Punt Road redevelopment

[Kent 2,914]

2 minutes ago, Half forward flank said:

I suggest you need to get out and go down to North Melbourne and Carlton to start some research. Then on to the Bulldogs.

Why would i do that? I am only interested in the DEES future, dont give a toss about what those other clubs have achieved

The fact that they have a home base and we don't just says it all

We obviously dont have a current plan or Pert would be talking about it

Casey here we come! The home ground  you have when you don't have a home ground

[Half forward flank 1,022]

3 minutes ago, Kent said:

Why would i do that? I am only interested in the DEES future, dont give a toss about what those other clubs have achieved

The fact that they have a home base and we don't just says it all

We obviously dont have a current plan or Pert would be talking about it

Casey here we come! The home ground  you have when you don't have a home ground

You are all over the place kent.  The reason people should look at other Clubs facilities is that those clubs got Government grants based on what their facilities do to help the community as much as for the AFL playing side of things. Our jolimont plan offered nothing the community saw as a benefit and i cannot see anything a mooted development near the tennis centre could offer the community.

[Kent 2,914]

2 minutes ago, Half forward flank said:

You are all over the place kent.  The reason people should look at other Clubs facilities is that those clubs got Government grants based on what their facilities do to help the community as much as for the AFL playing side of things. Our jolimont plan offered nothing the community saw as a benefit and i cannot see anything a mooted development near the tennis centre could offer the community.

No I am not all over the place 1/2, there are other clubs who took advantage of those opportunities   good on them !

MFC has to write its own story and develop its own plan. We haven't done it so now we are homeless and will continue to be unfortunately

[Lucifers Hero 40,362]

On 11/29/2020 at 6:37 AM, Pates said:

When we started getting shuffled around between various different grounds for training the club should’ve tried to create their own base near the G or at least not far away. Possibly complaisant thinking they had something to plug the hole rather than getting a long term solution. 

Pert has said a number of times there are options being discussed but nothing seems to be materialising. If he can get it done he will go down in history at the club. 

In describing Mahoney's new role Pert said:  "Josh will be a key part of the government led working party for the new home base development..."

I cringed at the government leading the working party for our home base.  The government has other priorities and at best it moves at glacial pace.  I have no idea how this critical development went from an mfc owned program to one run by a government working party. 

I understand the need to get governments on-side but I would think that would be to evaluate and then endorse our preferred options not to hand over control of the whole process.  I now have less hope of us getting a home base than ever before.

[Kent 2,914]

11 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

In describing Mahoney's new role Pert said:  "Josh will be a key part of the government led working party for the new home base development..."

I cringed at the government leading the working party for our home base.  The government has other priorities and at best it moves at glacial pace.  I have no idea how this critical development went from an mfc owned program to one run by a government working party. 

I understand the need to get governments on-side but I would think that would be to evaluate and then endorse our preferred options not to hand over control of the whole process.  I now have less hope of us getting a home base than ever before.

Just Bizzare LH !

[old dee 23,872]

33 minutes ago, Kent said:

Isn't that a fantastic outcome for the original footy team?

The result of poor boards and presidents over a long long time

What a pathetic Joke!

Correct that successive boards over 50 years have bought us to this point.

However it is no use complaining about the past it cannot be changed. 
Unlike most I would be happy for us to establish a good training facility anywhere.

I am not welded to the G. However it seems the MFC board are so we wait for the very difficult to be achieved.

[drdrake 3,187]

41 minutes ago, old dee said:

Looks like we are moving to Casey this year. Could be the start of the future. 

I drove past Goschs Paddock yesterday, the ground had cyclone fencing all round.  I'm assuming this will be a covid thing for preseason training.

The members forum is the ideal opportunity to raise the question, basically every Victorian club has received State or Federal funding for facility upgrades this year.  Money will dry up as governments try to eat into deficits in the years to come.

When you will look what the other AFL teams will have at their facilities, the MFC is as far behind other clubs as we where when training at the Junction Oval, our facilities have improved dramatically but are now a way off other clubs

[BDA 22,882]

The MGC precinct is the preference but if it’s too hard to get off the ground then I suggest we stop banging our heads against a brick wall and look at alternatives.

From the club’s perspective you’d think the location which is selected would maximise revenues from memberships and be an attractive location to host conferences/social functions etc. Accessible via public transport important as well. And of course tick the “community benefit” box.

The government is throwing money around like confetti at the moment. But things change quickly. If a vaccine arrives and the economy picks up the focus could change to debt reduction and we miss out. Another missed opportunity!

Btw I wouldn’t be in favor of Casey as the home base. Too far out.

[BDA 22,882]

29 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

the government led working party

Say it ain't so! Hotel quarantine program. enough said.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,909]

32 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

In describing Mahoney's new role Pert said:  "Josh will be a key part of the government led working party for the new home base development..."

I cringed at the government leading the working party for our home base.  The government has other priorities and at best it moves at glacial pace.  I have no idea how this critical development went from an mfc owned program to one run by a government working party. 

I understand the need to get governments on-side but I would think that would be to evaluate and then endorse our preferred options not to hand over control of the whole process.  I now have less hope of us getting a home base than ever before.

Generally I would agree that having a "government led working party" is a recipe for constant delay. However, givem all the land we would be interested in is Government owned, giving the government leadership of this project could work in our favour. I expecy, however, that one of Pert's "jobs" will be to continue to push the government officers to make sure there is continuing progress.

Government being in cahrge is another reason why Pert can't keep members updated. It's not "his"project to discuss. Any statements will be controlled by the government.

[Pates 9,660]

I know so many locations have been spoken about for ages but I’ve always felt that Elwood Park is the best opportunity for an existing location that is community connected and has a large enough space for expanding and creating a high class training facility. People with more knowledge I’m sure will be able to tell me why that isn’t viable for us. 

The plus side to it is that while it isn’t in the MCG precinct it isn’t exactly far away. It’s also close to public transport links allowing the ability for people to come watch training easily enough. I’ve also often though Elwood park would be the perfect location for a boutique stadium if they were ever to create one. 

Edited December 1, 2020 by Pates

[Lucifers Hero 40,362]

41 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Generally I would agree that having a "government led working party" is a recipe for constant delay. However, givem all the land we would be interested in is Government owned, giving the government leadership of this project could work in our favour. I expecy, however, that one of Pert's "jobs" will be to continue to push the government officers to make sure there is continuing progress.

Government being in cahrge is another reason why Pert can't keep members updated. It's not "his"project to discuss. Any statements will be controlled by the government.

Undoubtedly the government needs to be involved.  But I don't see how the government leading the project works in our favour.

Having worked as a consultant to various organisations I would never advise a client to hand over a project to a government (of any persuasion).  There are other ways to work (jointly) with them eg:

Agree project plan and parameters with the government upfront:

• preferred location 1, 2 and 3
• broad based feasibility of each option
• community benefit needs/obstacles
• identify community stake holders for each preferred location
• community consultation processes
• timelines to update government decision makers/stake holders at key milestones
• secondment of government staff to an MFC led working party
• broad budget parameters
• etc etc

I would have thought the first 4 were done during Peter Jackson's reign.

If the parameters above are agreed upfront there is no reason why a project can't run smoothly.  Sure there will be obstacles but having a good project plan enables those to be worked through at the right time.  Then we get the work done at MFC tempo and priorities and not anyone else.

That Pert can't keep members updated is an indictment of handing over control.  As I said in my earlier post I do not understand how it came to that.

At the members forum this is the primary question that requires an answer.

Edited December 1, 2020 by Lucifer's Hero

[drdrake 3,187]

17 minutes ago, Pates said:

I know so many locations have been spoken about for ages but I’ve always felt that Elwood Park is the best opportunity for an existing location that is community connected and has a large enough space for expanding and creating a high class training facility. People with more knowledge I’m sure will be able to tell me why that isn’t viable for us. 

The plus side to it is that while it isn’t in the MCG precinct it isn’t exactly far away. It’s also close to public transport links allowing the ability for people to come watch training easily enough. I’ve also often though Elwood park would be the perfect location for a boutique stadium if they were ever to create one. 

To me thinking outside the box, look at Royal park team up with Netball Victoria, VIS and Melbourne Vixens, have a facility that will also cater for the high performance Netball.  Netball will use the indoor courts at State Netball Centre for training there are many ovals near their we can make into our base and have a building that caters for the clubs indoor training needs and admins.

Keeps us on the out skirts of the City, even add in something to do with the Hospitals in that vicinity maybe a physical rehab centre or something like that.

 

Edited December 1, 2020 by drdrake

[Lucifers Hero 40,362]

This is from MFC's 2019 annual accounts:

"The Club invested $0.244m in the project during the year... This expenditure is not site specific, and has been critical to defining the Club’s requirements for its new home base. The Victorian State Government has also contributed funding for a feasibility study on options within the Melbourne Sporting Precinct."

Reading that last year surprised me as I had thought the 'Club's requirements' and some of the 'feasibility studies' were done during Peter Jackson's reign (when the ill-fated Jolimont station option was leaked). 

There are only so many (and precious few) options in the Melbourne Sporting Precinct. That after 3-4 years of work by Jackson/Pert and hundreds and thousands of $ spent (presumably Consultant costs) we are no closer to identifying a location is troubling to say the least.

Edited December 1, 2020 by Lucifer's Hero

[Half forward flank 1,022]

52 minutes ago, Pates said:

I know so many locations have been spoken about for ages but I’ve always felt that Elwood Park is the best opportunity for an existing location that is community connected and has a large enough space for expanding and creating a high class training facility. People with more knowledge I’m sure will be able to tell me why that isn’t viable for us. 

The plus side to it is that while it isn’t in the MCG precinct it isn’t exactly far away. It’s also close to public transport links allowing the ability for people to come watch training easily enough. I’ve also often though Elwood park would be the perfect location for a boutique stadium if they were ever to create one. 

Sorry pate, it is Public land and not a chance in hell. 

[Half forward flank 1,022]

Logic, that is walking the MCG precinct tells us there is no opportunity in that area. The rest is a mix of stubborness to tradition which ignores the fact that Carlton, Kangas, Pies, Tigers all have home bases within one km of the CBD. The area we claim as historically belonging to us. It is just an absurd and misleading assumption and I couldnt care less about the Melbourne (Collins St) part of our name or CBD location.

[Neil Crompton 5,620]

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

This is from MFC's 2019 annual accounts:

"The Club invested $0.244m in the project during the year... This expenditure is not site specific, and has been critical to defining the Club’s requirements for its new home base. The Victorian State Government has also contributed funding for a feasibility study on options within the Melbourne Sporting Precinct."

Reading that last year surprised me as I had thought the 'Club's requirements' and some of the 'feasibility studies' were done during Peter Jackson's reign (when the ill-fated Jolimont station option was leaked). 

There are only so many (and precious few) options in the Melbourne Sporting Precinct. That after 3-4 years of work by Jackson/Pert and hundreds and thousands of $ spent (presumably Consultant costs) we are no closer to identifying a location is troubling to say the least.

Luci, if you listen to the Glen Bartlett podcast (1/07/2020) he states that the phase 1 feasibility study is complete (which identified approx 4 possible option sites within the Melbourne Sporting Precinct) and that now the Phase 2 feasibility study is underway which focuses on the preferred option site within the Melbourne Sporting Precinct. He stated that while COVID has set the program back somewhat, it was now full steam ahead with finalising the designs for the preferred site. The MSP base will house all the football departments as well as a social club and training facilities ( training oval will not be MCG size). Casey will be a second facility with MCG size oval and indoor training facilities. He suggested that based on overseas examples, most major clubs had a city base and a second home some distance away. This is the model we have followed.

Perhaps a more positive outlook now than what the 2019 annual report was able to outline at the time. 

[old dee 23,872]

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

This is from MFC's 2019 annual accounts:

"The Club invested $0.244m in the project during the year... This expenditure is not site specific, and has been critical to defining the Club’s requirements for its new home base. The Victorian State Government has also contributed funding for a feasibility study on options within the Melbourne Sporting Precinct."

Reading that last year surprised me as I had thought the 'Club's requirements' and some of the 'feasibility studies' were done during Peter Jackson's reign (when the ill-fated Jolimont station option was leaked). 

There are only so many (and precious few) options in the Melbourne Sporting Precinct. That after 3-4 years of work by Jackson/Pert and hundreds and thousands of $ spent (presumably Consultant costs) we are no closer to identifying a location is troubling to say the least.

Spot on LH. While we remained welded to the G area it is going to be very difficult. It will be interesting what is said about the project the coming members up date. I just want a facility where it is I truely don't care.

[Willmoy1947 4,140]

I wouldn't be averse to a Victorian or indeed Australian Sporting History Building, or both to be incorporated seeing as we were the First Club.

[Lucifers Hero 40,362]

1 hour ago, Neil Crompton said:

Luci, if you listen to the Glen Bartlett podcast (1/07/2020) he states that the phase 1 feasibility study is complete (which identified approx 4 possible option sites within the Melbourne Sporting Precinct) and that now the Phase 2 feasibility study is underway which focuses on the preferred option site within the Melbourne Sporting Precinct. He stated that while COVID has set the program back somewhat, it was now full steam ahead with finalising the designs for the preferred site. The MSP base will house all the football departments as well as a social club and training facilities ( training oval will not be MCG size). Casey will be a second facility with MCG size oval and indoor training facilities. He suggested that based on overseas examples, most major clubs had a city base and a second home some distance away. This is the model we have followed.

Perhaps a more positive outlook now than what the 2019 annual report was able to outline at the time. 

Thank you.  I much appreciate that info.  It is comforting that progress is happening.

I'm still a bit concerned on Pert's comment a month ago that the government is leading the working party.  Any idea why that is happening?

Edited December 2, 2020 by Lucifer's Hero

[old dee 23,872]

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Thank you.  I much appreciate that info.  It is comforting that progress is happening.

I'm still a bit concerned on Pert's comment a month ago that the government is leading the working party.  Any idea why that is happening?

It's all about the look and passing the pub test. They have to be seen to be in charge. Would not be a good look for a Labor government to be seen following a conservative silver tails club. They need to be leading us down the path.

[Lucifers Hero 40,362]

42 minutes ago, old dee said:

It's all about the look and passing the pub test. They have to be seen to be in charge. Would not be a good look for a Labor government to be seen following a conservative silver tails club. They need to be leading us down the path.

Not the ole 'garden path', I hope

I jest!

[old dee 23,872]

14 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Not the ole 'garden path', I hope

I jest!

It looks a little like that LH. 

[Gouga 570]

Collingwood don't own Olympic Park Oval. The oval is managed by the MOPT. Their deal just gives them access. I note the MFC players are were informally training on it today. 

Why can't we have offices, gym, etc. at the 'G with shared access to Olympic Park Oval / Goshs' Paddock Oval with Collingwood. Maybe Gosh's could be upgraded to Marvel size as part of this. My understanding is space in the G freed up with Cricket Victoria relocating to Junction Oval. Eddie won't like it, but Eddie can [censored] off. Upgraded facilities at the G could then be incorporated into the Southern Stand upgrade?

I know lots say its a pipe dream, but reestablishing us at the G (with access to nearby MOPT managed ovals) would be my preference. The MCG became the mecca it is of the back of football including the MFC, and there is an inequality that exists with no formal recognition of this.    

      

[dpositive 1,684]

4 hours ago, Half forward flank said:

Logic, that is walking the MCG precinct tells us there is no opportunity in that area. The rest is a mix of stubborness to tradition which ignores the fact that Carlton, Kangas, Pies, Tigers all have home bases within one km of the CBD. The area we claim as historically belonging to us. It is just an absurd and misleading assumption and I couldnt care less about the Melbourne (Collins St) part of our name or CBD location.

I felt the same logic when viewing the precinct. It's why I was surprised when I got lost in Port Melbourne , which coincided with a search for the Ron Barassi oval. That facility does exist and Port Melbourne which wears the red and blue colours is rich with the history of the game which the Melbourne Football Club represents.

we could do worse than look closely at some of the sites in that now reclaimed area. A joint entertainment community facility would not be out of place in a rejuvenated area, the government may even be persuaded to support such an initiative more generously.