we are 2 wins from our last 11 games. if you go back to when we beat geelong and then got pumped by freo its 5 wins from 17 games... thats bottom 4 territory and we very clearly should be better than that. 

however

coaches dont make players miss targets from 20m, or throw an arm out instead of actually tackling. 

2 hours ago, Hellfire Dub said:

I get criticised for suggesting the coach should be held accountable for performance but who else makes the plans and never reacts or learns from his mistakes?  Who else is responsible for preparing and inspiring a team when it doesn't show up and mostly seemed lost?  

I know it's the first five rounds and strange results occur, but from early on that game looked dodgy and we weren't trying very hard.  We were missing tackles and North's inaccuracy kept us in it.  We showed no pride.  

They're professional players and they want to succeed and win so if we're sick of the same ould shyyte they must be too.  Then again it was the midfielders not the coaches lofting high kicks to an an outnumbered contest with a dominant defender. But who let them persist with that and didn't get them to spread or even the numbers?  It was the coach and staff.  

Forget all the lovey dovey stuff, we can only judge by what we witness and it's really bad.  

We can clearly see they are trying new things, BUT the core issues still remain; toothless going forward in spite of an avalanche of inside 50’s. This is Goodwin year on year:

Round 3, 2017 v Geelong:

"It was frustrating. Clearly you've got to kick goals to win games of footy and we didn't do that today,"

Round 21, 2018 v Sydney

"We didn't connect well forward of centre. It's been a little bit of a tale of some of our games this year where we've struggled to connect and have efficiency inside forward 50.”

Round 6, 2019 v Richmond

"We had our opportunities through the middle of the ground, but we couldn't connect with our handball and our kicking,"

Round 15 and 16, 2020 against lowly Sydney and Freo were the same. Inefficiency cost us finals. 

2021 was a lot better but there were still patches where we had the same struggles, and we all know how 2022-2024 resulted. 

In essence, over 9 years, nothing has been done to fix the core problem that has been staring us in the face. 

Edited March 23Mar 23 by VNightCityLegend

2 minutes ago, biggestred said:

we are 2 wins from our last 11 games. if you go back to when we beat geelong and then got pumped by freo its 5 wins from 17 games... thats bottom 4 territory and we very clearly should be better than that. 

however

coaches dont make players miss targets from 20m, or throw an arm out instead of actually tackling. 

“The standard you walk past is the standard you accept”.. Goodwin appears too close to the group, he has lost the whip hand in terms of driving standards. I would rather a poor year, building up for some more success with a new dynamic coach, than trying to buy time with Goodwin. 

22 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

Goodwin bringing up Gawn's personal issues as an excuse for his performance was pretty ordinary. Maybe he thought it would protect Max from criticism this week but now there's a big spotlight on something private that wouldn't have been there had Goodwin said nothing.

Came here to say the same thing. Goodwin lacks social awareness and how comments will get reported on. How he thought that mentioning gawn had some sort of personal issue was going to do anything other than cause more focus and attention to said issue is showing a severe lack of judgement.

Goodwin has been in the AFL system for nearly 30 years he should get it

Just now, Bates Mate said:

Came here to say the same thing. Goodwin lacks social awareness and how comments will get reported on. How he thought that mentioning gawn had some sort of personal issue was going to do anything other than cause more focus and attention to said issue is showing a severe lack of judgement.

Goodwin has been in the AFL system for nearly 30 years he should get it

There is no way Goodwin isn't astutely aware of the media spotlight. Unfortunately he really is just a terrible public speaker and always has been. Whenever the cameras are on him you can see how much he struggles with it. He either says nothing of value and just repeats a bunch of cliches or he says something completely innappropriate. You watch other coaches front the media and you can see it comes a lot more naturally to them and they just seem way more at ease. Even when guys like Chris Scott puts his foot in his mouth he only ever makes himself look like a fool. It's really inexcusable for Goodwin to put the spotlight on his captain like that.

Premiership closed after 2023, failed to top up with quality players, Gawn & May getting older & our game plan is what? He’s flip flopped, possibly see trade requests from our remaining talent

Be interesting to see how he goes on AFL 360 on Wednesday night during his fortnightly segment.

He or the club has already appeared to have pulled the pin on Goody's final word with spaghetti bolognaise (assuming this was supposed to be a weekly segment). Couldn't muster up the effort to make the video and I don't blame him after such a disgraceful performance.

9 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Be interesting to see how he goes on AFL 360 on Wednesday night during his fortnightly segment.

He or the club has already appeared to have pulled the pin on Goody's final word with spaghetti bolognaise (assuming this was supposed to be a weekly segment). Couldn't muster up the effort to make the video and I don't blame him after such a disgraceful performance.

Imagine the poor media team having to send the email letting him know his video is due.

Edited March 24Mar 24 by KozzyCan

3 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I don't know about the players "not turning up" yesterday. They had a crack but were off their game by a bit and the Roos were on. We got run over in the final quarter but that's a long way from not turning up at the first bounce.

From where I sat, all I saw was an average team being allowed to live out their fantasies courtesy of another team who couldn’t hit any targets and were constantly caught flat-footed. Very little about the Roos impressed me, quite a lot about the Demons depressed me. 

What did Goody actually say about Max?

Did he suggest Max was having some issues outside of the game?

If so, is he out of line?

Max has been the heart and soul of this club for the last decade and I personally would not be fussed if he ran over a seeing eye dog.

 

2 minutes ago, leave it to deever said:

What did Goody actually say about Max?

Did he suggest Max was having some issues outside of the game?

If so, is he out of line?

Max has been the heart and soul of this club for the last decade and I personally would not be fussed if he ran over a seeing eye dog.

 

I'm sure his intentions were to protect Gawn from scrutiny but It's really dumb to even raise it. Just sounds like he's turning a very personal issue into an excuse. It's also disrespectful to North and Xerri.

It’s a bit of a furphy that you need a team of perfect kicks to play transition football. Richmond won 3 flags with disposal no better than ours. What they excelled at was manic levels of pressure and the ability to get to contest after contest. North weren’t clean yesterday, in fact it’s one of the worst games I’ve watched this year. What they were was determined to win and Xerri gave them first use time after time. 

12 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

We're clearly taking it through the corridor more so I assume that's what he's alluding to. Problem is we still butcher it kicking inside 50, we're just doing it a bit quicker than last year.

Gosh this is depressing. 

I’m a Goodwin defender, we came out playing the right style of footy that will leak goals as you learn to master it. Made the right changes to take away North’s run. But didn’t have enough the quality to create good scoring chances especially as the legs got heavy in the 3rd.

For 3/4s we stayed in the fight but lacked class and forward punch. 

Last quarter was diabolical but that happens when the damn wall breaks at times.

Everyone’s thrown the toys out of the cot because North arent meant to be good (news flash 800 first round picks and some senior players will work it out eventually).

The press conference comment was a mistake but a well intentioned one. Highlights that we still haven’t got good people around the coach. No CEO, a dud of a head of footy who fell in to the job and a poor media team. But Goody has to own it and try to take the heat off Max now. Hopefully Max is supportive, he should be, there was no ill will.

Back to on field tho - it’s a work in progress trying to mold square pegs (Oliver, Tracc, Viney, Sparrow) in to round holes. Unfortunately we’ve been unwilling or unable to trade any of those out for value and are trying to win and stay up whilst we move to a new generation of midfielders. 

Madness to blame the coach when it’s a tricky situation that no coach would be able to get perfect.

2 hours ago, biggestred said:

we are 2 wins from our last 11 games. if you go back to when we beat geelong and then got pumped by freo its 5 wins from 17 games... thats bottom 4 territory and we very clearly should be better than that. 

however

coaches dont make players miss targets from 20m, or throw an arm out instead of actually tackling. 

Yes but they can drill them and motivate them to never dish up the drosh we saw yesterday.

The way we play, is to a large part on the players but it's also on the coach and FD.

PATHETIC WAP AMATEUR PERFORMANCE from almost everyone concerned yesterday and completely unacceptable from a so called professional club at this level.

That includes 'effort' and 'team work' which, aside from a few individuals, was disgusting and embarrassing to watch.

How many tackles at the 15 minute mark of the third quarter?  2 .... [censored] two!

Sorry but that performance is beyond a joke.  Who played for the jumper?  Not enough!

We have some serious players 'hopefully / supposedly' due back in the next few weeks.

I'd be giving Simon & this list till Rnd 8 - 10 to turn this around in a significant way before putting every option up for discussion, including where the entire list and coaching crew are at and how we can improve in all facets.

No one is sacred in this business and you're only as good as your recent record.  Which is fast becoming abysmal.

11 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

It’s a bit of a furphy that you need a team of perfect kicks to play transition football. Richmond won 3 flags with disposal no better than ours. What they excelled at was manic levels of pressure and the ability to get to contest after contest. North weren’t clean yesterday, in fact it’s one of the worst games I’ve watched this year. What they were was determined to win and Xerri gave them first use time after time. 

That Richmond side were freakishly good at forward handballing and running for each other.

Kicking is one thing, but the big difference between us and most of our opponents is our midfield and most of our forwards have so little balance and team coordination.

Jack Henderson comes in from 1 week of training and immediately looks a naturally balanced footballer. He gets himself out of congestion and disposes with a purpose. Lindsay the same.

Oliver, Tracc, Sparrow and Viney only know one way and it results in a heap of handball turnovers or handballs to flat footed players who then chuck in on the boot. Chandler’s prone to it to. And Spargo does one good thing then decides he’s god gift to football searching for the perfect pass, although he deserves a bit more leeway after not playing for a year.

With LDU, Powell, Sheezel, Simpkin North were balanced in and out of the contest and only Sheezel and perhaps Powell at times are good kicks.

19 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

It’s a bit of a furphy that you need a team of perfect kicks to play transition football. Richmond won 3 flags with disposal no better than ours. What they excelled at was manic levels of pressure and the ability to get to contest after contest. North weren’t clean yesterday, in fact it’s one of the worst games I’ve watched this year. What they were was determined to win and Xerri gave them first use time after time. 

Good point.

Norths pressure with its high tackle count and numbers to the contest seemed far superior to our efforts. Especially in our fwd line. Our fwd pressure was terrible. N M seemed to waltz it out of their backline at leisure. Sometimes straight down the guts which often involved a score. Their clearance effort was far better too. Our over the head handballs rarely found their mark. In fact a lot of them were look away ones because of North's pressure. Suffice to say they didn't work either. Funny that.

3 minutes ago, Demon Dynasty said:

Yes but they can drill them and motivate them to never dish up the drosh we saw yesterday.

The way we play, is to a large part on the players but it's also on the coach and FD.

PATHETIC WAP AMATEUR PERFORMANCE from almost everyone concerned yesterday and completely unacceptable from a so called professional club at this level.

That includes 'effort' and 'team work' which, aside from a few individuals, was disgusting and embarrassing to watch.

How many tackles at the 15 minute mark of the third quarter?  2 .... [censored] two!

Sorry but that performance is beyond a joke.  Who played for the jumper?  Not enough!

We have some serious players 'hopefully / supposedly' due back in the next few weeks.

I'd be giving Simon & this list till Rnd 8 - 10 to turn this around in a significant way before putting every option up for discussion, including where the entire list and coaching crew are at and how we can improve in all facets.

No one is sacred in this business and you're only as good as your recent record.  Which is fast becoming abysmal.

we are in furious agreement

33 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

I'm sure his intentions were to protect Gawn from scrutiny but It's really dumb to even raise it. Just sounds like he's turning a very personal issue into an excuse. It's also disrespectful to North and Xerri.

So shepherding your opponent from every centre bounce is disrespectful and being allowed to get away with it is maggot condoned.

Max doesn't bother arguing anymore. He knows maggots regard his height advantage must be exploited against for the good of the competition.

There’s just way too much smoke to ignore. I’m grateful for what Goody and the team achieved in 21’ but it’s been a downhill slide, on and off the field, since. It’s fast becoming an avalanche.

Things could turn around but it would have to start basically from next weekend. There’s been a lot of heat on the club in recent times however Goody has got off lightly. That loss and his press conference and his preseason gibberish mean the gloves are off. I don’t see him coping.

On the bright side, I think there’s a real  opportunity for the club to rejuvenate itself in the coming months/year with a new CEO, new coaching team and new president. I hope we have the courage to take it.

2 minutes ago, Willmoy1947 said:

So shepherding your opponent from every centre bounce is disrespectful and being allowed to get away with it is maggot condoned.

Max doesn't bother arguing anymore. He knows maggots regard his height advantage must be exploited against for the good of the competition.

That's ruck craft big boy.

16 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

I’m a Goodwin defender, we came out playing the right style of footy that will leak goals as you learn to master it. Made the right changes to take away North’s run. But didn’t have enough the quality to create good scoring chances especially as the legs got heavy in the 3rd.

For 3/4s we stayed in the fight but lacked class and forward punch. 

Last quarter was diabolical but that happens when the damn wall breaks at times.

Everyone’s thrown the toys out of the cot because North arent meant to be good (news flash 800 first round picks and some senior players will work it out eventually).

The press conference comment was a mistake but a well intentioned one. Highlights that we still haven’t got good people around the coach. No CEO, a dud of a head of footy who fell in to the job and a poor media team. But Goody has to own it and try to take the heat off Max now. Hopefully Max is supportive, he should be, there was no ill will.

Back to on field tho - it’s a work in progress trying to mold square pegs (Oliver, Tracc, Viney, Sparrow) in to round holes. Unfortunately we’ve been unwilling or unable to trade any of those out for value and are trying to win and stay up whilst we move to a new generation of midfielders. 

Madness to blame the coach when it’s a tricky situation that no coach would be able to get perfect.

Totally agree mate.

North will be much improved this year we wont be the only scalp they take. They were on the cusp of breaking through last year, nearly did us and collingwood. Perhaps by midyear this loss may have a different perspective

As for gameplan. We are trying to move the ball faster and quicker on turnover with handball and quick ball movement. if they are well set in defense, we move into a slower mode and chip the ball around to work our way through the zone. We showed in both games and preseason that when we get this right, we can play well. Unfortunately it will be a fine balance and yesterday North were hungrier

To anyone that says Goodwin hasn't adapted or changed isn't paying attention. This is very differnt to 2022/2023 forward territory game

 

As for Gawny, he was trying to humanise max and defend his performance, but unfortunately he opened up a can of worms which is what everyone is going to focus on this week.

 

People said fagan couldnt coach after rd 5 last year remember?

5 minutes ago, Willmoy1947 said:

So shepherding your opponent from every centre bounce is disrespectful and being allowed to get away with it is maggot condoned.

Max doesn't bother arguing anymore. He knows maggots regard his height advantage must be exploited against for the good of the competition.

All Max has to do is what TDK, LJ do. Large run and jump. Knee into the guts and chest of Xerri. Ruck isnt that hard if you have the tool and attributes, which Max does have. 

I was baffled why Max stayed on the ground as much as he did.. Perhaps its just his age showing and we have to accept it.

17 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

That Richmond side were freakishly good at forward handballing and running for each other.

Kicking is one thing, but the big difference between us and most of our opponents is our midfield and most of our forwards have so little balance and team coordination.

Jack Henderson comes in from 1 week of training and immediately looks a naturally balanced footballer. He gets himself out of congestion and disposes with a purpose. Lindsay the same.

Oliver, Tracc, Sparrow and Viney only know one way and it results in a heap of handball turnovers or handballs to flat footed players who then chuck in on the boot. Chandler’s prone to it to. And Spargo does one good thing then decides he’s god gift to football searching for the perfect pass, although he deserves a bit more leeway after not playing for a year.

With LDU, Powell, Sheezel, Simpkin North were balanced in and out of the contest and only Sheezel and perhaps Powell at times are good kicks.

We often appear flat footed and I reckon that’s largely because the new gameplan is not embedded yet so there’s some second guessing going on. This gets worse when a team brings the heat. I’m hoping as we get the remaining best 22 players back and the game plan starts sinking in we’ll start improving. We do need to snatch a win this weekend to keep the confidence up. Lose 5 or 6 on the trot and cracks will appear.

40 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

I’m a Goodwin defender, we came out playing the right style of footy that will leak goals as you learn to master it. Made the right changes to take away North’s run. But didn’t have enough the quality to create good scoring chances especially as the legs got heavy in the 3rd.

For 3/4s we stayed in the fight but lacked class and forward punch. 

Last quarter was diabolical but that happens when the damn wall breaks at times.

Everyone’s thrown the toys out of the cot because North arent meant to be good (news flash 800 first round picks and some senior players will work it out eventually).

The press conference comment was a mistake but a well intentioned one. Highlights that we still haven’t got good people around the coach. No CEO, a dud of a head of footy who fell in to the job and a poor media team. But Goody has to own it and try to take the heat off Max now. Hopefully Max is supportive, he should be, there was no ill will.

Back to on field tho - it’s a work in progress trying to mold square pegs (Oliver, Tracc, Viney, Sparrow) in to round holes. Unfortunately we’ve been unwilling or unable to trade any of those out for value and are trying to win and stay up whilst we move to a new generation of midfielders. 

Madness to blame the coach when it’s a tricky situation that no coach would be able to get perfect.

Very good post, not compiled out of emotion.

Heat will increase if things don’t improve but the biggest lesson I hope that is taken on, is to have faith in the change in style they are trying to implement