game of a new season, and your best player in every regard was a debutant, then we have serious problems. I'm with you.

There was a point in the game less than 10 minutes in, where James Frawley just jogged along while his opponent in Westhoff, sprinted to get the ball and dish off a handball to Hartlett, who goaled from 55. Why did this happen? I don't want to single out Chip, as there were plenty of others in the same boat, but its Round 1. If you aren't motivated to work hard and stop your opponent 10 minutes into the game, will you ever be? The whole thing was bizarre.

[Jesse Christ 2,884]

The "sack them" mentality isn't a knee jerk reaction, years upon years of ineptitude has finally lead to this.

MFC is broken, it must be fixed. There are poisonous elements at the club, they must be sought out and eradicated.

Or we can just keep going the way we have been and be no more in a couple of seasons. I would rather see heads roll then not having a club to support in 2015!

[old dee 22,963]

I am reading post after post of "sack Neeld, McLardy, Schwab, the Board, everyone".

Do the people posting this stuff actually love our club? I assume you all do, because you are spending time venting your frustration here. What some people are failing to recognise is that by sacking all these people, our Club won't exist. Do you actually want that? I know I don't. I appreciate we are at one of the lowest points in memory, but I still love our Club, and I still want to go to the footy next week.

I'm as frustrated as anyone on here, and Sunday was downright pathetic, disgusting, unacceptable, and all of the other words that have been used. But the answer is not to sack everyone. It doesn't achieve anything - the last 7 years should have taught you that. Sacking Daniher got us nowhere. Sacking Bailey got us nowhere. Sacking Neeld won't help either. Neither will sacking McLardy. Now more than ever the Club needs unity and stability on the inside. Sacking people will only make it worse (and yes, it can get worse).

I can tell you exactly what happened on Sunday. An attitude problem. The entire Club was guilty of believing their own crap. "We've had a fantastic pre-season". "We're setting elite standards on the track". "The training & rehab programs are unrecognisable to last year". "The wheel turns quickly". Etc. Etc.

That may all be so, but what all the players and coaching staff seemed to forget was that you still have to work hard and play the game to get a result. It seemed as if everyone rocked up to the ground thinking "We're so much better than last year, we'll cruise to a win today".

I am hoping that it was just a massive reality check for them all. Just because you set high standards in training, and you train really well, doesn't mean everything will "just click" on game day. Work hard on game day, and maybe you will see some results. Don't turn up and expect things to happen, because as we saw on Sunday, thats crap.

There may be many problems after Round 1, but sacking people is not going to fix the attitude problem that we saw on Sunday.

I'm rambling now - my two cents worth anyway. Agree with me or don't!

I didnt DR4

I keep saying we were showing signs that thinks were not wonderful.

I said our NAB form was poor.

I said we had made a lot of changes but not many of them were wonderful.

I got called pessimistic and it gives me zero pleasure to see my worst thoughts have come true.

Ramble away DR4 it helps me cope on days like Sunday

[old dee 22,963]

The "sack them" mentality isn't a knee jerk reaction, years upon years of ineptitude has finally lead to this.

MFC is broken, it must be fixed. There are poisonous elements at the club, they must be sought out and eradicated.

Or we can just keep going the way we have been and be no more in a couple of seasons. I would rather see heads roll then not having a club to support in 2015!

Me too!

[Range Rover 1,935]

There is nothing "knee-jerk" about being fed up with 101W - 32L, 13th or lower since '06. It's frankly an insult to use that term.

Quit kidding yourself that there's isn't an endemic problem with the culture of the footy club.

It's change or die at this point.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

There is nothing "knee-jerk" about being fed up with 101W - 32L, 13th or lower since '06. It's frankly an insult to use that term.

Quit kidding yourself that there's isn't an endemic problem with the culture of the footy club.

It's change or die at this point.

RR, we seem to be in agreement, yet you take exception to the use of the term "knee jerk" You and I are on the same page. It is just I would prefer to use the word "accountability". It is not just what you do, it is how you do it as well. Hence my reference to "knee jerk".

[Muvver Jones 64]

Something has to give. No amount of scorn and humiliation poured onto the players over the past 18 months has had a positive impact on performances. In fact they have stubbornly gotten worse. There has been much evidence that our problems have roots above FD level. There has been many fingers pointed to the likely culprits. Thats why the media has been savage on us, in particular Schwab. Getting rid of him is a small initial sacrifice and I am sure the monkey's will be flicked off the players backs. The way some posters act here it appears Schwab is far more important than the club. And I bet he has people posting here to influence supporters. Suits his style of spin mongering

Edited April 2, 2013 by Muvver Jones

[Range Rover 1,935]

RR, we seem to be in agreement, yet you take exception to the use of the term "knee jerk" You and I are on the same page. It is just I would prefer to use the word "accountability". It is not just what you do, it is how you do it as well. Hence my reference to "knee jerk".

Fair enough Iv'a. I think I was still fuming at the original post when I got to yours. I agree with what you said.

Accountablity indeed.

[rpfc 27,611]

I would rather see heads roll then not having a club to support in 2015!

They are not mutually exclusive, and you will have a club well beyond 2015. Don't be so alarmist.

I am all for firings and board challenges.

In October.

Edited April 2, 2013 by rpfc

[Sir Why You Little 34,752]

Yep, appreciate all of that IWS.

I certainly want the Club to do something to fix what happened on Sunday, I'm just not a fan of the old "sack them" mentality, as if that will really solve anything. Completely agree with your point that if you can't "get up" for the first game of a new season, and your best player in every regard was a debutant, then we have serious problems. I'm with you.

There was a point in the game less than 10 minutes in, where James Frawley just jogged along while his opponent in Westhoff, sprinted to get the ball and dish off a handball to Hartlett, who goaled from 55. Why did this happen? I don't want to single out Chip, as there were plenty of others in the same boat, but its Round 1. If you aren't motivated to work hard and stop your opponent 10 minutes into the game, will you ever be? The whole thing was bizarre.

But what motivated the entire playing group -3 to not come to play?

I don't think it was Neeld. It goes much deeper, & our opponents all know it to. Do not forget this.

Every week our opposition is now going to view us as nothing more than road kill.

This is the damage done from Sunday.

I agree with Robert Walls re Jack Watts. Put him at CHF and tell him to show the coach what you are made of.

Neeld must be bold this weekend or it will be futile

Edited April 2, 2013 by why you little

[Muvver Jones 64]

They are not mutually exclusive, and you will have a club well beyond 2015. Don't be so alarmist.

I am all for firings and board challenges.

In October.

You're just trying to buy time for them. If performances don't improve there will be a revolution long before then.

Edited April 2, 2013 by Muvver Jones

[dees_rule_4eva 22]

There is nothing "knee-jerk" about being fed up with 101W - 32L, 13th or lower since '06. It's frankly an insult to use that term.

Quit kidding yourself that there's isn't an endemic problem with the culture of the footy club.

It's change or die at this point.

I am not kidding myself RR - I completely agree that there is a massive culture problem. I don't believe I used the term "knee-jerk" in my post either, so I'm not sure how I've insulted you.

Change or die you say? Change everything now, after Round 1, and I guarantee the Club will go further and further backwards until the end of the season. At the end of the season, or even after a good chunk of the season, if things haven't improved and we are still a laughing stock, then make changes. Mass firings at this point in the season will only kill our Club. Which I don't want to see, no matter how angry I am.

[rpfc 27,611]

You're just trying to buy time for them. If performances don't improve there will be a revolution long before then.

I am trying to appease those who want blood and the restrictions of reality.

All those that want them gone NOWWWW!!!!! Ask yourself whether it is bloodlust or whether it is the best interests of the club in your heart.

[Outside fifty 967]

It's hardly surprising that the players didn't give a yelp on Sunday. After all they were simply following the example set by the club during the tanking fiasco. That was our line in the sand and we walked away with our tail between our legs. We proved yet again that we stand for nothing and are scared to stand tall. Where are the player supposed to find the lust for the fight when the club is run by a succession of spineless beige accountants types who are terrified at the thought of a contest. At least Jim had real passion for the club and was the only real President we've had in the last decade. We expect our players to be fearless and courageous on field and yet when we had our chance to defend ourselves and our integrity as a club we capitulated. Having said that I believe it's time we confronted our own perpetual inner weakness and stand firm till at least the end of the season.I believe It's too late to sack yet another coach. It will achieve next to nothing and deny Neeld the chance to see if can right the ship, even though like most of you I have doubts about his capabilities. Again sacking the CEO mid season will achieve nothing except ridicule and derision. For the record I have absolutely no knowledge of how effective Schwab is as a CEO or not. From afar he appears more style than substance. As for the board and the President. I am and always will be disgusted by the way they surrendered to the AFL ,but again lets wait till seasons end before we call them to account. I know that many will refute the connection between the tanking investigation and on field performance but I passionately believe that our club will never solve it's on field performance when our Board and Administration continually show a lack of resolve, passion and fortitude when confronted with adversity. Leadership and culture begins and ends at the top.

[Muvver Jones 64]

I am trying to appease those who want blood and the restrictions of reality.

All those that want them gone NOWWWW!!!!! Ask yourself whether it is bloodlust or whether it is the best interests of the club in your heart.

Best get rid of this turbulent trouble maker ASAP. Should have gone at 186. Consistent mediocrity and him are linked. No one wants to see at least another six months of the same tripe. Then we can see if Neeld can bloody well coach. If there is poison then get it out of the system quick before it becomes terminal. Edited April 2, 2013 by Muvver Jones

[Vipercrunch 2,818]

It's hardly surprising that the players didn't give a yelp on Sunday. After all they were simply following the example set by the club during the tanking fiasco. That was our line in the sand and we walked away with our tail between our legs. We proved yet again that we stand for nothing and are scared to stand tall. Where are the player supposed to find the lust for the fight when the club is run by a succession of spineless beige accountants types who are terrified at the thought of a contest. At least Jim had real passion for the club and was the only real President we've had in the last decade. We expect our players to be fearless and courageous on field and yet when we had our chance to defend ourselves and our integrity as a club we capitulated. Having said that I believe it's time we confronted our own perpetual inner weakness and stand firm till at least the end of the season.I believe It's too late to sack yet another coach. It will achieve next to nothing and deny Neeld the chance to see if can right the ship, even though like most of you I have doubts about his capabilities. Again sacking the CEO mid season will achieve nothing except ridicule and derision. For the record I have absolutely no knowledge of how effective Schwab is as a CEO or not. From afar he appears more style than substance. As for the board and the President. I am and always will be disgusted by the way they surrendered to the AFL ,but again lets wait till seasons end before we call them to account. I know that many will refute the connection between the tanking investigation and on field performance but I passionately believe that our club will never solve it's on field performance when our Board and Administration continually show a lack of resolve, passion and fortitude when confronted with adversity. Leadership and culture begins and ends at the top.

I think the tanking itself was a symptom of the problems within our club, not the investigation. It's been done to death but the AFL saved us by what they did as a result of the investigation. They've copped plenty of flack for it, while most people have said we must have expertly negotiated ourselves to a very good outcome.

The damage done to the playing group by the tanking itself (fragile confidences resulting from so many big losses and missing the boat when the AFL truly became the domain of elite sportman with elite standards) and the culture that led to thinking tanking would be a good idea - now that is where I see some of our problems.

No more quick fixes.

[rjay 23,993]

They are not mutually exclusive, and you will have a club well beyond 2015. Don't be so alarmist.

I am all for firings and board challenges.

In October.

I think you have said the same thing before 'rpfc' and it hasn't happened in October. A day wasted is one we never get back, I'm not interested in waiting and watching another year of sub standard performances.

[Flying Cloud 152]

It may turn out later this year that there is a relaisation that we do need to make changes. That may be at the Board, Admin or the Footy Dept. There may be a need to make a couple of changes. But can we please do it in a controlled and well thought through manner.

Mass sackings will not improve the teams on field success.

[Fat Tony 4,479]

Off field the club needs a voice to push for a better fixture and wealth redistribution. On field the team is badly lacking confidence and a caretaker coach may end up becoming our long-term replacement.

October is too long to wait for change. Never let a crisis go to waste.

[BrisbaneDemon 1,501]

It's hardly surprising that the players didn't give a yelp on Sunday. After all they were simply following the example set by the club during the tanking fiasco. That was our line in the sand and we walked away with our tail between our legs. We proved yet again that we stand for nothing and are scared to stand tall. Where are the player supposed to find the lust for the fight when the club is run by a succession of spineless beige accountants types who are terrified at the thought of a contest. At least Jim had real passion for the club and was the only real President we've had in the last decade. We expect our players to be fearless and courageous on field and yet when we had our chance to defend ourselves and our integrity as a club we capitulated. Having said that I believe it's time we confronted our own perpetual inner weakness and stand firm till at least the end of the season.I believe It's too late to sack yet another coach. It will achieve next to nothing and deny Neeld the chance to see if can right the ship, even though like most of you I have doubts about his capabilities. Again sacking the CEO mid season will achieve nothing except ridicule and derision. For the record I have absolutely no knowledge of how effective Schwab is as a CEO or not. From afar he appears more style than substance. As for the board and the President. I am and always will be disgusted by the way they surrendered to the AFL ,but again lets wait till seasons end before we call them to account. I know that many will refute the connection between the tanking investigation and on field performance but I passionately believe that our club will never solve it's on field performance when our Board and Administration continually show a lack of resolve, passion and fortitude when confronted with adversity. Leadership and culture begins and ends at the top.

I dont believe that we just rolled over Outside Fifty, i read that Connolly and Bailey confessed what went on and this led to their suspensions and the clubs 500k fine. I think that is a complete cop out for the playing group to say that because our president didnt go to court against the AFL thats why the boys didn't turn up. I just don't buy that. Either they just don't want to play for Neeld as they did Bailey and they think they can get him fired, or Neeld cannot coach, or the thought they were going to cruise to victory on sunday and were caught flat footed.

I am very interested to see what happens on the training track this week and the game on saturday night. The home truths spoken on Sunday could be the very thing that was required. Lets hope that certain players ripped through our entire back line, told our midfield (not including Viney, Toumpas and M.Jones) to stand up and stop being walked over every bloody game.

The new recruits that played up forward that that is not good enough, you play like that again and you will never suit up in the red and blue.

Next week we will have, Trengrove, Mcdonald and Dawes in the team. I just hope Dunn, Watts, Frawley and Garland were put on notice in the rooms. they were non existent. Its a scary thought when i would of preferred MacDonald in then any of them (i shudder typing that).

This group of players is playing for the future of our club, if this attitudes keeps up their won't be a MFC in years to come and i doubt they even know that!.