buck_nekkid

Yes. Depression is episodic, and at the time he may very well have met the criteria for a diagnosis of 'depression'. That and his current acts may or may not be directly related. If he was running a negative past orientation and stable attribution style (I'm injured, have been for ages, will never get better...) thinking process, then helplessness, hopelessness, social isolation and depressed mood would have all been realistic outcomes for him. We are not in a position to judge that. We are in a position to judge his current (expected) actions, however. If he is running a comorbid anxiety, and he believes that the MFC may act as a trigger to 'kick off' his depression again, I could understand his reluctance. However, avoidance is a poor coping strategy. Would need to address the external locus of control (it's the MFC, I have no responsibility for my response), stable (it will always be like that) and negative expectation. Suggest if a clinician has advised avoidance, he has been poorly advised. Seems to me there is a lot more going on, and MFC may be exercising more control than we give them credit for. Let's see how it plays out.

Mark Evans may have other things on his mind depending how the druggies go in court tomorrow. Hope they get drilled big time, and show cause notices stand. Become infraction notices. That'll STTFU. And make me smile. Then I'd say in the commission hearing "and how did your "special assistance" work out for you, Evo?...that's right, infraction notices."

Why does everyone want to trade Toumpas? In a club like Hawthorn, he may have been lucky to get one senior game and have been developing in the magoos. Unfortunately we have to push him forward because our cupboards are so bare. If we kept him and developed him, I wonder if that is better than trading him off for less value than he can offer us. Let's get serious, there is half a list I would get rid of before this kid.

Fined for betting in Adelaide. Involved in Essendons drug fiasco. Puhlease! Don't rewrite history with the integrity BS. As long as he is a good coach, and a good addition to PR and MFC, then that should be enough. Let's not canonise him!

Run DMC can p??? Off. We were going to get nothing out of him anyway. He is either poorly advised, an absolute jerk off or both. Reputations are made on the quality of the man. Regardless of the D, he is displaying signs which do not bode well for his future (run away, run away!) and he will end up with the reputation of a square of used toilet paper. Ross Lyon was 5 years too early. We will all be saying 'Mitch who?' - oh yeah, that scumbag. Time for the club to make a silk purse out of an absolute c&&t. Go for it boys, time for hard ball. If we don't get what we want, neither does Run DMC. (Or Eddie....)

Moore and Heeney are highly rated, but not really spoken about because they are as good as off the open market. I would bid for both, and hoped i got them. Losing frawley and MC means we have a need for quality talls, and i suspect Moore may be the pick of the bigs for us. Him, plus one of Petracca and Brayshaw, would be a great first round. Nothing to do with Collingwood. Cant give a stuff about them. If they think they can get better at 9 (ish), then happy to be the first team with a bid on the kid. On Run DMC ( d for depressed...) , i would play hard ball. Herthier aint enough. If they want him, they have to pay for him.

So Sammy can run...Old Samwise Gamgee can run all the way to flipping Mordor, and he still won't make that much of a difference. Stay...Go...can't see him stamping himself with authority on any position in our lineup, so I have no probs if he wants to trade. Worst case we get a spot on the list. Best case PR pulls a bunny out of the hat and we get a developing role player that helps us be better.

What do you mean? Work is destroying my productivity in staying up with Days of our Lives - Mitch Clark edition!

A different view. Imaginary, but possible/probable: Mitch Clark was told several weeks ago that he would be welcomed back onto the main list if he met the criteria of passing the fitness test, a medical exam and a mental health check. Perhaps the rookie list was plan B if he partially met expectations, but looked possible in the near term. If he failed, then we simply couldn't put him on any list - in which case we could maximise our 'out' through a trade or priority pick. He has been training hard, but realises that there is a long way to go to pass the criteria. Knows his best bet is to start looking elsewhere, and the draft is the better option for Mitch and the club. Therefore chat to the Pies. This would imply that MFC has been controlling the process - on the quiet for most of the time- and setting the terms. Club has been blindsided because expectation was for MC to go through the process before decisions were made, not to start trying to find a different exit strategy without the club. Now there is a lot of backpeddalling - the club would need to tread carefully so as to not show its hand if it put MC up for trade (after failing the criteria for getting back in the list). Just a thought....

I was chatting with a mate who is a whorethorn tragic. He remembers when Clarko came in. He remembers the frustration, and even booing, at the way the hawks played. Kicking side wards, kicking backwards, roles and accountability. Now regarded as one of the most elegant and capable teams. It starts with roles. It moves into who can and who wants it, the rest will follow. I have enjoyed more footy as a dees supporter this year than for a while. ( that win over the Toigs was spectacular!) Ps- I'm glad Roosy is not trying to make Watts an inside mid. As we get better, having him and stretcher as outside mids playing wide receiver/ quarterback roles with pinpoint skills could be brilliant...

We are going to need Frawley back. Watts out. One tackle and a few possies in the last is not good enough. Bail, Mckenzie out. Gawn in to ff changing ruck. Michie in and under Cross for McKenzie Lucky as hell: tapscott and Blease ( need to see what they can do) Set up with JKH at Gawns feet. Dawes to attack the ball ( the one time he did this he clunked a great mark - the rest of the it eye made up the numbers in packs) starting from CHF. It is a tough ask, but we have to play to their standard at some point or we will never get there.

Bail had 7 significant errors on the weekend. He led the team in this stat. This is what Roos was bemoaning, so how can he keep this guy?

That was painful. Wholesale change is the only answer. Can't carry players with no skills, no heart, and both. Several players stamped their tickets today. We have so many problems, and too many pea heart, clueless and under skilled players. Not a football team, a basket case.

Given the way some of the discussions go, thought this was relevant...

Is the suggestion that Roos will be the modern Checker? Finding an amateur mindset and playing group and instilling a culture of professionalism. Let's hope it leads to a swag of premierships....

Is Westrupp in the seniors this week?

Good luck with that, bjDee!

Could have, should have.. Our decision making (lack of decisiveness) inside defensive 50 was a big part of our problem. Too many being too cute.. Not being clean or skilled in disposal caused us no end of pain. Poor tempo. Many times we rushed when we should have slowed down, and waited when we should have moved fast. Kicking inside 50 was disgusting, most of the day, Being beaten in the clearances ( by 10) was a critical stat. We were then 2nd to almost every contested possie, Barry ran to great positions. Salem didn't do much, but what get did he did well. Not good enough, even to beat the scraggers.

We can't know where these guys are at. In a good club, players develop for two or 3 seasons at reserves level before they crack it for a game. From the reports, they all have a lot to work on. I don't know why Nicho was chosen ahead of Blease, maybe Roos wants more shutdown rather than line breaking this week? They should be dominating within the young, inexperienced Casey team, but up against well structured, mature teams it is going to be hard to show your skills (Kyle Cheney struggles at Dees, but in a team of champions looks good at Hawks). JKH and Toump I would not see as 'written off'', but developing. Blease for me is in the undecided pile, I think Strauss needs another preseason to judge. The rest? Check the expiry dates.

Short term depressive illness- perhaps cut the b/s and say "the kid might be sad and frustrated he can't get on the park". To shift it to 'illness' is harmful and ridiculous. He can feel sad without being ill. Sheesh!

Salem to start forward as a 1:1 for Byrnes. Max to FF, rotating with Jamar Peterson to head back to cover Vickery /resting Maric Dunn to take Riewolt Pig dog as sub What happens in the middle determines the outcome. Should be a cracker!

I love the fact that we are now discussing the small things, that emerge when young footballers are tired and under pressure of a tight contest. Last year, we were discussing 'good efforts'. Like we deserved a certificate of attendance or something. We lost it in three critical areas: Crap delivery with the kick inside 50 for most of the match. Run out of puff in the last 20 minutes. The bullies just had a pinch more in the tank, and it began to show in the way some of their players were able to get more space. Touches of class- I believe more experience under pressure will turn some coal to diamonds (Salem, JKH, Tyson, Viney) and others to coal dust. More of this experience will really help. I love what Roos has done, and is doing. I loved the fact that the dogs had no marks in the third q until about time on. When play this style, then learn to spread and put themselves to advantage (and honour it), and get the forward half working properly...look out! I am happy to be a Dees member this year more than I have for many years. I am disappointed we lost, and think we have let 3 games get away this year (aints, bullies, GC). But damned happy with a bigger picture view.

I am flabbergasted and disappointed. I hope this leads to them rethinking what they want from this game, and making it clear so everyone knows. What a ham fisted tribunal. Self important arbiters of how the game should be played. Revolution!

Watts - long time gone Salem - sub no more Jamar- taps without advantage Roos - taking us somewhere Umpires -are you kidding? Goodes- class and skill 2014- room for improvement

We just seemed to rush when we needed to take time, and take too much time when we needed to hurry. Our ability to spread has improved, but we don't have enough quick ball movement, or put it advantage-side often enough. Jack Watts had the best seat in the house. He was 3m from the action all night. Worst on ground by a country mile. Seems to have zero confidence, which is impacting everything. Suggest a good few weeks at Casey to rediscover some form. Salem - what a beauty! Why is mid strength beer more expensive than heavy? When we have to by the watered down muck at night games, we have to pay more. What a rip off!