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TRAINING: Friday 10th December 2021

picket fence
picket fence
in Melbourne Demons

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12 hours ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

I humbly advise you to give up all other petty pursuits picket and go into the highly unpaid profession of writing training reports full time.

I will consider offering you a Manor quality shiraz as recompense. ( it will energise your taste buds far and beyond the cheap booze you currently favour)

I think Pickett deserves more  ... perhaps the maids services might be suitable incentive.

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    4 hours ago, picket fence said:

    On what I saw last Friday Werridee I have NO DOUBT!!

    That's good because he's in my December best 22.

    B: TOMLINSON, MAY, LEVER

    HB: SALEM, PETTY, BOWEY

    C: LANGDON, PETRACCA, BRAYSHAW

    HF: SPARGO, MCDONALD, NEAL-BULLEN

    F: PICKETT, B.BROWN, FRITSCH

    FOLL: GAWN, OLIVER, VINEY

    IC: RIVERS, HARMES, DUNSTAN, JACKSON

    SUB: HUNT

    EMERG: SPARROW, JORDON, HIBBERD

     

    CASEY

    B: BUNTINE, TURNER, HIBBERD

    HB: HUNT, J.SMITH, MCVEE

    C: BAKER, SPARROW, HOWES

    HF: MELKSHAM, VAN ROOYEN, CHANDLER

    F: M.BROWN, WEIDEMAN, BEDFORD

    FOLL: DAW, JORDON, MUNRO

    IC: WHITE, LAURIE, ROSMAN, D.SMITH

    EMERG: WOEWODIN, MONIZ-WAKEFIELD, GREY

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    3 minutes ago, WERRIDEE said:

    That's good because he's in my December best 22.

    B: TOMLINSON, MAY, LEVER

    HB: SALEM, PETTY, BOWEY

    C: LANGDON, PETRACCA, BRAYSHAW

    HF: SPARGO, MCDONALD, NEAL-BULLEN

    F: PICKETT, B.BROWN, FRITSCH

    FOLL: GAWN, OLIVER, VINEY

    IC: RIVERS, HARMES, DUNSTAN, JACKSON

    SUB: HUNT

    EMERG: SPARROW, JORDON, HIBBERD

     

    CASEY

    B: BUNTINE, TURNER, HIBBERD

    HB: HUNT, J.SMITH, MCVEE

    C: BAKER, SPARROW, HOWES

    HF: MELKSHAM, VAN ROOYEN, CHANDLER

    F: M.BROWN, WEIDEMAN, BEDFORD

    FOLL: DAW, JORDON, MUNRO

    IC: WHITE, LAURIE, ROSMAN, D.SMITH

    EMERG: WOEWODIN, MONIZ-WAKEFIELD, GREY

    You'd leave Sparrow out for Dunstan? Wow.

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    Just now, Dante said:

    You'd leave Sparrow out for Dunstan? Wow.

    It's controversial either one in the team will do me. Dunstan got 12 votes in the brownlow while Sparrow has had none. He's a good player Sparrow and will only get better but Dunstan's experience just gets him over the line for mine.

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    Maybe it was Selwyn not Burgess that got the Dees fit and firing:

     

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    I don't think Dunstan has been recruited to play at Casey!

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    53 minutes ago, picket fence said:

    I don't think Dunstan has been recruited to play at Casey!

    Able to get down to training today Fence?

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    • Author

    Friday Dazzle!

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    On 12/13/2021 at 3:52 PM, WERRIDEE said:

    Picket will Tomlinson be right for round 1?

    Very unusual for any AFL club to play ACL reconstructions inside 12 months post- surgery. He won’t play round 1. 

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    On 12/13/2021 at 11:03 PM, Chook said:

    Maybe it was Selwyn not Burgess that got the Dees fit and firing:

     

    The Weid also had stress fractures under Burgo at the start of last year. 

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    1 hour ago, Webber said:

    Very unusual for any AFL club to play ACL reconstructions inside 12 months post- surgery. He won’t play round 1. 

    Well he played in the match simulation last Friday, and they wouldn't have done that if he wasnt 100% fit, so on that basis unless there is a hiccup I think he would be right to go in round 1

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    3 minutes ago, picket fence said:

    Well he played in the match simulation last Friday, and they wouldn't have done that if he wasnt 100% fit, so on that basis unless there is a hiccup I think he would be right to go in round 1

    He wasn’t doing full contact. Used to be 9 months turnaround (surgery to full match ready) for ACL recons, but the last few years we’ve been standardising full rehab 12 months, predominantly to avoid incidence of ‘joint irritability’. Different surgeons have different ideas, but the vast majority now go with a 12 month protocol. Dispute it as you will, but if Tommo plays Round 1, it will be against trend. 

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    25 minutes ago, Webber said:

    He wasn’t doing full contact. Used to be 9 months turnaround (surgery to full match ready) for ACL recons, but the last few years we’ve been standardising full rehab 12 months, predominantly to avoid incidence of ‘joint irritability’. Different surgeons have different ideas, but the vast majority now go with a 12 month protocol. Dispute it as you will, but if Tommo plays Round 1, it will be against trend. 

    Is the Lars (or is it LARS) procedure still done? Or has it fallen out of favour?

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    3 hours ago, Webber said:

    He wasn’t doing full contact. Used to be 9 months turnaround (surgery to full match ready) for ACL recons, but the last few years we’ve been standardising full rehab 12 months, predominantly to avoid incidence of ‘joint irritability’. Different surgeons have different ideas, but the vast majority now go with a 12 month protocol. Dispute it as you will, but if Tommo plays Round 1, it will be against trend. 

    Not disputing your logic, but it was a full on Match simulation in which he fully took part in. If the Doctors or Physios had any doubt about his knee standing up to full match sim, would they have let him play?? Would seen foolishly risky if there was ANY doubt!

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    On 12/13/2021 at 9:54 PM, WERRIDEE said:

    It's controversial either one in the team will do me. Dunstan got 12 votes in the brownlow while Sparrow has had none. He's a good player Sparrow and will only get better but Dunstan's experience just gets him over the line for mine.

    Knowing Goodie I reckon he will go in unchanged. 

    Reason is Sparrow and Hibbo  both played good games and earned their spot.
    Both Tommo and Dunstan can wait to show form in practice matches and maybe even early Casey rounds to displace Tom and Michael.

    Actually Hunt and Joel Smith come into the frame for a back spot also and Jordon for a mid position if any injuries occur.

    There would be something special about the "Same Great Special 23" repeating the dose in Round 1 again over the Dogs in our history and AFL tales.

    Its only a feeling but Goody  won't make changes for changes sake. Tommo for one may be better off in the Ressies to ease back into top condition. 

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    6 minutes ago, 58er said:

    Knowing Goodie I reckon he will go in unchanged. 

    Reason is Sparrow and Hibbo  both played good games and earned their spot.
    Both Tommo and Dunstan can wait to show form in practice matches and maybe even early Casey rounds to displace Tom and Michael.

    Actually Hunt and Joel Smith come into the frame for a back spot also and Jordon for a mid position if any injuries occur.

    There would be something special about the "Same Great Special 23" repeating the dose in Round 1 again over the Dogs in our history and AFL tales.

    Its only a feeling but Goody  won't make changes for changes sake. Tommo for one may be better off in the Ressies to ease back into top condition. 

    If it makes the team better why not? The last thing we need is complacency. What if Dunstan, Hunt, Smith and others get of to flyers at training and in pre season games. Competition for game time will be the hottest for years, maybe for all time at the Dees.

    Edited by picket fence

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    11 minutes ago, 58er said:

    Knowing Goodie I reckon he will go in unchanged. 

    Reason is Sparrow and Hibbo  both played good games and earned their spot.
    Both Tommo and Dunstan can wait to show form in practice matches and maybe even early Casey rounds to displace Tom and Michael.

    Actually Hunt and Joel Smith come into the frame for a back spot also and Jordon for a mid position if any injuries occur.

    There would be something special about the "Same Great Special 23" repeating the dose in Round 1 again over the Dogs in our history and AFL tales.

    Its only a feeling but Goody  won't make changes for changes sake. Tommo for one may be better off in the Ressies to ease back into top condition. 

    Grand final form does not carry into round 1 next year. Its a completely clean slate going into the new year. This was the key message that was given to Luke Dunstan by Simon Goodwin.

    If there is an opportunity there that a player can make us one better then the grand final team then I'm taking that over anything.

    That means a fully fit Jayden Hunt replaces Hibberd, and pending pre season form and injury, Dunstan could easily mount a case over Jordon, Sparrow, and potentially Harmes.

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    4 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

    Is the Lars (or is it LARS) procedure still done? Or has it fallen out of favour?

    Haven’t seen or heard of it for ~ 5 years. 

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    4 minutes ago, picket fence said:

    If it makes the team better why not? The last thing we need is complacency. What if Dunstan, Hunt, Smith and others get of to flyers at training and in pre season games. Competition for game time will be the hottest for years, maybe for all time at the Dees.

    I respect your training notes and assessment but let's cool the jets a bit.

    NEither Tom nor Hibbo were poor in fact Sparrow I believe had what I would call a break out game ( his best and most impactful)  and Hibbo really did not make any costly errors resulting in goals.

    The team balance would be better also with a more agile player than Tommo if Hibbo was considered to be dropped. Hunt and Smith are indeed more like for like. 
    If Tommo was picked I thought that Petty was out marked more than any one  in the GF and that is like for like.

    Dunstan I have no doubt will be a great pickup by the Club but no need to rush him if all our contributors to the Flag  are fit and resting to go!

    Its a great position the Club have placed themselves in and a great credit to the players and Coaches that intensity is a given to make our chosen 23 each Match day.

     

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    2 minutes ago, 58er said:

    I respect your training notes and assessment but let's cool the jets a bit.

    NEither Tom nor Hibbo were poor in fact Sparrow I believe had what I would call a break out game ( his best and most impactful)  and Hibbo really did not make any costly errors resulting in goals.

    The team balance would be better also with a more agile player than Tommo if Hibbo was considered to be dropped. Hunt and Smith are indeed more like for like. 
    If Tommo was picked I thought that Petty was out marked more than any one  in the GF and that is like for like.

    Dunstan I have no doubt will be a great pickup by the Club but no need to rush him if all our contributors to the Flag  are fit and resting to go!

    Its a great position the Club have placed themselves in and a great credit to the players and Coaches that intensity is a given to make our chosen 23 each Match day.

     

    Resting means "raring" to go!! 

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    1 hour ago, picket fence said:

    Not disputing your logic, but it was a full on Match simulation in which he fully took part in. If the Doctors or Physios had any doubt about his knee standing up to full match sim, would they have let him play?? Would seen foolishly risky if there was ANY doubt!

    On one of Burgo's podcasts he and Brukky talk about comebacks from ACLs.  AFL is the only sport apparently with a 12 month rehab.  Soccer and NFL are 6 months, and the rate of injury recurrence in soccer and NFL are the same as AFL. Burgo also pre-empted the argument that AFL is somehow harder on knees and he argues the opposite.  If Tomlinson comes back in round 1 and does his knee everyone will blame Selwyn.  If he comes back in round 8 and does it everyone will blame bad luck.  The odds apparently are the same either way.     

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    7 hours ago, Webber said:

    Very unusual for any AFL club to play ACL reconstructions inside 12 months post- surgery. He won’t play round 1. 

    I feel like half our AFLW players did ACL’s two years ago and came back to play last season. 

    Nic Nat was one week before a year. Lever one week after. Should be noted: Both then got injured and missed more weeks.

    If it’s not a week by week protocol but a check off the boxes protocol that’s meant to take 52 weeks on an average pace I can see Tommo making up some of the 6 week gap between round 1 and a full year out.

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    1 hour ago, Watson11 said:

    Burgo also pre-empted the argument that AFL is somehow harder on knees and he argues the opposite.

    Two problems with this. Australian Rules Football produces more ACL ruptures per playing hour per player than any football sport in the world. The reason rehab has been pushed from 9 to 12 months is not to reduce the risk of graft failure (it doesn’t), but to lessen the incidence of general joint irritability on return to the game (which has to do with lingering joint surface trauma suffered during the injury that ruptured the ligament). It has done that. As I’ve said, there are surgeons who push more aggressive returns. I don’t know who did Tommo’s knee, but if he comes back ‘early’, I’ve got more than a fair idea. 

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    1 hour ago, Webber said:

    Two problems with this. Australian Rules Football produces more ACL ruptures per playing hour per player than any football sport in the world. The reason rehab has been pushed from 9 to 12 months is not to reduce the risk of graft failure (it doesn’t), but to lessen the incidence of general joint irritability on return to the game (which has to do with lingering joint surface trauma suffered during the injury that ruptured the ligament). It has done that. As I’ve said, there are surgeons who push more aggressive returns. I don’t know who did Tommo’s knee, but if he comes back ‘early’, I’ve got more than a fair idea. 

    Well you are right about AFL having a higher ACL rate (2.4x that of soccer in the study I found) but interestingly that is in males at the elite level.  For womens AFL and soccer it seems to be the same ridiculously high rate.  But what’s the story with the 6 month rehab Burgo talks about in soccer? Don’t they have the same joint irritation issues?

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