imagine if sellars or martin could step up in defence along with garland and rivers to a level where chip could be freed up to play a harry o'brien style defencive role.

think about it, he's strong enough and good enough overhead to win the contest at half back and the way he ran down lewis jetta on the MCG wing a couple of years back proves he has the pace,..

very reliant on afore mentioned players stepping up and that is a massive if

In your opinion... which, by the way, is no more and no less valid than that of anyone else who might believe they could lead the midfield to a top 4 finish.

If you believe Moloney and Jones can be part of a top 4 midfield then my opinion is far more valid than yours. Name the last top 4 club with a C grade midfield

With Jones and Moloney leading the midfield we won't finish top 4, simple

They need some help but I think they'll be an integral part of a successful Melbourne midfield.

If you believe Moloney and Jones can be part of a top 4 midfield then my opinion is far more valid than yours. Name the last top 4 club with a C grade midfield

Moloney and Jones are well above "C" grade. As I said, your opinion is no more valid than anyone else's, and you have said nothing to change that... in fact, you may have even managed to undermine your own position.

Edited November 29, 201113 yr by hardtack

Moloney and Jones are well above "C" grade. As I said, your opinion is no more valid than anyone else's, and you have said nothing to change that... in fact, you may have even managed to undermine your own position.

Perhaps 'C' grade is a little harsh, but probably isn't far off being accurate. We probably have in the bottom 2-3 midfield groups in the AFL, AT THE MOMENT.

That doesn't mean we can improve.

But... I have to agree with RI in one aspect. we won't come top 4 until Jones and Moloney are our 4th and 5th best midfielders, not our 1st and 2nd best.

We are missing 2-3 gun midfielders from being top 4 team.

We have 3 first rounders next draft, plus hopefully Gysberts and McKenzie or Grimes come on... but that is all potential and hope

Perhaps 'C' grade is a little harsh, but probably isn't far off being accurate. We probably have in the bottom 2-3 midfield groups in the AFL, AT THE MOMENT.

That doesn't mean we can improve.

But... I have to agree with RI in one aspect. we won't come top 4 until Jones and Moloney are our 4th and 5th best midfielders, not our 1st and 2nd best.

We are missing 2-3 gun midfielders from being top 4 team.

We have 3 first rounders next draft, plus hopefully Gysberts and McKenzie or Grimes come on... but that is all potential and hope

I don't really care if they are our 4th and 5th best... I am simply saying that I believe they can be effective when we are pushing for a top 4 finish. And was I dreaming when I was reading comments by many media pundits regarding the Jamar/Moloney pairing being one of the best in the comp?

I don't really care if they are our 4th and 5th best... I am simply saying that I believe they can be effective when we are pushing for a top 4 finish. And was I dreaming when I was reading comments by many media pundits regarding the Jamar/Moloney pairing being one of the best in the comp?

Have a look at their stats against any top 6 side. Really goes to the heart of my point. I'll admit to being overly harsh in trying to prove a point. Jones is an honest toiler with several defiencies. Moloney is a battering ram who tends to grab and release. I'm really looking forward to one serious jet to enter our midfield to back up Grimes, Trengove, soon Viney and hopefully one of Gysberts, Morton or Blease plus at least one B++ from our 2 compo picks. Scully was to be that man but in case anyone missed it he and his old man screwed the system for 6.78 miillion.

for what its worth, Blease tweeted today about training with the forwards. Surprise 2012 crumber??

Perhaps 'C' grade is a little harsh, but probably isn't far off being accurate. We probably have in the bottom 2-3 midfield groups in the AFL, AT THE MOMENT.

That doesn't mean we can improve.

But... I have to agree with RI in one aspect. we won't come top 4 until Jones and Moloney are our 4th and 5th best midfielders, not our 1st and 2nd best.

We are missing 2-3 gun midfielders from being top 4 team.

We have 3 first rounders next draft, plus hopefully Gysberts and McKenzie or Grimes come on... but that is all potential and hope

I agree, what is important is getting A grade midfielders, especially those who have great disposal by foot... One of the biggest problems we as a team is the inability to hit targets under pressure. Looking at all good teams (Hawthorn, Collingwood, Geelong, St Kilda) have a large number of players that have high disposal efficiency. That is something we lack a lot of.

From the sounds of it Jack Viney is good in and under, haven't heard much about his kicking efficiency, hopefully with the two priority picks we are able to find these types of players.

Also how can you question the quality of Beamer. He can go missing in games against good teams because he has no help. Teams won't bother tagging players like mckenzie, gysberts etc thus can place more emphasis on beamer. In a quality midfield, beamer would be a much better player than what he is at the moment.

if Moloney is C grade then there are 8 players in the comp who are A or B , according to this years brownlow

if Moloney is C grade then there are 8 players in the comp who are A or B , according to this years brownlow

You don't understand C&B, Moloney plays for the MFC so he automatically gets a "C" rating ;-)

If you believe Moloney and Jones can be part of a top 4 midfield then my opinion is far more valid than yours. Name the last top 4 club with a C grade midfield

Seriously "roost it" I think you validate your opinion higher than others may do, that may sound harsh but to think your view has more meaning than others, get over yourself. This midfield is developing and will take some more time, Eagles midfield was D grade at best in 2010 step in Shuey & Gaff allowing Emlbey to play as an outsider and on the wing, a fit Kerr although he didn't last the season and doesn't have that much more footy left in him and they had an A grade midfield in 2011.

The changes in our list and development in 3rd & 4th year players will see us with a B grade midfield and take pressure of Maloney & Jones similar to what happended last season for Priddis and Embley. I don't kid myself we will flick the switch and be a Top 6 side next season but I really don't think we are that far away from making the 8 and with the growing maturity in our list cementing Top 6 to Top 4 regularly after 2013

I think the idea that Moloney and Jones can't qualify as premiership midfielders is equally incorrect as the idea that they can lead a premiership midfield.

I think the idea that Moloney and Jones can't qualify as premiership midfielders is equally incorrect as the idea that they can lead a premiership midfield.

I agree. Both have a place in our midfield - the issue is that they're currently our best midfielders. It's the same old issue of posters not being able to see that there's some middle ground between stardom and hackdom - and these guys both live there.

I agree. Both have a place in our midfield - the issue is that they're currently our best midfielders. It's the same old issue of posters not being able to see that there's some middle ground between stardom and hackdom - and these guys both live there.

I would argue that with more support, they may be just a step away from stardom... the Jamar/Moloney combination was certainly heading that way until injury intervened.

I think the idea that Moloney and Jones can't qualify as premiership midfielders is equally incorrect as the idea that they can lead a premiership midfield.

Yes, quite.

People love their blanket statements, RI included.

The beauty is in the grey.

I go with this rule and it rarely steers me wrong: if your view isn't nuanced, it's probably wrong.

I go with this rule and it rarely steers me wrong: if your view isn't nuanced, it's probably wrong.

Ironically, that's a pretty black-and-white statement (not that I'm saying it's wrong).

It reminds me of the old Jedi saying "Only Sith deal in absolutes." Derp.

Ironically, that's a pretty black-and-white statement (not that I'm saying it's wrong).

It reminds me of the old Jedi saying "Only Sith deal in absolutes." Derp.

The Exception Rule

There is an exception to every rule.

Except that rule.

Which would be the exception to the 'exception rule.'

Thus validating the exception rule.

This is patented to rpfc Inc. and any reproduction must acquire the written authorisation of rpfc Inc.

The Exception Rule

There is an exception to every rule.

Except that rule.

Which would be the exception to the 'exception rule.'

Thus validating the exception rule.

This is patented to rpfc Inc. and any reproduction must acquire the written authorisation of rpfc Inc.

Kurt Gödel would be proud!

People say this, but my memory is different, my biggest memory of Moloney in 2011 is during the 182, he literally pushed Jordie Mckenzie off his feet at a clearance because he was in his way, Moloney ran straight past/through a team mate to make a clearance late in the 3rd when the game was already blown past 120 points, this is what i remember. Very few players dominate when their team isnt playing well, and he isnt in a team that plays well often atm, only the best few in the league did this Judd ect. Moloney is great midfielder imo and would look super in a top 4 side.

Get your facts rightbefore posting!

Moloney is a flat track bully and will never be an elite AFL player. At best he is a good midfielder at AFL level.

Get your facts rightbefore posting!

Moloney is a flat track bully and will never be an elite AFL player. At best he is a good midfielder at AFL level.

Geeezz Does he owe you money or something. I assume you played AFL footy and you were an A grader????? Get off the lads back. He was our best player this year in a poor side What else do you want from him?????

Get your facts rightbefore posting!

Moloney is a flat track bully and will never be an elite AFL player. At best he is a good midfielder at AFL level.

Please explain before making crap sweeping statements like this...doesnt help your argument when you dont.

In a top midfield we would all see how good Moloney would be.

Do people wait and think why he is good against lower teams? maybe it is because the other players in our midfield can actually help him, rather than being cut to pieces by the Geelongs and Collingwoods of the competition.

AFL is a team game, very few players can dominate in a crap team, Judd at Carlton, Ablett at Geelong, but these guys arnt just A grade they are stars of the game in general.

You want Moloney to dominate against the best teams when they have 3-4 A grade players of genuine ability and so many people are willing to say that our best midfielder is a C grader or B at best, what does that say about they guys he is working with?

You cannot win a midfield battle with one player.... it takes 10 and 23 good players on the ground playing good football to compete with the bad teams not to mention to better ones.

So when he seems like a flat track bully as people say maybe it is just that he has the resources around him to help him dominate, resources we lack when we play better teams. because they are better than us atm, some quite significantly.

Please explain before making crap sweeping statements like this...doesnt help your argument when you dont.

In a top midfield we would all see how good Moloney would be.

Do people wait and think why he is good against lower teams? maybe it is because the other players in our midfield can actually help him, rather than being cut to pieces by the Geelongs and Collingwoods of the competition.

AFL is a team game, very few players can dominate in a crap team, Judd at Carlton, Ablett at Geelong, but these guys arnt just A grade they are stars of the game in general.

You want Moloney to dominate against the best teams when they have 3-4 A grade players of genuine ability and so many people are willing to say that our best midfielder is a C grader or B at best, what does that say about they guys he is working with?

You cannot win a midfield battle with one player.... it takes 10 and 23 good players on the ground playing good football to compete with the bad teams not to mention to better ones.

So when he seems like a flat track bully as people say maybe it is just that he has the resources around him to help him dominate, resources we lack when we play better teams. because they are better than us atm, some quite significantly.

Here Here Jordie

He's a good midfielder JT. And an elite clearance player.

But he goes missing against the best teams and I can only think of excuses for him, and I think even he wouldn't accept those.

He needs to get better if he wants to be anything more than a B+ mid and have achance to be in a flag winning side.

It's interesting reading all this stuff about the List Analysis and all based on Last Seasons list.

The slate has been wiped clean. Let's not make up a lot of BS, when we don't even know what the totally new FD has in mind.

I can't wait to see what unfolds in the new year, watching the changes in roles the team members have to play.

I'm quite certain it won't be the same old crap we've been dealt for the last 4 years.

The Mid Field will certainly not be the same. The same goes for the Forwards and backs.

Neeld wants things to improve so he will change things accordingly.