Farewell Jesse Hogan

[DistrACTION Jackson 8,460]

4 minutes ago, Leoncelli_36 said:

? these blokes are literally just making it up on the run

They just talk for the sake of talking. It is incredible really, I wonder how much they are getting paid for this c*rap?

Dal Santo yesterday saying Tyson is a good user on the outside.... seriously no idea! He's an inside mid with questionable disposal who's been forced to play on the wing.

McClure suggesting Hogan isn't worth two first round picks when he is one of the best young key forwards in the game.....

I'd suggest stop listening and giving them air time.

[Lord Neville X Flash 270]

Just now, rpfc said:

 

 

Twice on every page!

Probably because the way the story is being reported, i've heard trade radio say freo may hold off a year and then Hogan can walk from melbourne. 

[GCDee 3,199]

5 minutes ago, Graeme Yeats' Mullet said:

Agree with this and others above - 1 x First Rounder (even plus scraps) is way unders

I just find it interesting that the sentiment is so far progressed to him being gone, even from Mahoney saying ball is completely in Jesse's court. Couple this with Freo having limited draft pick currency and aspirations for Lobb and/or others this year. I feel I'm missing something, or the deal is not all that feasible givem Freo's position.

If I'm missing something, what is it?

I really think we see an opportunity to really balance our list & push for a flag in the near future if we move on Hogan now. We probably know he is leaving next contract and don't see the need to hang onto him for one last year. 

Mahoney can't let it seem like he is blowing his load at the opportunity moving on Hogan gives us. 

If we make it look like its his decision and we are losing a key contracted player then in theory he holds more value. 

Just my opinion however

[old55 23,347]

1 minute ago, Lord Neville X Flash said:

Probably because the way the story is being reported, i've heard trade radio say freo may hold off a year and then Hogan can walk from melbourne. 

He is out of contract at the end of 2019 but he is not a free agent then.  Scroll back through the thread if you need verification, it has been explained a number of times.

Edited October 3, 2018 by Fifty-5

[jnrmac 20,053]

1 minute ago, Lord Neville X Flash said:

Probably because the way the story is being reported, i've heard trade radio say freo may hold off a year and then Hogan can walk from melbourne. 

....but we have already established they are idiots and are just looking for something to fill 500 hours of radio time.

[Lord Neville X Flash 270]

2 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

He is out of contract at the end of 2019 but he is not a free agent then.  Scroll back through the thread if you need verification, it has been explained a number of times.

 

1 minute ago, jnrmac said:

....but we have already established they are idiots and are just looking for something to fill 500 hours of radio time.

I am not arguing that he is a free agent... just saying why people may assume he is. People on demonland get so salty over the littlest things. 

[old55 23,347]

37 minutes ago, Lord Neville X Flash said:

We have a crack at the flag with Hogan in 2019, telling him it's only one more year until he's a free agent. 

 

[Diamond_Jim 12,511]

1 minute ago, GCDee said:

I really think we see an opportunity to really balance our list & push for a flag in the near future if we move on Hogan now. We probably know he is leaving next contract and don't see the need to hang onto him for one last year. 

Mahoney can't let it seem like he is blowing his load at the opportunity moving on Hogan gives us. 

If we make it look like its his decision and we are losing a key contracted player then in theory he holds more value. 

Just my opinion however

and that is why we are in the market.

He has apparently said he does not want to re sign this year.

Same position with May. GCS have asked him to re sign a year in advance. He has said ... maybe ... but I want to look around first.

Imagine having him on the list next year without him being re contracted... whatever you might say it isn't ideal.

We need the MFC story for 2019 to be about success not about Hogan moving West.

[Lampers 563]

1 minute ago, Fifty-5 said:

He is out of contract at the end of 2019 but he is not a free agent then.

Correct. 

Where this is confusing is Hogan was at the Demons in 2012 which means 8 years at the end of 2019.

BUT he was not eligible to play senior football in 2012 because he was too young with 2013 being his first eligible year.

Under current rules he is eligible for free agency after 2020 season but would need to extend his contract with Melbourne to qualify.

Melbourne definitely hold the cards in this deal so long as Hogan is OK to keep playing with Melbourne and all signs point to him not having a super firm view either way (which is good for Melbourne).

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,772]

8 minutes ago, Lampers said:

Correct. 

Where this is confusing is Hogan was at the Demons in 2012 which means 8 years at the end of 2019.

BUT he was not eligible to play senior football in 2012 because he was too young with 2013 being his first eligible year.

Under current rules he is eligible for free agency after 2020 season but would need to extend his contract with Melbourne to qualify.

Melbourne definitely hold the cards in this deal so long as Hogan is OK to keep playing with Melbourne and all signs point to him not having a super firm view either way (which is good for Melbourne).

If Jesse comes back to the club and says he wants to go, is our position then severely diminished?

I think it must be. It would be much harder to keep him on the list having told us he'd prefer not to be there...

Mahoney coming out publicly and saying this seems to me to dent our bargaining position - unless the deal has been done in principal already.

Does this explain Bell seemingly moving the goal posts? If so it's a pretty good negotiating ploy, get all the cards laid bare and then drop offer.

Edited October 3, 2018 by Graeme Yeats' Mullet

[deebug 1,754]

16 minutes ago, Is Dom Is Good said:

They just talk for the sake of talking. It is incredible really, I wonder how much they are getting paid for this c*rap?

Dal Santo yesterday saying Tyson is a good user on the outside.... seriously no idea! He's an inside mid with questionable disposal who's been forced to play on the wing.

McClure suggesting Hogan isn't worth two first round picks when he is one of the best young key forwards in the game.....

I'd suggest stop listening and giving them air time.

Funny that's just what i did yesterday, just got so sick of them.

[Lampers 563]

I’ve had a quick chat to contact at the club.

A little bit if guesswork to fill in blanks, but Hogan isn’t a standard cat. He’s a bit introverted, aloof and hard to get to know.

Just like any workplace, there is a prevailing culture and Hogan doesn’t quite fit in. So he’s probably never going to have the pull of staying to be with his boys, because he isn’t one of the boys.

The culture extends to the broader footy department and the relatively young staff that relates reasonably well to the current player group.

So this means despite his obvious talent, there is more openness from the footy department to explore options than there would be than if Hogan was “one of the boys”.

It just reinforces a footy club has far more dynamics at play than pure onfield footy ability. There are those on the inner, those on the outer, favourites, politics etc.

These dynamics play out in week to week team selection too and can explain why some guys seem to play irrespective of form, whereas others always seem one mediocre game away from getting dropped.

[Lord Neville X Flash 270]

If he stays for 2019, due to Freo and Melbourne not agreeing to a trade, then what happens?

How does trading an un-contracted non-free agent work?

[Dr. Gonzo 24,129]

13 minutes ago, Lampers said:

Correct. 

Where this is confusing is Hogan was at the Demons in 2012 which means 8 years at the end of 2019.

BUT he was not eligible to play senior football in 2012 because he was too young with 2013 being his first eligible year.

Under current rules he is eligible for free agency after 2020 season but would need to extend his contract with Melbourne to qualify.

Melbourne definitely hold the cards in this deal so long as Hogan is OK to keep playing with Melbourne and all signs point to him not having a super firm view either way (which is good for Melbourne).

No. He was drafted in 2012 and was with us at Casey in 2013. His first year on the senior list was 2014.

[GCDee 3,199]

1 minute ago, Lord Neville X Flash said:

If he stays for 2019, due to Freo and Melbourne not agreeing to a trade, then what happens?

How does trading an un-contracted non-free agent work?

Exactly like Lever for us last year. 

Either a trade gets made or he nominates for the draft. 

[Dr. Gonzo 24,129]

Just now, Lord Neville X Flash said:

If he stays for 2019, due to Freo and Melbourne not agreeing to a trade, then what happens?

How does trading an un-contracted non-free agent work?

Same as trading a contracted non-FA except he can walk to the draft if no trade gets done and he doesn't want to stay with Melbourne. Risks getting picked up by someone else though. Rarely happens, I think the last was Luke Ball in 2009.

[Lampers 563]

5 minutes ago, Graeme Yeats' Mullet said:

If Jesse comes back to the club and says he wants to go, is our position then severely diminished?

I think it must be. It would be much harder to keep him on the list having told us he'd prefer not to be there...

Absolutely, IF Hogan is adamant he doesn’t want to play at Melbourne then Melbourne’s hand is hurt.

But that is the case for any player at any time.

[Bonkers 994]

2 minutes ago, GCDee said:

Exactly like Lever for us last year. 

Either a trade gets made or he nominates for the draft. 

Exactly. We are in a strong bargaining position regardless. The only way we don't get what we want is to cave in, or Hogan chooses to go to the draft next year, which will not happen and hasn't happened since Luke Ball. We will get 2 first rounders this year or next year if Hogan wants to go to Freo and we stick to our guns.

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,772]

2 minutes ago, Lampers said:

Absolutely, IF Hogan is adamant he doesn’t want to play at Melbourne then Melbourne’s hand is hurt.

But that is the case for any player at any time.

Agree, so I'm kinda surprised then that this is playing out publicly

[Lampers 563]

5 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

No. He was drafted in 2012 and was with us at Casey in 2013. His first year on the senior list was 2014.

You’re right, so that puts his free agency eligibility out to end of 2021 which is even better for Melbourne.

[daisycutter 29,600]

3 minutes ago, Lampers said:

You’re right, so that puts his free agency eligibility out to end of 2021 which is even better for Melbourne.

NO

2020. because it goes by contract date, not by senior eligibility

[drdrake 3,157]

4 minutes ago, Graeme Yeats' Mullet said:

Agree, so I'm kinda surprised then that this is playing out publicly

Bit like Jack Watts last year, bit different though Watts wanted to stay but the club wanted to trade him, seems we are happy for Hogan to stay but we are unsure what he wants.  The club is a bit torn at the moment they see the benefits of trading Hogan  but also the downside is losing a very good player

[Nasher 33,607]

Possibly outcomes, in descending order of likelihood:

1) We get the deal done for fair trade

2) we can’t get the deal done, Hogan plays for us next year and we all have another crack at the end of next season 

3) we can’t get the deal done, Hogan plays for us next year and walks at the end of the year

I honestly can’t see 3) happening. He’s had multiple opportunities to shaft the club in his time here and he never has. I believe the club will get the job done, but I equally believe Hogan won’t screw us over if we negotiate in good faith. Going to the draft is not a threat we should concern ourselves with, and hopefully that’s a message Jesse’s manager gives to Freo.

[Lord Neville X Flash 270]

Just now, Nasher said:

Possibly outcomes, in descending order of likelihood:

1) We get the deal done for fair trade

2) we can’t get the deal done, Hogan plays for us next year and we all have another crack

3) we can’t get the deal done, Hogan plays for us next year and walks at the end of the year

I honestly can’t see 3) happening. He’s had multiple opportunities to shaft the club in his time here and he never has. I believe the club will get the job done, but I equally believe Hogan won’t screw us over if we negotiate in good faith. Going to the draft is not a threat we should concern ourselves with, and hopefully that’s a message Jesse’s manager gives to Freo.

equal 2) we get a poor deal but take it so as we get May

[trout 385]

Well Trade Radio on a week before any actual trades can be done has brought about some of the worst radio ever. Like others I was on the verge of calling in but then I thought that's exactly what Hutchy wants to happen to fill in the hours. But dead set that muppet Sam Scoop McClure saying Melbourne will do that pick 5 trade for Hogan because they want May, no they wont, they will do the deal when they get two first rounders for Hogan. Then to top it off he says how Essendon will need to give up this years and next years first round pick for Shiel but look out Carlton will get Shiel for just next years first round pick what an idiot.