POSTGAME: Rd 08 vs Geelong

[Willmoy1947 4,085]

On 06/05/2024 at 09:15, Ted Lasso said:

I honestly think a lot of posters are misreading Chris Scotts presser, i probably took it as him playing mind games a little bit. I think he saw Melbourne take away and shut down a lot of what they wanted to do and render their star forwards ineffectual, so his response was to play it down as them having a bad day in the hope that teams don't study it too closely and work it out, but also to keep the belief in his playing group that they're the best team, and they weren't outplayed.

Really like these comments, especially relating to what a long draining season this will be.

[Sir Why You Little 37,033]

20 hours ago, Dee Zephyr said:

If you weren’t convinced that Robbo has no idea about footy, have a listen to him on 360. He thinks Fritta plays for too many frees when Gerard posed the question where Fritta rates as a forward.

I also sent a text to SEN early this morning about Fritta being in a convo for one of the games best forwards. The host said he needs more consistency. 
This bloke is severely underrated still.

In the top 5 for most goals since 2020. 

Is this on Youtube at all? Trying to find it

Robinson is a complete fool, as we all know. It is astounding that he is still employed. Sad indictment on the industry 

[IRW 1,387]

23 hours ago, KLV said:

Would have expected nothing less from Scott

I don't know how Pickett gets that many

[leave it to deever 17,511]

Two things in the last few minutes of the game. Tracca really burnt Kozzie kicking to Fritta on the boundary.

But then we wouldn't have had goal of the year.

And Cameron marks 25 out from goal with two mins on the clock uses his full 30 seconds as if they were in front and then shanks it.

Bravo.

[Dee Zephyr 19,267]

1 hour ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Is this on Youtube at all? Trying to find it

Robinson is a complete fool, as we all know. It is astounding that he is still employed. Sad indictment on the industry 

Not sure where you can rewatch SWYL. Can’t say I’ve ever thought Fritta plays for frees. 

[leave it to deever 17,511]

Did Fritta kick that goal on the Shane Warne stand side?

[leave it to deever 17,511]

2 minutes ago, Dee Zephyr said:

Not sure where you can rewatch SWYL. Can’t say I’ve ever thought Fritta plays for frees. 

Your right he doesn't. And more to the point, has no need to do it.

[Sir Why You Little 37,033]

24 minutes ago, Dee Zephyr said:

Not sure where you can rewatch SWYL. Can’t say I’ve ever thought Fritta plays for frees. 

Whenever i see Robinson, i immediately think of a Cricket Bat

[binman 42,900]

14 hours ago, Skuit said:

People can post or care about what they want of course, but I find it odd that most post-winning game threads are usually uppity about how the media reports on the win or their perceptions about our team. 

Seriously, who cares if Dermott isn't on board, or downplays the win? Fritsch kicked a goal that will be remembered 50 years from now. What does it matter if some forgotten random didn't rate it?

Chris Scott has one job: (clue) it isn't to hand out plaudits to the opposition, but to win flags, whatever approach he thinks is best. Goodwin has the same job, but takes a different approach. 

Enjoy the win. Look at the stats. Do the old fashioned eye-ball test. None of what the media and other footy forums say has anything to do with our chances of winning a flag.

Not intended as a condesceing question, but would people be happier if the media bowed down and said we are unbeatable and clear flag favourites?

I understand your point skuit, it's one many other posters, some lots of times, have also made over the journey on my time on DL.

Though i have to say, I'm no great fan of the 'people can post or care about what they want of course BUT....' negation.

Who cares about the media's coverage of the dees? 

I do.

Why?

I obvioulsy can't speak for others but the context is I love the club and have been a passionate supporter of the club since 1975. 

As a kid in the 70s I didn't know a single dees fan, other than the family friends who made me a dees fan.

Through the 70s and the 80s. I suffered through humiliating shellackings and multiple near winless seasons as I traipsed around Melbourne's suburban football grounds by myself.

We were treated like a joke - from other fans and the media alike.

Jokes about silver spoon and snow trips (which is the opposite of my experience growing up) AND being perennial wooden spooners and total dysfunction were par for the course

I grew up desperate for any morsel of info about the dees.

We were hardly ever one of the 2 replays shown on the weekend and instead had to make do with those weird one camera shots and fake crowd noise 'highlights'.

Of course we were one of the clubs on the chopping block in the 80s. And of course the media's pumped up the narrative Don Scott saved us from extinction. 

We finally win a flag and are the most successful club since the start of 2021. A flag and three consecutive top 4 finishes and we're still derided - even by plenty of dees fans.

So yeah, i get frustrated by how the media cover us.

So much so that I've largely taken a DL posters' advice from a couple of seasons back to stop consuming media content (if it frustrates you that much, stop reading, listening and watching it).

Personally what I find curious is for every post expressing frustration about the coverage of the dees there is a post like yours that express bemusement. And others taking pot shots at the snow flakes.

I mean, you don't think it's ironic posters going to the effort of essentially critising other posters for critising the media?

I mean, people can post what they want but I really don't get why they would get so annoyed as to go to the effort knocking another poster for knocking the media - particularly those that repeat their confusion, derision, bemusement multiple times a season.

Seriously, who cares if a poster chooses to vent about the media?

Each to their own I suppose.

As to your question about what I would prefer re the media, my answer is I'd prefer that was professional, knowledgeable and helped me understand the game. I don't mind critiques that have a solid rationale, perhaps even based on some research and work.

Instead we get feel based, lazy, largely incorrect analysis by bonehead ex footballers that is no better than the plonkers yelling just kick it at the footy.

The media does what I think is the best team sport in the world a huge disservice.

Edited May 7 by binman

[Deemania since 56 6,634]

On 06/05/2024 at 09:24, Engorged Onion said:

100% this... Chris is no fool

Possibly correct, but watching (as we all did) his team being dismantled across the ground by another team then championing an '...off day...' is an attempt to forgive his charges, and an attempt to deceive his charges at the same time. Minus the Demons' point-scoring forays, the MFC taught them all a lesson and were more potent across the game, and were fitter (in better condition) than the PussyCats. 

[Skuit 10,031]

1 hour ago, binman said:

I understand your point skuit, it's one many other posters, some lots of times, have also made over the journey on my time on DL.

Personally what I find curious is for every post expressing frustration about the coverage of the dees there is a post like yours that express bemusement. And others taking pot shots at the snow flakes.

I mean, you don't think it's ironic posters going to the effort of essentially critising other posters for critising the media?

I mean, people can post what they want but I really don't get why they would get so annoyed as to go to the effort knocking another poster for knocking the media - particularly those that repeat their confusion, derision, bemusement multiple times a season.

Seriously, who cares if a poster chooses to vent about the media?

As to your question about what I would prefer re the media, my answer is I'd prefer that was professional, knowledgeable and helped me understand the game. I don't mind critiques that have a solid rationale, perhaps even based on some research and work.

Instead we get feel based, lazy, largely incorrect analysis by bonehead ex footballers that is no better than the plonkers yelling just kick it at the footy.

The media does what I think is the best team sport in the world a huge disservice.

I guess the second part relates to your first part. I get that people need a place to vent etc. but my personal preference is to come here for constructive information and celebration/commiseration. Like yourself, I turn to Demonland as an alternative option to the media for discussion, and preferably some humour.

So I don't think it ironic/hypocritical to point out and encourage people to let go of their media angst. We just knocked off the top team, but the site has been full of complaints and nasty expressions born of personal vendettas (e.g. eat [censored] Geelong). Brings down the joyous mood somewhat. To me, complaining about the media is the same as complaining about the government or some other such institution. Take the [censored] as a given.

I also understand that I grew up and live in a different environment than most of the posters on this site, not being from Melbourne and spending most of my adult life overseas. There's obviously deeply psychological aspects at play, but I just can't fathom why anyone would care about jibes etc. as to the football team you support. 

We didn't choose to follow Melbourne as some sort of logical selection, as if we failed somehow, and most of us have no say or control over any aspect of how the club operates or performs. That we continue to support the Dees despite long periods of mediocrity and ineptitude should be the ultimate badge of honour. 

[binman 42,900]

34 minutes ago, Skuit said:

I guess the second part relates to your first part. I get that people need a place to vent etc. but my personal preference is to come here for constructive information and celebration/commiseration. Like yourself, I turn to Demonland as an alternative option to the media for discussion, and preferably some humour.

So I don't think it ironic/hypocritical to point out and encourage people to let go of their media angst. We just knocked off the top team, but the site has been full of complaints and nasty expressions born of personal vendettas (e.g. eat [censored] Geelong). Brings down the joyous mood somewhat. To me, complaining about the media is the same as complaining about the government or some other such institution. Take the [censored] as a given.

I also understand that I grew up and live in a different environment than most of the posters on this site, not being from Melbourne and spending most of my adult life overseas. There's obviously deeply psychological aspects at play, but I just can't fathom why anyone would care about jibes etc. as to the football team you support. 

We didn't choose to follow Melbourne as some sort of logical selection, as if we failed somehow, and most of us have no say or control over any aspect of how the club operates or performs. That we continue to support the Dees despite long periods of mediocrity and ineptitude should be the ultimate badge of honour. 

Sure skuit.

But why do you need to understand the motivations of posters who choose to knock the media?

It's annoying? It brings the mood down? It perplexes you because you can't fathom it?

And what harm do such posts do? 

I wasn't joking when I said I don't understand why they seem to annoy some people so much.

Well, I do understand to an extent - we are all wired differently and one person's ambivalence is another's trigger. 

If you don't like such posts, don't read or engage with them.

They are not offensive in any moral sense (for example like a homophobic) where it might be important to challenge the poster's perspective.

They are just annoying - to you and some others.

But clearly not all. Or even the majority.

I mean it's not really as if they dominate the discussion post game or the site is actually 'full of complaints and nasty expressions'.  

The ratio is probably no greater than one on twenty. Tops.

Take this post victory thread - there have been 610 posts and, what maybe 20-30 posts max knocking the media?

Personally I agree there's no need to stoop to unpleasant invenctive. But such posts are even rarer. 

If your isssue is the negativity, what about the relentless, repetitive critisism about the club from some on here?  

Ironically many of those same posters are in the I don't understand why people pot the media camp.

By the by, discussing Scott is a different matter to knocking the media.

My issue was his poor sportsmanship and lack of class. He deserves the whacks he's copped on here.

[Skuit 10,031]

33 minutes ago, binman said:

Sure skuit.

But why do you need to understand the motivations of posters who choose to knock the media?

It's annoying? It brings the mood down? It perplexes you because you can't fathom it?

And what harm do such posts do? 

I wasn't joking when I said I don't understand why they seem to annoy some people so much.

Well, I do understand to an extent - we are all wired differently and one person's ambivalence is another's trigger. 

If you don't like such posts, don't read or engage with them.

They are not offensive in any moral sense (for example like a homophobic) where it might be important to challenge the poster's perspective.

They are just annoying - to you and some others.

But clearly not all. Or even the majority.

I mean it's not really as if they dominate the discussion post game or the site is actually 'full of complaints and nasty expressions'.  

The ratio is probably no greater than one on twenty. Tops.

Take this post victory thread - there have been 610 posts and, what maybe 20-30 posts max knocking the media?

Personally I agree there's no need to stoop to unpleasant invenctive. But such posts are even rarer. 

If your isssue is the negativity, what about the relentless, repetitive critisism about the club from some on here?  

Ironically many of those same posters are in the I don't understand why people pot the media camp.

By the by, discussing Scott is a different matter to knocking the media.

My issue was his poor sportsmanship and lack of class. He deserves the whacks he's copped on here.

Like I said, you're welcome to care and post about whatever you want, and if you want to be up in arms about something inconsequential after a win, go for it. I'm also within my rights to find that approach odd and express such without directly belittling anyone. 

[Dr. Gonzo 24,208]

13 hours ago, sue said:

Someone at AFL HQ decided that allowing a bit of strong emotion is more valuable ($) than the pious hypocrisy they mouthed about stopping bad examples to kids and recruiting umpires.

Seriously, what sort of code introduces a new 'rule', runs with it relentlessly for a few weeks, and then increasingly ignores it.  But you watch them pull it out of their %%$# when it suits.   And they call it a professional sport....

And you can guarantee some over officious umpire will pull one out at a critical moment late in the season or in finals. It already happened in the Blues/Freo game and that was paid a free kick not even a mere 50m penalty. They just make a rod for their own backs having a rule on the books that is rarely paid and then when it is causes confusion about how that incident differs from the hundreds of others throughout the year.

The AFL is run by a group of bogan spivs dressed up as corporate geniuses. Most of them only really have money/connections due to their leeching off the game with the exception of the former CEO who came from the landed gentry of SA.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,208]

6 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Is this on Youtube at all? Trying to find it

Robinson is a complete fool, as we all know. It is astounding that he is still employed. Sad indictment on the industry 

He is a lecherous drunk with a flimsy grasp of the finer aspects of the English language who also loves a dart, a punt, a pie and select four letters words. He is the embodiment of how NewsCorp view their audience which is why they refer to him as the man of the people or something along those lines. I mean seriously, he is the chief football writer for the paper and his columns would receive an "F" for grammar in a middle school English essay.

Edited May 7 by Dr. Gonzo

[Dr. Gonzo 24,208]

48 minutes ago, Skuit said:

Like I said, you're welcome to care and post about whatever you want, and if you want to be up in arms about something inconsequential after a win, go for it. I'm also within my rights to find that approach odd and express such without directly belittling anyone. 

Those in the media are rightfully potted because of their role in covering what is the greatest sport on the planet terribly. You can avoid them to an extent but not when you are watching the game/replay, not at half time, not when people bring some of their comments to your attention etc

The medias role should be to make the intricacies of the game easily digestible for those in the outer but they decided some time ago we were too dumb for that or at least most of us are. So they ignore that and elect to go for the over the top personalities, the shock jock controversial calls that drive the 24 hours news cycle and the tabloids journalism of players personal lives rather than dissecting the evolving nature of the game from a tactical/strategic perspective and holding the AFL to account for the many egregious and downright terrible decisions they make as governors of the sport and the league.

As fans/supporters we expect/demand more just as we do if our governments. They let us down and it is up to us to point that out/demand more when it happens.

Edited May 7 by Dr. Gonzo

[Deestar9 1,615]

On 05/05/2024 at 10:02, leave it to deever said:

Full confidence is back

 

When Jvr starts holding all his ( he was ok) we will be even harder to shut down.

Pretty sure at the end of Round 8 JVR was 1st in the league for contested marks & Fritch was 3rd. Petty 14th but that will def improve 

[Jjrogan 1,420]

17 minutes ago, Deestar9 said:

Pretty sure at the end of Round 8 JVR was 1st in the league for contested marks & Fritch was 3rd. Petty 14th but that will def improve 

This was forward 50 retention rates, Petty has taken 4 contested marks for the year. Trac has 5.  Fwiw the two leaders right are Curnow (26) and McKay (22). 

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,780]

Did any other Demonlanders see Robinson’s puerile, inane questions when interviewing Caleb Windsor on 360 this evening?  Poor old Whateley was squirming with embarrassment, while Caleb managed ok.

[Wells 11 5,397]

12 hours ago, binman said:

I understand your point skuit, it's one many other posters, some lots of times, have also made over the journey on my time on DL.

Though i have to say, I'm no great fan of the 'people can post or care about what they want of course BUT....' negation.

Who cares about the media's coverage of the dees? 

I do.

Why?

I obvioulsy can't speak for others but the context is I love the club and have been a passionate supporter of the club since 1975. 

As a kid in the 70s I didn't know a single dees fan, other than the family friends who made me a dees fan.

Through the 70s and the 80s. I suffered through humiliating shellackings and multiple near winless seasons as I traipsed around Melbourne's suburban football grounds by myself.

We were treated like a joke - from other fans and the media alike.

Jokes about silver spoon and snow trips (which is the opposite of my experience growing up) AND being perennial wooden spooners and total dysfunction were par for the course

I grew up desperate for any morsel of info about the dees.

We were hardly ever one of the 2 replays shown on the weekend and instead had to make do with those weird one camera shots and fake crowd noise 'highlights'.

Of course we were one of the clubs on the chopping block in the 80s. And of course the media's pumped up the narrative Don Scott saved us from extinction. 

We finally win a flag and are the most successful club since the start of 2021. A flag and three consecutive top 4 finishes and we're still derided - even by plenty of dees fans.

So yeah, i get frustrated by how the media cover us.

So much so that I've largely taken a DL posters' advice from a couple of seasons back to stop consuming media content (if it frustrates you that much, stop reading, listening and watching it).

Personally what I find curious is for every post expressing frustration about the coverage of the dees there is a post like yours that express bemusement. And others taking pot shots at the snow flakes.

I mean, you don't think it's ironic posters going to the effort of essentially critising other posters for critising the media?

I mean, people can post what they want but I really don't get why they would get so annoyed as to go to the effort knocking another poster for knocking the media - particularly those that repeat their confusion, derision, bemusement multiple times a season.

Seriously, who cares if a poster chooses to vent about the media?

Each to their own I suppose.

As to your question about what I would prefer re the media, my answer is I'd prefer that was professional, knowledgeable and helped me understand the game. I don't mind critiques that have a solid rationale, perhaps even based on some research and work.

Instead we get feel based, lazy, largely incorrect analysis by bonehead ex footballers that is no better than the plonkers yelling just kick it at the footy.

The media does what I think is the best team sport in the world a huge disservice.

Thanks Binman. I started following in 70 and understood your thoughts and reactions perfectly. Especially never being on the replay and all the media disdain and type casting… including how much we supporters don’t care.  This period of time is mainly very therapeutic… but it seems we’re still burning through all the old perceptions. 

[Dee Zephyr 19,267]

7 hours ago, Jumping Jack Clennett said:

Did any other Demonlanders see Robinson’s puerile, inane questions when interviewing Caleb Windsor on 360 this evening?  Poor old Whateley was squirming with embarrassment, while Caleb managed ok.

Yeah, it was really good.

'Who's faster Caleb, you or Wilson?"

"What is that on the wall behind you?"

 

[Neil Crompton 5,535]

11 hours ago, binman said:

Sure skuit.

But why do you need to understand the motivations of posters who choose to knock the media?

It's annoying? It brings the mood down? It perplexes you because you can't fathom it?

And what harm do such posts do? 

I wasn't joking when I said I don't understand why they seem to annoy some people so much.

Well, I do understand to an extent - we are all wired differently and one person's ambivalence is another's trigger. 

If you don't like such posts, don't read or engage with them.

They are not offensive in any moral sense (for example like a homophobic) where it might be important to challenge the poster's perspective.

They are just annoying - to you and some others.

But clearly not all. Or even the majority.

I mean it's not really as if they dominate the discussion post game or the site is actually 'full of complaints and nasty expressions'.  

The ratio is probably no greater than one on twenty. Tops.

Take this post victory thread - there have been 610 posts and, what maybe 20-30 posts max knocking the media?

Personally I agree there's no need to stoop to unpleasant invenctive. But such posts are even rarer. 

If your isssue is the negativity, what about the relentless, repetitive critisism about the club from some on here?  

Ironically many of those same posters are in the I don't understand why people pot the media camp.

By the by, discussing Scott is a different matter to knocking the media.

My issue was his poor sportsmanship and lack of class. He deserves the whacks he's copped on here.

Binny, my point on this is that 90%(?) of us on here dislike the majority of the football media “experts” - or think they are has-been “[censored]”. Why then should we care what an “[censored]” happens to say about our club or players? Maybe it’s all the unloved years we’ve faced in the past - as you say - that has made us insecure and in need of a little love and recognition. However you, above nearly everyone else on DL, have the knowledge and understanding that we are a very good team that is going to be a premiership contender this year. You know it, I know it, and most on here would luv to believe it - so why the need for further confirmation of this from someone you don’t respect? I love the “us” against “them” mentality. It binds us closer together in support of our great club. Not sure if this is how @Skuit feels, but it’s my personal view.

Edited May 7 by Neil Crompton

[binman 42,900]

9 hours ago, Skuit said:

Like I said, you're welcome to care and post about whatever you want, and if you want to be up in arms about something inconsequential after a win, go for it. I'm also within my rights to find that approach odd and express such without directly belittling anyone. 

Of course you are skuit. I'm not suggesting otherwise.

Just as it is OK for me to think it odd, you, or anyone else, cares about posters on a footy forum knocking coverage of the team they support.

I have to say though there is a fine line between expressing your befuddlement about why people choose to knock the media on here (which I respectfully tried to explain from my perspective) and belittling.

Case in point, suggesting anyone who doesn't share your view as 'up in arms about something inconsequential after a win'.

Inconsequential to YOU.

You are applying your own judgement on others

I've already explained why it is not inconsequential to me. And it's clearly not inconsequential to others. Indeed you may well be in the minority.

And on a broader level how the media's cover individual clubs is FAR from inconsequential.

There is zero doubt the way we were coveted in the 70s,80s, 90s and naughts (and continue to be covered) has had a huge impact on our membership numbers. And our financial bottom line. 

Hard to attract sponsors when the coverage you do get is derisive and you get basically no live coverage of games.

Which in turn makes it exceedingly hard to grow the membership base- which had become the most critical income stream for clubs

Why do you think that despite our incredible success and support in the 50s and 60s we are not one of the Victorian power clubs?

We almost ceased to exist as a club  because we were a financial basket case that could not attract sponsors or grow our membership base - in large part because of how we were coveted.

We would almost ceased to exist a second time, and may have if not for Jimmy and his herculean fund-raising efforts.

We struggled financially from at least 1975 all rhe way to Peter Jacksom starting to turn things around in 2017.

We would 

We still see the impact in our membership numbers and bottom line.

Just one real world example of the impact of how we have been covered is being forced to play so many games at kardinia Park.

Why?

Because the circular argument goes that, unlike the pies, blues,tigers and bombers (who have rarely have to play there) we don't have enough fans to warrant playing those games at the g.

That one example embeds a significant structural disadvantage, not least because it is so hard to win there as evidenced by lis8ng 90% of those games.

Meanwhile the blues, who benefited from saturation coverage in the 70s and 80s, but have been a basket case on field until recently, have a massive membership and have got a free hit for 20 years in terms of media coverage, marquee games and live coverage.

Ditto Collingwood.

Dtto bombers

The effect has been compounded by the media being dominated by ex footballers, with their axes to grind and confirmation bias, from the power clubs. 

So unfair, unbalanced media coverage is far from inconsequential- in the now and into the future.

Inconsequential to you obviously, but not to others and certainly not the club.

[Dingo 1,059]

15 hours ago, leave it to deever said:

Did Fritta kick that goal on the Shane Warne stand side?

Yes

[Demonland 72,161]