Who is ultimately responsible for taking Clark off at the 20 minute mark of the 1st Quarter?

In the first 20 minutes we'd hardly had the ball in our forward line and we hadn't employed the flood. Had Clark even set foot past the half forward line?

The few times we did get the ball down there Clark kicked 2 goals. The 2nd of which came at the 20 minute mark of the quarter. His 1st goal came at the 18 minute mark. Then he had to sprint to the wing for a 3 or 4 minute rest. Utterly ridiculous decision to take him off. Nonsensical.

The bloke was hot, he'd kicked 2 goals in 2 minutes and then he's benched. He didn't need a rest. The score at the time was 3.2 to 2.1. As soon as he was taken off I thought, who is going to take a mark if we pump it forward.

Might seem like a small thing now, but we'd just gotten back in the game on the back of Clark's efforts and then we take him off?

Yep, noticed the same thing. And even though he was doing nothing, took Sellar off at the same time so no tall targets.

You play for your team not the coach

I would be much more worried if he stood in the middle of the players and yelled "Let's get out there and kill 'em!!!!!!!!!!!!!" If you believe old school ra-ra is the modern way to coach you will believe Any Given Sunday is a good film.

Neeld aint the problem at this stage.

I don't know if you were at the game WYL, but we were clearly a mess structurally and were outcoached. Pretty obvious whose fault that is.

You play for your team not the coach

Yep, well that worked....

You buy into the leader before you buy into the vision

Who is ultimately responsible for taking Clark off at the 20 minute mark of the 1st Quarter?

In the first 20 minutes we'd hardly had the ball in our forward line and we hadn't employed the flood. Had Clark even set foot past the half forward line?

The few times we did get the ball down there Clark kicked 2 goals. The 2nd of which came at the 20 minute mark of the quarter. His 1st goal came at the 18 minute mark. Then he had to sprint to the wing for a 3 or 4 minute rest. Utterly ridiculous decision to take him off. Nonsensical.

The bloke was hot, he'd kicked 2 goals in 2 minutes and then he's benched. He didn't need a rest. The score at the time was 3.2 to 2.1. As soon as he was taken off I thought, who is going to take a mark if we pump it forward.

Might seem like a small thing now, but we'd just gotten back in the game on the back of Clark's efforts and then we take him off?

Neeld is not the only coach to take a player off immediately after they kick a goal. To me, it is the craziest trend in modern football and seems counter-productive in the extreme. i would like to know the rationale because the benefit to the team eludes me.

Neeld is not the only coach to take a player off immediately after they kick a goal. To me, it is the craziest trend in modern football and seems counter-productive in the extreme. i would like to know the rationale because the benefit to the team eludes me.

Falls under the manic fixation of 'rotations.'

I agree, it eludes me as well.

Neeld is not the only coach to take a player off immediately after they kick a goal. To me, it is the craziest trend in modern football and seems counter-productive in the extreme. i would like to know the rationale because the benefit to the team eludes me.

Excuse my ignorance, but does the coach have the say in every single interchange? I think the players sometimes make the call themselves, or have instruction to come off after so long on the field etc. I guess this is more relevant to the midfield though.

Exactly. We all had teachers we didn't like at high school and they never motivated me to do well. It was the ones I genuinely liked who I'd bother lifting a finger for. Even though these guys are professionals they still need a leader that is inspiring to go the extra mile. Think Malthouse, there's just something about the bloke that makes him a great inspiring coach and I don't think it is in Neeld..

Every player is different and every coach is different. For example, you think Malthouse is a "great inspiring coach". I, on the other hand, have never had any empathy for him at all and would probably respond negatively rather than positively to his coaching. On the other hand, I would respond very positively to Chris Scott.

Who is ultimately responsible for taking Clark off at the 20 minute mark of the 1st Quarter?

In the first 20 minutes we'd hardly had the ball in our forward line and we hadn't employed the flood. Had Clark even set foot past the half forward line?

The few times we did get the ball down there Clark kicked 2 goals. The 2nd of which came at the 20 minute mark of the quarter. His 1st goal came at the 18 minute mark. Then he had to sprint to the wing for a 3 or 4 minute rest. Utterly ridiculous decision to take him off. Nonsensical.

The bloke was hot, he'd kicked 2 goals in 2 minutes and then he's benched. He didn't need a rest. The score at the time was 3.2 to 2.1. As soon as he was taken off I thought, who is going to take a mark if we pump it forward.

Might seem like a small thing now, but we'd just gotten back in the game on the back of Clark's efforts and then we take him off?

Must agree Macca someone kicks a goal they go have a rest, why? they should use rotations to rotate tired players, those tired players should be on ballers who have given their all like PORT did. I hate seeing a forward sprint 100 meters to sit for 3 minutes then sprint 100 meters back. god leave him be and let him rest in position, unless he is absolutely spent.

As for Neelds video, he seemed to be saying man up, or body up. how is this consistent with Zoning?

I have never been a fan

However I don't think it has anything to do with the coach at present.

We are just a poor quality team.

JC could not get this lot up for the simple reason we have the worst list in the league.

No matter what way you look at it the guys that run out to play are not up to the mark.

During 2012 we were poor.

We made substantial change to the list at the end of 2012 but you cannot change a poor list overnight.

We added a few kids who cannot be expected to carry the team till 2015-6.

We added a couple of senior players who could not get regular games with their clubs.

We added a number of guys that did not make the grade with there first AFl club

We added a number of players that could not get drafted and showed some promise at state level.

We lost a good player in Rivers ( seemed to do alright yesterday )

IMO the nett result is not a big change in player stocks.

Add an existing list that has a serious lack of talent and has lost the mind set to win.

There will need to be another big list change at the end of 2013.

That is if we still have the will left to continue.

Not sure I do

You buy into the leader before you buy into the vision

But arent our two leaders the two Jacks? I wonder how these older more experienced and proven players feel playing under two such junior captains, especially Trenners who's form has been pretty patchy over the last year since taking on the captaincy. Do you reckon they are inspiring the team.

Knowing a number of players who played under Neeld at Ocean Grove, I'd say many would have played their arse of for him.

Yes, well, lower leagues, surf city, Ocean Grove you said. well He must have had the players down there totally Bluffed!!

Looking at this DVD does not inspire me one little bit!

Problem is you have to earn respect and amidst trying to ram a playing style which so far has not resulted in winning footy, players being delisted, traded, dropped It wouldn't surprise me if the players have any confidence in him at all!!

I may be wrong but there doesn't seem to be any two way communication link, just all one way rhettoric! and that "so called" steely glare is seemingly nothing more than window dressing to cover for the fact that I don't believe that he can coach at this level!

I just wonder how many of the players actually buy into his playing style whatever that may or may not be??

Give me a Swooper Northey anyday, knew when to fire up knew when to hold back. Involved the players, supporters, at a very inclusive level and almost pulled of a remarkable premiership!!

In answer to the poser, No, this man does not inspire me at all!

A short clip is not sufficient to judge, there are a few other traits that are also important that may not show through in a short youtube clip. Trust, Respect, history of success, etc that help make up the package. We have had inspirational coaches before i.e. Barassi to name one. we want a coach someone who knows what needs to be done and is able to get the players to buy in and deliver. I think this last part is the bit that is missing at the moment players are just not wanting to be the hardest team to play against.

The video was a carefully prepared edited, polished by the club product. I doubt it represents reality.

Neeld came in and asserted his way on the club and now has the playing list he picked. The issue is "What if he is wrong" what if in his arrogance that he cannot see what is bleeding obvious to many of us, that the game style isn't working. What if alienating the leadership group last year was wrong? What if installing 2 young rookie captains was wrong? What if recruiting 5 cast off's was wrong (ask Michael Voss)?

The group last year couldn't buy in or play his game style and this group doesn't appear to be able to either.

He is quoted as saying "I didn't see this coming" well there are many who said they could. He has put processes in place that he assumes once ticked off will make us a better team. He crosses the T's dots the I's and has his elite training program but the disconnect is, can he take a group of men and make them play good football.

The current answer is after 4 wins NO. Is he prepared to change?

Does he have the smarts and insights to try something different? Can he turn around a lost group? Does he have a plan B?

These are the questions that will be asked in the next month but given that he is single minded,pig headed, often angry and always thinks he is right, I doubt it.

Quality post!!

The video was a carefully prepared edited, polished by the club product. I doubt it represents reality.

Neeld came in and asserted his way on the club and now has the playing list he picked. The issue is "What if he is wrong" what if in his arrogance that he cannot see what is bleeding obvious to many of us, that the game style isn't working. What if alienating the leadership group last year was wrong? What if installing 2 young rookie captains was wrong? What if recruiting 5 cast off's was wrong (ask Michael Voss)?

The group last year couldn't buy in or play his game style and this group doesn't appear to be able to either.

He is quoted as saying "I didn't see this coming" well there are many who said they could. He has put processes in place that he assumes once ticked off will make us a better team. He crosses the T's dots the I's and has his elite training program but the disconnect is, can he take a group of men and make them play good football.

The current answer is after 4 wins NO. Is he prepared to change?

Does he have the smarts and insights to try something different? Can he turn around a lost group? Does he have a plan B?

These are the questions that will be asked in the next month but given that he is single minded,pig headed, often angry and always thinks he is right, I doubt it.

Watched video of Ross Lyon coaching once. His mantra seemed to be pressure and do the basics right. I worry Neeld is too into technical jiggery to be a decent coach. The game is too spontaneous for complicated systems.

Maybe the most revealing bit was when Neeld screams "Send the runner, we only have 5 backs". Pretty much summed up the situation on the weekend where we continually had players all over the shop and not manned up.

Now it's either the players fault or Neeeld's structure is too hard. I think we all hope its the coach because that's a relatively simple fix. If it's the players then we really are stuffed (again).

Yeah he reminds me of a [censored] teacher we all had!

No relationship!

No buy in!

Listen to the presser & he refers to how they were training last week to passing & exam!

WTF too much acadamea approach!

Coaching is about people mgt & getting the best of ur players!

I had a right b*tch of a teacher at high school, she was "cold" and "hard (some of the words i hear by some people on here in regards to Neeld) but guess what!?!

IT MADE ME WORK HARDER, She was the only teacher in my school that had the ability to see that I was gifted but very lazy, that I thought because I was smart I didn't need to study or do homework. It was because of this teacher, that not only my grades improved in her class but others because she got me to see my full potential!

Have a look at Colin Sylvia! Gifted but very lazy, under Mark Neeld and coming back from injury he was arguably our best player in the last half of the year.

Mark Neeld is a really good coach in my opinion.

He has trained the players to train like a professional team.

It wont be long before they play like one, have faith.. they want it more than we do

Mark Neeld is a really good coach in my opinion.

He has trained the players to train like a professional team.

It wont be long before they play like one, have faith.. they want it more than we do

I see no evidence of that.

In fact sunday was a continuation of 2012 but even worse.

It's a bit hard to assess whether Neeld can "coach" when we rarely get a fair dinkum effort from the players. The one time we did was against Essendon last year so he "coached" well that night.

The real question is whether he can "motivate". Again it's hard to judge because we have players who refuse to be motivated to go beyond their comfort zone regardless of who coaches them. Such as James Frawley and Colin Garland who now barely ever get out of a jog (they sometimes might put in an effort if they are playing on a big name opponent but seem to think they don't need to try on the lesser names and then get towelled up), Colin Sylvia who seems totally disinterested for the 99.9% of the game when the ball isn't in his hands, Mark Jamar who seems to assess very early when a contest is over switches off and just cruises around for the remainder.

We have plenty of players who aren't up to it but when players are up to it but won't go above and beyond then that isn't the coach that is all on them.

Lets all remember what this Guy has inherited for fark sake . . . . Gee he walked in to a well oiled ship didn't he.

I was gutted there at the G on Sunday . . . I saw none of the ball movement I saw at the NAB cup against North and St Kilda. It was truly extraordinary to watch !!

We witnessed a leadership group not willing to take control of a run on ! Whats wrong with bringing the game to a stand still and absorbing the energy of the game . . . Saking a coach is not the solution yet . . . . our playing group is woeful years of poor recruiting !!