On 11/10/2012 at 04:54, Red&BlueBlood said:

Cook GONE!!

Cook out to prove Dees wrong

Wants to prove Melbourne wrong. Good luck with that.

Some of us said months ago we'd get rid of Cook only to be told how mean we were by other posters; and that "talls take time". And of course they do, but you could also see he wasn't good enough for all of the reasons mentioned at the time.

I'm accepting apologies by PM.

His already proved us wrong. We drafted him expecting him to be a KPP....how wrong we were...

I just don't see it with Fitzpatrick. He has some very good attributes (speed in particular), but his negatives (mainly disposal) far outweigh the good.

I just read on the Facebook trades page that there is a 'mini-free agency' period from 1/11 to 13/11, which means that delisted players can be picked up as free agents with no compensation going to the previous team (assuming this info is correct).

Would this not mean that we're better off trying to trade Cook now, assuming we do want to delist him, to get something rather than nothing?

Lucas is Cooked, we're just finding some Spuds to serve up with him !!

Anyone know the latest on Farren Ray?

Good luck to Cook, shame we couldn't see him out there in the red and blue.

Good old BP that rascal, his got us again.

  On 10/10/2012 at 23:21, Good Times Grimes said:

Okay so put Sellar in the backline. But what about shifting Watts/Garland/McDonald forward to take the pressure off Clark? Or do you think that we should keep them all in the back half as well? I've watched some footage of Pedersen (I realized I've been spelling his name incorrectly up until now) and he looks pretty good, but I don't want to spend pick 20 on him.

Pretty much the only issue that I would have with getting one of Pedersen/Dawes/Gumbleton would be spending pick 20. I'm fine with packaging a player+later pick for one of them, but I think we need to try our luck at drafting a good midfielder.

I'm not sure why you would shift Garland/McDonald or Watts forward... Watts would be the most likely if anything, but he seems like he will be our distributor from our half back flank/wing atm. Garland will probably take the small forward depending on how nicholson and strauss develop, McDonald is locked into CHB... no way we're going to move him from that position. I think that adding one of Pederson/Gumbleton will be important to our structure, now that we have a core of players we think will move us forward it is important to get consistency of our back 6 and KPFs to allow our team to really develop and play to the structures Neeld is trying to teach them. Throwing players forward and back really hinders their development, even though it might allow for flexibility, playing a player forward and back week to week really would mess with their form and consistency.

  On 11/10/2012 at 04:54, Red&BlueBlood said:

Cook GONE!!

Cook out to prove Dees wrong

Will be traded or delisted, i dont know what Cook has done wrong, says he is up to 91kgs so would be able to give something a crack imo

Dreadful waste of a pick 12 if they de list him after 2 years imo

  On 11/10/2012 at 05:02, Ben-Hur said:

Some of us said months ago we'd get rid of Cook only to be told how mean we were by other posters; and that "talls take time". And of course they do, but you could also see he wasn't good enough for all of the reasons mentioned at the time.

I'm accepting apologies by PM.

You can't see the contradiction there ? You agree that talls take time in one breath but you wont concede time to Cook because right now he isnt good enough - how does that work ?

I have no idea if he will make it or not and on EARLY INDICATIONS you could well be right. Here's the flipside - he is very young and under-developed and might make it.

With smaller lists and a greater need for instant success giving time is a now a commodity in short supply but I get that.

You will get zero apologies from me for your flawed logic but I am more than happy to come back and say you were 100% right when he is given a couple of years by another club and turns out to be a dud.

Yes talls or kpp take longer, so the theory goes,though I actually am starting to wonder if that's just a crock of sh!te started by some tall (sponsored by potatoes Australia). People are different, players are different, some are ready to go with a short run up ,others take a frigging eternity and some are just non-starters and get scratched.

I reckon Cook is the latter category. You open the box and it's doa. Send it back, get another.

gone are the days now , when you can keep a player on your list just to wait and see , its a shame as he was pick 12. i think we will see more of this as some players take longer than others. teams now want success quicker and us as supports want it NOW and cant wait.

  On 11/10/2012 at 05:09, Choke said:

I just read on the Facebook trades page that there is a 'mini-free agency' period from 1/11 to 13/11, which means that delisted players can be picked up as free agents with no compensation going to the previous team (assuming this info is correct).

Would this not mean that we're better off trying to trade Cook now, assuming we do want to delist him, to get something rather than nothing?

In the article on him, I think it said no other club was interested in a trade for him. Unbelievable, a pick 12 and 2 years later, totally unwanted. He will be rookied by someone for nothing.

  On 11/10/2012 at 06:01, Jordie_tackles said:

Will be traded or delisted, i dont know what Cook has done wrong, says he is up to 91kgs so would be able to give something a crack imo

Dreadful waste of a pick 12 if they de list him after 2 years imo

Def waste of a pick, ill say for the 1000's time on Demonland - should of gone for Darling!!

But in saying that he should of mad all this "extra effort" and put in the "extra sessions" before his career was on the line...

IMO We should offer him a 1 year contract and give him NAB cup time to show us he is better than the Casey reserves.

Good luck to Cook.

It didn't work out with us, probably for a variety of reasons, but perhaps it will second time around for him.

  On 11/10/2012 at 06:05, nutbean said:

You can't see the contradiction there ? You agree that talls take time in one breath but you wont concede time to Cook because right now he isnt good enough - how does that work ?

There were aspects of his play that caused me to not see him developing to a quality AFL standard. It's a judgment call. Could he get to a James Sellar standard in time ? Possibly, not definitely, and that's not good enough anyway. For me that would be his ceiling and I'd cut him accordingly. Obviously the club agrees. I would have been staggered if they hadn't.

I posted the following 2 months ago:

"I've seen him live a number of times now, including against cellar dwellars Frankston, and the guy couldn't be more underwhelming. He's slow, there's not an aggressive bone in his body, he didn't work hard, and didn't read the play well. He's an OK mark, a good kick, he supposedly has excellent endurance, he's a good decision maker (when he gets it) but not much more."

Hawthorn made early judgment calls on top 10 picks Beau Dowler and Mitch Thorpe. West Coast did with Tony Notte. Adelaide did with Fergus Watts. Skilled football watchers make calls on young talls because they don't envisage enough upside. They don't always get it right, but they invariably do. Essendon made the call on Jenkins, but it looks like they got that one wrong.

I'm rapt that we now have people at the club that are prepared to make calls on poor draft selections. Keep in mind, Nut, that Sydney have turned over 33 players in the last 3 years. We need to turn our list over.

If it looks like a dud, smells like a dud, plays like a dud, it's in all likelihood a dud. I'm enjoying seeing these duds on the chopping block.

Cook was a flawed pick. He was tipped to go late second round but we picked him at 12. Another grasp at a KPP by a club that had made an art out of overpaying for dud big men. I'm optimistic that this has finally changed. Hogan and time will tell!

  On 11/10/2012 at 04:21, rolly said:

they dont have to be as good as cox and nic nat, just play a similair role.

Fitzy played the year as a fwd pinch hitting the ruck very well at casey all year and if his development continues next year he could be every bit as useful as dawes or gumby.

2013 fwd line- byrnes clark fitz

sylvia watts howe

if you rotate fitz with jamar throughout the match i think we could retain solid structure and not have to give up a first rnd pick on a caretaker kpf

I see your point Rolly, but that fwd line you suggest is not much better, if at all, than what we started with this season.

Try:

Byrnes, Dawes/Ped/Gumby, Silvia

Fitzy, Clark, Davey

With Jamar or Gawn drifting in as 3rd or 4th big.

Watts will stay in back line for time being, as will Sellar, Garland and Rivers (if they stay)

Howe will play more in midfield perhaps drifting fwd, swapping with Sylvia.

Out: Martin (trade), Green (ret), Jurrah (delist), Cook (delist).

  On 11/10/2012 at 05:06, Clint Bizkit said:

I just don't see it with Fitzpatrick. He has some very good attributes (speed in particular), but his negatives (mainly disposal) far outweigh the good.

I agree clint I think his a very average player at best probably a pretty decent Vfl player at best maybe I will be proved wrong.

  On 11/10/2012 at 06:28, Redleg said:

In the article on him, I think it said no other club was interested in a trade for him. Unbelievable, a pick 12 and 2 years later, totally unwanted. He will be rookied by someone for nothing.

No other club wants to PAY to get him.

And why would they, when he's probably not worth it, and they could likely sign him for free?

  On 11/10/2012 at 04:54, Red&BlueBlood said:

Cook GONE!!

Cook out to prove Dees wrong

Anyone else think that HUN article reads like a Trading Post ad:

Tall forward - low mileage (Currently 0). Recently installed 3kg weight gain.

Former Top 20 draft pick. Switched on, dedicated footballer.

Recently delisted but willing to travel - Rookie list OK.

Free to good home.

  On 11/10/2012 at 06:57, Ben-Hur said:

...

Hawthorn made early judgment calls on top 10 picks Beau Dowler and Mitch Thorpe. West Coast did with Tony Notte. Adelaide did with Fergus Watts. Skilled football watchers make calls on young talls because they don't envisage enough upside. They don't always get it right, but they invariably do. Essendon made the call on Jenkins, but it looks like they got that one wrong.

...

Pretty sure Essendon just didn't think he was ready and wanted to keep him as a rookie, but Adelaide's astute recruiting team identified him and sold him on the opportunity for immediate first grade footy.

My understanding was less about Essendon, and more about the Crows (although Hird didn't rate him highly enough to fight hard enough to keep him).

  On 11/10/2012 at 06:57, Roost It said:

Cook was a flawed pick. He was tipped to go late second round but we picked him at 12. Another grasp at a KPP by a club that had made an art out of overpaying for dud big men. I'm optimistic that this has finally changed. Hogan and time will tell!

Melbourne football club have made this an artform over the years