Our Recruiting

[Guest Rojik of the Arctic]

Draft for Tomorrow.

Trade for Today.

Love it. Maybe it should be the banner for the site.

[rpfc 27,685]

The anti-oracle!

The fundamental flaw!

At it again...

2006 great. Frawley, Garland, and Petterd. Important defenders and valuable forward.

2007 good, could be great if Morton is as good as I think he will be.

2008 too early to tell but Strauss and Blease need to show something soon. Jurrah and Mckenzie were drafted here, no?

2009 too early but potential is for that draft to be defining for our future.

2010 ??

[Arrow 1,257]

Dane Swan. Considered one of the AFL's best players and I'd trade my left leg to get him at the dees.

Drafted pick 58 in the 2001 draft, at the end of the 2005 he averaged 13 touches a game. For a midfielder 4 years in you would consider these stats to be poor stats. In fact, one Brad Miller in 04-05 averaged just one possession less as a Forward.

It took until 2008 for Swan to average the 30 possessions he averages now, and turn into the elite player he has become.

My question is why are so many posters keen on wanting 'Brad Millers' who can be bright early and dim into a VFL'er when for all we truly know we are developing a beautiful Swan. (pardon the pun)

Food for thought

[sylvinator 96]

Dane Swan. Considered one of the AFL's best players and I'd trade my left leg to get him at the dees.

Drafted pick 58 in the 2001 draft, at the end of the 2005 he averaged 13 touches a game. For a midfielder 4 years in you would consider these stats to be poor stats. In fact, one Brad Miller in 04-05 averaged just one possession less as a Forward.

It took until 2008 for Swan to average the 30 possessions he averages now, and turn into the elite player he has become.

My question is why are so many posters keen on wanting 'Brad Millers' who can be bright early and dim into a VFL'er when for all we truly know we are developing a beautiful Swan. (pardon the pun)

Food for thought

Very well said.

Your point is even more poignant since we are a developing team not yet in our window, so ideally we actually WANT our players to prime in 2013 and beyond.

We are not Collingwood who are now looking for recruits (primarily through trading) that can impact here and now. We are about building a team for 2013 and beyond.

The question is therefore not whether the past 4 year draft choices have performed adequately thus far in their careers. The question is actually whether they will be doing so in 2-3 years time.

There are very few choices made by our recruiters in the past 3-4 years which you can't be at least a little bit excited about as a prospect for the future.

[nutbean 8,837]

I'm not sure why there's such angst towards the Freakster. You may not agree with his views, but it's quite reasonable to discuss drafts even if it's too early to draw definitive conclusions.

Therein lies the problem - measured opinions on 2008 are fine but definite conclusions do my head in.

Has Watts been quick to progress - not really.

Has Watts shown improvement - steady but not stunning

Has Watts shown glimpses of his talent - yes

Will Watts be a superstar no 1 pick - ask me again when he hits 23

Would I take Hurley/NicNat before Watts - at the time Watts was considered the prize no 1 pick. No - but ask me again when they are all 23.

[The Great One 99 125]

07 was not a very strong draft IMO. I still think Morton could turn out to be a good selection. If I remember correctly, there was talk that we were going to take Masten if the Eagles didn't. That being the case, I am pretty happy we got Morty.

2007 Kreuzer 1 and Cotchin 2, have turned out about right, apart from injurys.

Apart from that, in the top 20 I would rate :

Dangerfield, Rioli, Grimes, Grant in the next bunch.

I think we did ok.

[bing181 8,357]

FWIW:

Craig Lees:

VFL stats from the weekend! Nicholson 33 Fieldsend 28, Blease 28, Jetta 28, Evans 27, Petterd, Bate, MacDonald 26.

Sam is getting there, think we'll see a bit of him later in the year.

Also impressive from Nicholson and Evans - well done Barry!

FWIW, I've seen more than one article linking Morton with GWS (out of contract end of this year). Agreed, he's still flying under the radar, but seems to be rated by people who actually know something about footy and recruiting.

[Geddy Lee 582]

What also may be interesting is to see which of our picks were rated where they went, and which were surprising early.

Guys like Shuey were rated 'higher' than Strauss and Blease but it seems BP placed a major emphasis on getting guys who had already played together and were very unlikely to want to return home. Thus we have a lot of guys who played for Vic Metro from the same group. We played it very 'safe' - one could argue (at the time) that Strauss was an 'inspired choice' or he was a 'safe choice' and I lean towards the latter viewpoint. Same goes for Cook, Blease, Maric and probably a few others.

So they've come to Melbourne already knowing each other and are perhaps less intimidated by the standards of each other's performance.

It's an unhelpful dynamic IMO.

[Roost It 1,434]

FWIW, I've seen more than one article linking Morton with GWS (out of contract end of this year). Agreed, he's still flying under the radar, but seems to be rated by people who actually know something about footy and recruiting.

We don't want to lose Morton. As has been said by others, he's tall, skilled and relatively fast and has sensational endurance. In 4 years time he, Watts and Cook could be serving up some real pain in the MFC forward line.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

You dont get it, the players that are drafted need to have an immediate impact, irrespective of.. well anything. If Cook doesnt come out and kick 16 on debut, or if Gawn does not have 49 hit outs in his first outing, they will be murdered....

(that was sarcasm btw)

Watts has played over 20 games but just go right ahead and exaggerate with your 'on debut' comments, it does your argument no favours

if you think Watts and Morton currently look like a #1 and #4 draft pick you need to take a good hard look at yourself

look how Trengove is going, that is what you expect from a top pick

[Geddy Lee 582]

Watts has played over 20 games but just go right ahead and exaggerate with your 'on debut' comments, it does your argument no favours

if you think Watts and Morton currently look like a #1 and #4 draft pick you need to take a good hard look at yourself

look how Trengove is going, that is what you expect from a top pick

Maybe look at their heights and builds and check out the progress of similarly proportioned draftees (Gumbleton, Butcher, Hansen).

Y'know, just for argument's sake.

[QueenC 74]

Watts has played over 20 games but just go right ahead and exaggerate with your 'on debut' comments, it does your argument no favours

if you think Watts and Morton currently look like a #1 and #4 draft pick you need to take a good hard look at yourself

look how Trengove is going, that is what you expect from a top pick

Ahh yes of course, because all players, despite height, growth, injury etc, must absolutely develop at the same pace.

Otherwise they are called upon as failures......

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

Oh jesus... Hang your head in shame.

This is not a dig at our recruiting team but I think our recruiting over the last 3-4 seasons has been very much a mixed bag. We picked up Cale Morton at pick 4 in the 07 draft. If we had our time again we wouldn't have done so.

That's true of 90% of draft picks. Hindsight makes everyone a professional. Pointless post. Haven't you been doing this long enough now to know that's ridiculous?

We overlooked Cyril Rioli, Patrick Dangerfield and Jarrad Grant to pick him.

Yeah, yeah. Only Dangerfield and Rioli I would have taken ahead, and they had their reasons why they dropped lower. Anyway, tis is true of EVERY pick 4 ever... There's ALWAYS a few players below that turn out to be superstars. We got our bit of luck with Grimes and Tappy... Be thankful we got THAT at least.

Pick 14 however went to Jack Grimes however which offsets the poor selection of Morton in my opinion.

Operative words there "in your opinion"

2008, we picked up Jack Watts which 95% of us have great concerns over.

We do?

We all probably started off with expectations of him being a superstar but now have probably re-assessed and simply hope for him to be a good player.

Says who?

Not something you want from a pick 1. We overlooked Naitanui(who whilst inconsistent has shown a lot more than Watts)

According to who?

We chose Strauss and Blease who have yet to show anything at afl level.

I'll give you this one. I thought McKernan was a star, and is better so far than those kids combined, though Blease (who I've always been sus on) is an unknown entity. But even then, this is the same old hindsight garbage every teenager throws up on bigfooty. For shame Freak, I thought you outgrew this childishness.

Also Tapscott has finally started adding weight to my argument that he is our most promising youngster that I claimed as soon as we picked him at 18.

So what is this thread about? You and "your" predictions that half the site made before you, or is it about a discussion on drafting. Seems to me you're just taking the opportunity to talk about yourself and your own opinions.

2010. Cook was picked up solely because the recruiting team were not impressed with what Watts has shown thus far. No, he wasn't picked up to be used in conjunction with Watts (ala twin towers), he was picked up because they were concerned Watts wasn't going to cut it.

What? WHAAAAAT?! Fair dinkum you are full of crap. I'm not even going to dignify this with a serious response.

Good news is that Cook has already shown more than Watts at afl.

????? SAYS WHO?!!

Not to mention the signing of Jack Viney which seems to be some sort of Footy God blessing after losing Scully to GWS.

So you're excited about a teenager who's barely out of puberty and hasn't even signed yet. You are relapsing Freak...

One of the worst threads of the year for mine.

[nutbean 8,837]

Maybe look at their heights and builds and check out the progress of similarly proportioned draftees (Gumbleton, Butcher, Hansen).

Y'know, just for argument's sake.

Shout at a brick wall - it will do you as much good.

Despite AFL history littered with examples of what you are saying, to the extent that any commentator worth his salt repeats the same old adage - "big blokes generally take longer to come on", this message will still not get through.

Save your fingers.

[QueenC 74]

Shout at a brick wall - it will do you as much good.

Despite AFL history littered with examples of what you are saying, to the extent that any commentator worth his salt repeats the same old adage - "big blokes generally take longer to come on", this message will still not get through.

Save your fingers.

Sad isn't it.....

[Slartibartfast 16,121]

Morton - I seem to be one of the few (along with Ron) that reckons this guy will be pivotal to any future success.

You must have missed his thread calling for Morton to be traded.

I agree with just about all of what you've said but I still hold hopes for Bennell. He just needs to get the ball.....

[Whispering_Jack 28,118]

IMO Gysberts may well be the best of our 2009 drafting group when history is written. His kicking is fine because he stays within his abilities.

You would have to write Tom Scully out of history in that case but I hear what you're saying. IMO Trengove, Gysberts and Tapscott would make a fantastic trio to recruit in any one draft but when you add Scully, you end up sounding like Bruce McAveney. Then there's Big Max who was also in that draft. Deliciouuus!

Also, it might be far too early but a few of the rookies we drafted at the end of 2010 are looking likely prospects.

[Whispering_Jack 28,118]

Strauss - poor pick. Went earlier than expected and just doesn't have the competitiveness required at AFL level.

I thought the same until I saw him play at Port Melbourne last week and his first half in that game was ordinary to say the least. Then, out of the blue, he started doing a few things that suggest he might be able to justify his top 20 drafting. He has always been a good clean kick but seemed hesitant as if overawed by just being out there on the ground. Suddenly, he showed he was prepared to run and back his judgement and he looked so much better. A week later and he's in the best players at Casey against the Roosters. Sometimes, it's a confidence thing but you write off a kid like that at your own peril.

[jayceebee31 692]

The only one you've listed, that I share concerns over, Is Morton... I'm very concerned about our lack of ruggedness in our team play. Yes I want class a plenty,,, But, we need to play a harder brand of footy. IMO it's only going to happen if ewe instill a culture lead from the top, of physvcality and hard but responsible leadership. + ruthlessness....

Where is it coming from, Moloney is shown to still be a work in progress leader.

If it is not demanded, that we play physical football, it aint gonna happen. This is where I worry for Morton, but also Bennell, he's got a touch of class, but no sign of regular courage.

Watts I think will fall into line. I've seen him back into packs and tackle, draw the tackler etc, and he has the quick reactions necessary to be a player.

Morton is like the dwarf 'sleepy', slow as treacle, in his movements and reactions. Worry how he'll go in High Intensity games on the big stage.

Whilst I genrerally agree with you my friend- I cannot agree on this one- I think we have many players on our list that are agreesive,they are: Bartram, Dunn, Frawley,Jamar, Jones, McKenzie, Moloney, Rivers, Sylvia, Tapscott and Trengove all fit into my best 22 and are all hard at the pill.

[Felix 92]

Watts has played over 20 games but just go right ahead and exaggerate with your 'on debut' comments, it does your argument no favours

if you think Watts and Morton currently look like a #1 and #4 draft pick you need to take a good hard look at yourself

look how Trengove is going, that is what you expect from a top pick

you idiot, it was not a argument it was a sarcastic comment... Hence me writing it at the bottom.

[Mad_Melbourne 872]

your post makes me somewhat

but yes, it is understandable that with hindsight we may have picked other players, just like every other team, at least we didnt pick up tambling!

Edited April 18, 2011 by Mad_Melbourne