Loan System for Players to Swap Clubs

[whatwhat say what 22,772]

the most hilarious thing about dimma's suggestion is that he didn't even know the name of the player - that's how low on the totem pole he is

plus i believe he was originally a queensland academy zone player in the first place?

gc17 wouldn't want to 'loan' some unproven kid as a stand-in ruckman anyway - they'd be more likely to target mabior chol as a player who CAN play ruck at afl level as already proven

[Sir Why You Little 37,046]

27 minutes ago, Cheesy D. Pun said:

Not sure the EPL is a framework we want to replicate. They have had the same 6 clubs (at best) vying for the title since it's inception. That league has 10-14 teams that are systematically shut out of fighting for the title.

Our game can be professional and flourish without relying on transactional elements from overseas sports and their privately-owned teams.

Having a player play for you one week, then against you the next, is ludicrous and turns elite competition into a farce.

Fair points. But the VFL system has been gutted and ruined 

Will be interesting to see what happens 

[roy11 3,853]

I like soccer loans for player development, but it's the world game with a pyramid league structure in numerous countries, the complete opposite to AFL really. 

Whilst it may help in some circumstances it'd generally cause more questions;

• How does it work with the cap/player numbers ? - Are they just injury replacements?
• Can they play their parent club?  - 
• What happens if the parent club needs back - some loans have clauses for call backs, Can he play for 2 teams in same season?

If he is playing for 2 teams in 2 seasons they may as well institute a mid-season trade for professional players not just rookies. This again opens more questions, AFL should just confirm the mid-season rookie draft and let that be the issue. 

At the end of the day injuries happen and GC were given concessions for larger squads, relative tough luck.

[Pickett2Jackson 3,904]

Dumbest [censored] I have ever heard

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

Yes, let's let the coaches make the rules. What could go wrong?

[BDA 22,755]

2 hours ago, Ollie fan said:

What a crock. How do you barrack against your own player?

It'll be a term of the loan that the player won't play against their parent club. That's how it works in soccer. The loan player is too conflicted so their is a chance he won't play to potential although their was a famous case in the champions league about 20 years or so ago when Fernando Morientes was on loan to Monaco but ended up knocking his parent club, Real Madrid, out of the comp. Real were widely mocked for not inserting the clause. 

https://thesefootballtimes.co/2020/02/17/fernando-morientes-and-the-haunting-of-real-madrid/

[BDA 22,755]

2 hours ago, BW511 said:

Imagine if you loaned out a player that helped said side make finals over your own.

For instance a ruckman or KPP

You'd have the option to recall the player. No team would be expected to strenghten a direct rival at their own expense. 

[BDA 22,755]

2 hours ago, Damo said:

Scenario. What if we lend Daw to North. But Daw wont go and they want the Weid because although equal Jackson is picked for us and Weid is in the Ressies but asks to go to North for 4 weeks. Then in the 1st week Jackson is injured, so we have to play Daw because Weid is not there.

A lot of posters are over thinking this?

Parent club has a recall option and host club a return option. If at any point the loan is not working for either party for any reason the loan is terminated. 

In your example, if Jackson is injured we recall the Weid straight away.

Loans happen all the time in other sports. Absolutely no reason why they can't work in AFL. As long as the arrangement is mutually beneficial to both parties.

Edited April 8, 2021 by Better days ahead

[roy11 3,853]

34 minutes ago, Better days ahead said:

It'll be a term of the loan that the player won't play against their parent club. That's how it works in soccer. The loan player is too conflicted so their is a chance he won't play to potential although their was a famous case in the champions league about 20 years or so ago when Fernando Morientes was on loan to Monaco but ended up knocking his parent club, Real Madrid, out of the comp. Real were widely mocked for not inserting the clause. 

https://thesefootballtimes.co/2020/02/17/fernando-morientes-and-the-haunting-of-real-madrid/

UEFA ignore these clauses nowadays, uncertain if they would back then. 
 

‘Both the UEFA Champions League and the UEFA Disciplinary Regulations contain clear provisions which strictly forbid any club to exert, or attempt to exert, any influence whatsoever over the players that another club may (or may not) field in a match. It follows that any provision in a private contract between clubs which might function in such a way as to influence who a club fields in a match is null, void and unenforceable so far as UEFA is concerned.”

That’s what they said with Chelsea/Atletico situation about Courtois in 2014

[Smokey 4,389]

Rubbish idea that will reward poor list management in the end. 

[DubDee 25,886]

Good idea. Especially in positions like the ruck. If all are injured there are no options for clubs. Loaning would give a guy a chance to play and develop rather than playing the lower level and help the injury impacted team

[Rolling Stone 157]

Can we borrow Oscar from Carlton this week to play as the medical sub?

[Demonstone 22,560]

I think it's human nature that, when confronted with an idea that's new and radical, to have a knee jerk reaction of looking for possible faults/negatives and automatically rejecting the concept.

Having given this proposal some thought, I believe is is not without merit.  My two cents.

[daisycutter 29,616]

34 minutes ago, demonstone said:

I think it's human nature that, when confronted with an idea that's new and radical, to have a knee jerk reaction of looking for possible faults/negatives and automatically rejecting the concept.

Having given this proposal some thought, I believe is is not without merit.  My two cents.

is it human nature to use double negatives?

[drysdale demon 4,836]

2 hours ago, Better days ahead said:

Loans happen all the time in other sports. Absolutely no reason why they can't work in AFL. As long as the arrangement is mutually beneficial to both parties.

Besides EPL which other sports do loans happen in all the time?

[daisycutter 29,616]

1 minute ago, drysdale demon said:

Besides EPL which other sports do loans happen in all the time?

nrl

storm had harry grant on loan to wests tigers all of 2020 where he starred as hooker (storm had excess hookers) 

[Rab D Nesbitt 8,367]

It's pretty common in football for a clause to be included that the player loaned out cannot play against them in a competitive game. 

We could've done the same thing with Frosty but insist he plays against us as part of any deal. 

[drysdale demon 4,836]

1 minute ago, daisycutter said:

nrl

storm had harry grant on loan to wests tigers all of 2020 where he starred as hooker (storm had excess hookers) 

Thanks, but I still reckon it is a crap idea.

[PaulRB 6,371]

26 minutes ago, daisycutter said:

is it human nature to use double negatives?

only when they want to say they're involved but not committed (Thanks Picket)...

[BDA 22,755]

2 hours ago, roy11 said:

UEFA ignore these clauses nowadays, uncertain if they would back then. 
 

‘Both the UEFA Champions League and the UEFA Disciplinary Regulations contain clear provisions which strictly forbid any club to exert, or attempt to exert, any influence whatsoever over the players that another club may (or may not) field in a match. It follows that any provision in a private contract between clubs which might function in such a way as to influence who a club fields in a match is null, void and unenforceable so far as UEFA is concerned.”

That’s what they said with Chelsea/Atletico situation about Courtois in 2014

Correct. UEFA prohibits them but most national associations permit e.g. EPL. So a parent club could face a player they have loaned to a European club in a UEFA competition but not in domestic competition.

The AFL are free to set their own rules anyways

[BDA 22,755]

47 minutes ago, drysdale demon said:

Besides EPL which other sports do loans happen in all the time?

Most soccer leagues around the world permit as well as the EPL. Definitely all the European leagues

In the UK - Rugby league, rugby union and County Cricket.

It’s not done in the US other than in Ice Hockey.

The IPL have recently introduced a loan system.

[Demonstone 22,560]

1 hour ago, daisycutter said:

is it human nature to use double negatives?

It's not unheard of.  

[drysdale demon 4,836]

1 hour ago, Better days ahead said:

Most soccer leagues around the world permit as well as the EPL. Definitely all the European leagues

In the UK - Rugby league, rugby union and County Cricket.

It’s not done in the US other than in Ice Hockey.

The IPL have recently introduced a loan system.

Thanks.

[kev martin 9,937]

Much rather see them encourage loyalty. Pay players extra pay, above the cap, for staying at the same club.

Clubs get extra funds for retention. So encourage more buy in, and development by the clubs, in the players. 

Will reduce poaching. 

Players with home sickness or emotional distresses can have a please explain. 

The fringe players will eventually get a go if good enough, or will be traded/delisted at the right time.

Manage their list better. Bad list management, such as Richmond can be fixed at the end of season.

Get someone from outside the AFL if they lose important structural players that can't be replaced. After a please explain to the AFL hierarchy. 

They want supporters loyalty, how about the hierarchy show some mutual obligation to us with player retentions. 

Edited April 8, 2021 by kev martin

[BDA 22,755]

1 minute ago, drysdale demon said:

Thanks.

You're welcome