Andrew Gaff

[Undeeterred 3,037]

14 minutes ago, layzie said:

Did either of us say that?

In no way am I letting the guy off I’m simply commenting on the method of the strike. I am not defending him, nor do I think he’ll get less than 7 weeks. 

No, you're probably right. I lumped you in with McQ in a hurry. 

Not saying he does either, but saying 'I'm not condoning it but these things happen in footy' [paraphrasing] sort of does condone it by implying some level of striking is 'understandable'

[Moonshadow 17,470]

Reckon Gaff will get 4

[deanox 9,641]

2 hours ago, Mach5 said:

I actually think it was quite similar, in that he was aiming lower and missed.

I'm not sure I agree because he was facing him.

1 hour ago, Moonshadow said:

If that's where the line is drawn, then every jumper punch, every tummy tap, every raised elbow should be charged by the cops as assault???

Gaff's hit was clearly bad and he will cop a heavy suspension. But he should not face criminal charges. That was my point.

There's plenty of over dramatic outrage on this thread in the last hour or two

I don't believe you don't understand the difference between this and a jumper punch.

When the two players are both actively involved in the tussel, the minor, low impact events dont require external attention. When someone is unexpectedly struck to the face off the ball doing damage that requires hospital and surgery, that can be looked at without damaging football. 

1 hour ago, Moonshadow said:

Agreed.

I didn't say Brayshaw wasn't assaulted (ie. physically attacked), but it wasn't outside a night club and he wasn't held by the police. With that logic, if it happened in Saudi Arabia he'd face 100 lashes. Context is different.

The rules of victoria apply on the football field and outside a night club.  The rules of Saudi Arabia do not apply. 

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Brayshaw was blocking Gaff from running. Under tribunal rules that's in play and it makes sense with how this occurred. If the ball was 1m away he wouldn't have been blocking and scrapping. Don't get fooled by Ross Lyon's emotions.

175 games for West Coast without incident and Adam Simpson clearly holds him in high regard. If he wants to stay there they won't change their offer to him one cent.

Joel Smith was dumped in a crude and possibly illegal tackle and is currently having reconstructive collar bone surgery. Should that be a case of assault as well?

A tackle is legal,  it went bad.  A punch is not legal anywhere. 

43 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Punching receives a fine from the MRP. Or sometimes no fine at all if minor force. Unduly rough tackles receive suspensions as well. Players are constantly belting elbows in to each other, throwing swinging arms in to tackles and crunching don't argues in to the chest or head. Gaff's was worse than that but I don't agree it was a simple stand and deliver punch. It was a wild lashed out round arm.

I'm not saying Gaff shouldn't get a lengthy suspension but I thought it was an in game incident and not a completely vicious one that had no context in the game. Barry Hall's was worthy of criminal charges. Bugg's wasn't and I don't think this is either.

If you watch the replay you'll see that it wasn't 100m from play. Gaff was right near the play and you'll see the umpire calling play on to the player with the ball. That's what I mean by getting sucked in to Ross Lyon's emotions.

Of course Ross is emotional, but that's why we have a tribunal and why courts have independent judges and juries and it's not people with close relationships who get to decide on the punishment of someone else.

I criticised Goodwin last year for being too harsh on Bugg. I though he and the club should've done more to defend Bugg as a good guy who made a costly mistake. Instead we went down this line of Bugg having to earn trust back from other players. 

Not vicious???

[layzie 32,744]

2 minutes ago, Undeeterred said:

No, you're probably right. I lumped you in with McQ in a hurry. 

Not saying he does either, but saying 'I'm not condoning it but these things happen in footy' [paraphrasing] sort of does condone it by implying some level of striking is 'understandable'

Fair enough. Make no mistake these things do not and absolutely should not happen in footy. Period. 

I don’t think Gaff is a thug, but he’s made a monumental mistake and won’t move past it easily. 

[pineapple dee 2,892]

41 minutes ago, McQueen said:

The way some of you are carrying on indicates you’ve never played a game of footy in your life. If you think Gaff aimed for Brayshaws head with that punch then you’re mistaken. I’m not condoning the action at all but I can understand how these things can happen in an instant. Gaff was clearly mortified by what he did and again I’m not condoning it - he deserves to go for weeks but I strongly believe the blow was not an intentional one directed to Brayshaws head.

Gaff isn’t a thug in my opinion but today he committed a very poorly timed hit that resulted in a terrible outcome of injuries for young Brayshaw.

I still want him at the MFC next year because he’s a great player of very good character.

What happened today was a combination of a brain fade and unfortunate timings.

This is precisely the sort of white wash and snow job we'll get from the apologists for the next 54 hours. Let's see some serious consequence for an act we never want to see in AFL or any other level of footy ever again.

Of course Gaffs s wonderful person of great character but that's cold comfort to Andrew Bradshaw tonight.

[SaberFang 7,151]

He won't play again in 2018 IMO. 6 weeks minimum. The only remote chance he has is West Coast finishing top 4 but losing their first final then winning every final thereafter.

That would make his first eligible return game the Grand Final, but would any club risk a player in the GF without proper conditioning? 7 weeks on the sidelines including the bye...

Short answer? No. He's played his last game for the Eagles and he knows it. Terrible way to go out.

[Moonshadow 17,470]

So I expect all of those who think Gaff should be charged by police to be picketing with placards outside the tribunal this week. 

Meanwhile, the players will accept it and move on

[SaberFang 7,151]

2 minutes ago, pineapple dee said:

This is precisely the sort of white wash and snow job we'll get from the apologists for the next 54 hours. Let's see some serious consequence for an act we never want to see in AFL or any other level of footy ever again.

Throughout history, lots of good people have made terrible mistakes. That doesn't stop them from being good people of good character but it also doesn't mean they shouldn't face the consequences for their actions. I have no interest in attacking Gaff's character, as this was clearly out of character for him. Nonetheless, the action deserves punishment and he must face these consequences.

There is no "good guy" defense, although the AFL have form trying to prove otherwise.

[Undeeterred 3,037]

3 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

So I expect all of those who think Gaff should be charged by police to be picketing with placards outside the tribunal this week. 

Meanwhile, the players will accept it and move on

Out of interest, are you saying that there's nothing on a footy field that would be chargeable?

I'm not having a go, am genuinely interested.

Where would you say the line is?

Edited August 5, 2018 by Undeeterred
Would/wouldn't. Tired.

[david_neitz_is_my_dad 4,083]

Gonna be some salty [censored] when he lands at the Dees or will they get over it like everyone else in 4 days time??

[biggestred 4,772]

4 minutes ago, SaberFang said:

Throughout history, lots of good people have made terrible mistakes. That doesn't stop them from being good people of good character but it also doesn't mean they shouldn't face the consequences for their actions. I have no interest in attacking Gaff's character, as this was clearly out of character for him. Nonetheless, the action deserves punishment and he must face these consequences.

There is no "good guy" defense, although the AFL have form trying to prove otherwise.

This time next year brayshaws teeth and Jaw will be fine.

Gaff will still be a piece of [censored].

[SaberFang 7,151]

2 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

So I expect all of those who think Gaff should be charged by police to be picketing with placards outside the tribunal this week. 

Hardly. Despite your gross oversimplification of the conversation, the point has merely been raised that committing the same offense outside the boundaries of an AFL ground would result in criminal charges.

So where do we draw the line? It's a perfectly valid discussion point when discussing these matters. If the AFL are serious about stamping out this violence in the game, they would completely overhaul the pathetic excuse of an MRO/MRP/Tribunal as it stands.

[McQueen 17,864]

11 minutes ago, pineapple dee said:

This is precisely the sort of white wash and snow job we'll get from the apologists for the next 54 hours. Let's see some serious consequence for an act we never want to see in AFL or any other level of footy ever again.

Of course Gaffs s wonderful person of great character but that's cold comfort to Andrew Bradshaw tonight.

I trust you can see a level of irony in what you’ve posted.

[4_Kent_Watts 856]

Nothing different as to what Bugg did last year. 5 week minimum.

[hardtack 10,400]

2 hours ago, DaisyDeeciple said:

it's dirty but i thought the same thing,.. But for real, very sorry for Brayshaw with the broken jaw, how do we think Gaff will go as a team mate of Angus? I'd be a little dark to say the least.

Didn’t Plugger Lockett poleaxe a Swans player with similar results the season before he moved to the Swans?  I’m pretty sure they kissed and made up during the preseason.

[Undeeterred 3,037]

Just now, hardtack said:

Didn’t Plugger Lockett poleaxe a Swans player with similar results the season before he moved to the Swans?  I’m pretty sure they kissed and made up during the preseason.

I'm pretty sure Peter Caven left the club so he didn't make up with anyone. I could be wrong

[Demonland 70,236]

2 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

Is it possible to block a post quoting a poster you have on ignore? Please, please, please....

Not possible unfortunately. All forum software that I have encountered has this issue.

[Ethan Tremblay 29,968]

4 minutes ago, 4_Kent_Watts said:

Nothing different as to what Bugg did last year. 5 week minimum.

Bugg got 6 weeks and Mills played the next week. Brayshaw has a fractured jaw and 4 teeth out of place. 

Edited August 5, 2018 by Ethan Tremblay

[SaberFang 7,151]

Just now, Ethan Tremblay said:

Bugg got 6 weeks and Milla played the next week. Brayshaw has a fractured jaw and 4 teeth out of place. 

Lyon said he probably won't play again this year, too.

[4_Kent_Watts 856]

2 minutes ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

Bugg got 6 weeks and Mills played the next week. Brayshaw has a fractured jaw and 4 teeth out of place. 

That's why I said 5 week minimum both acts were a disgrace

[dave 183]

6 weeks minimum, prob 8 considering Brayshaw is finished for year, won't play til 2nd or 3rd round next year. Forget about recruiting him, he won't leave Wet Toast now this has happened!

[Demonland 70,236]

55 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

^ Except that Bugg went for 6 weeks, picket

And the player he king hit played the next week.

[hardtack 10,400]

10 minutes ago, Undeeterred said:

I'm pretty sure Peter Caven left the club so he didn't make up with anyone. I could be wrong

From Peter Caven’s Wiki page...

“Caven was the victim of an infamous act of AFL thuggery when St Kilda's Tony Lockett struck him viciously in the face and broke his cheek-bone during a game in 1994. Lockett was handed a heavy suspension of eight weeks for the incident. In an absurd twist, Caven was forced to issue an apology to Lockett the following week after appearing on comedy television show Denton and, at the urging of host Andrew Denton, bashing an effigy of Lockett with a baseball bat. The following season, Caven and Lockett were team-mates at Sydney.”

[Skuit 9,939]

I'm expecting eight down to seven. So the hope is we knock off West Coast in the first week and they rebound to meet us in the GF. That's seven games - and so then Gaff can make his redemptive debut in the red and blue round 1.

[SaberFang 7,151]

A few comments from West Coast CEO Trevor Nisbett...

Quote

"Anyone who engaged in extreme violence should be deregistered. This is a dreadful incident for guys who just want to go and play and have some fun,” Mr Nisbett said.

“Guys don’t sign up for this and if you’re going to go outside the laws of the game, you should be punished with the maximum penalty."

Disclaimer: comments were made months ago, before the Gaff incident. Just always worth highlighting the blatant hypocrisy of some of these richer clubs.