3 minutes ago, mauriesy said:

Time to draw the discussion back from "Jack haters" vs "fanboys". It's leading nowhere.

It's leading somewhere. Just not a very healthy or productive place.

Agree, trusting the club to make the right decision about Watts, even if you don't like it, or love Jack, is better than the alternative of division, hate and anger. Otherwise we're back where we were a decade or two ago.

1 hour ago, jnrmac said:

Im not a Jack hater. I am on record as saying I hope he stays and performs. But its highly unlikely. He is a serial underperformer.

And good for you if you are a fan boy. I hope it gets you to sleep at night holding up Jack Watts poster with one hand.

 

Oohhhhh.....what are you alluding to, jnr???

1 minute ago, mauriesy said:

Agree, trusting the club to make the right decision about Watts, even if you don't like it, or love Jack, is better than the alternative of division, hate and anger. Otherwise we're back where we were a decade or two ago.

There's certainly none of that around

13 minutes ago, Goodvibes said:

OK, this has to stop Ron. You're offering nothing new to this thread. All you are now doing is running with an anonymous allegation with no proof from someone who is clearly aggrieved with the club because of their personal connection with Jack. And regular pot shots at those with an alternative view to you who have the audacity to support their club also doesn't paint you in a good light. All of my fears from a week ago are certainly being realized when a good poster like you starts to deliberately post divisive material. We get that it's an emotional game and you love Jack but his defence has stumbled into murky ground.

Right - as opposed to the JW haters?

Their eloquent prose about his misgivings have left me quite breathless

Without Jack, if you look at our best 22, there are very few players who don't consistently do the non-negotiable (tackling and ruthless competitiveness being the main ones).

Hogan and Oscar may be the only two who you would question 100% commitment to tackling, everyone else has competitiveness and tackling as number one priority.

Pretty clear what Goodwin wants.

Just now, jumbo returns said:

Right - as opposed to the JW haters?

Their eloquent prose about his misgivings have left me quite breathless

It's ugly on both sides Jumbo. Shame there has to be sides.

There is no right side in this, it is what it is.

You can't change this decision, you need to move on or sit in here and sook.There has been a lot of made up bs on this thread in defence of Jack and against Jack. I don't know the facts but I know a lot of the mud thrown on each side is rubbish.

The continued robust defence from the JW crew should mean from here on they shouldn't say a bad word about any other player on the list.

Why is JW more important then any other player on the list...? I'll give you a hint.. he isn't.

30 minutes ago, Goodvibes said:

OK, this has to stop Ron. You're offering nothing new to this thread. All you are now doing is running with an anonymous allegation with no proof from someone who is clearly aggrieved with the club because of their personal connection with Jack. And regular pot shots at those with an alternative view to you who have the audacity to support their club also doesn't paint you in a good light. All of my fears from a week ago are certainly being realized when a good poster like you starts to deliberately post divisive material. We get that it's an emotional game and you love Jack but his defence has stumbled into murky ground.

I'm not seeking to undermine the club, nor am I intending to be divisive.

But this trade, the genesis of it, and the likely terms of it, have never stacked up to me.

I like Jack Watts. I like this club a hell of a lot more.

In short, my loyalty is absolutely to the club. But I don't want to be bullshitted by it either.

It seems to me that the club has pivoted somewhat in its game style, its approach and its needs from its players, and that Watts is just not worth the dough we're paying him.

I just wish they'd stop dancing with (what appears to be) the truth. It erodes trust.

 

11 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

No that wasn’t a Rocket. He was still the number one boy. 

Now he is getting the rocket

now he knows he is out of luck. It’s either Hard Work or he walks away....

 

I agree wholeheartedly with the bold part.

Extract from Trade Radio: 

Andrew Watts is Jack's father.

Expanding on 'reprobate' he says:

Clearly his father is taking issue with the derogatory rumours spread about his son, largely based on comments from Goodwin, Jones, Mahoney. 

We may not like his father's commentary but no one is publicly standing up for Jack.  Even his kind hearted video to a fan was presented as having a cheap shot at mfc and nothing was further from the truth.

I really admire a father standing up for his much maligned son.    It isn't good for MFC when a father needs to do that.  It is exceptionally rare for a player's father to come out and defend them.  I would think for Jack's family to do that involves very unusual circumstances. 

I do not know who or what to believe anymore.  As each day passes more and more people are coming out and casting doubts on MFC's narrative on Jack's season. 

Posters may want to blindly tow the company line but I fear there will be some bad fallout from this.  Not so much Jack leaving but moreso the way it has been handled.

A very sad situation just became moreso.

 

Edited October 15, 20177 yr by Lucifer's Hero

Exactly.

 

The most interesting thing here @Lucifer's Hero is that the club (and I'm happy to be corrected here) has never said jack didn't train hard.

They simply said he didn't meet the standards set without specifying what the standards were.

It's Demonland, the individuals and the media who have run with the commentary on the issue. So called in the know posters running the agenda such as GNF.

 

You've talked about handing the trade poorly LH, but look at the Stinger saga, apart from upset supporters and a lot of speculation the JW trade is no where as near as bad as Stringer situation.

The continued debate on JW is fuelled by emotions and little to no facts.

 

Edited October 15, 20177 yr by Unleash Hell

6 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

I fear there will be some bad fallout from this.  Not so much Jack leaving but moreso the way it has been handled. 

It's been handled really poorly.

It's in the same boat as the stringer situation. The club has put out statements that diminish his value at the trade table. Our public position is he should look elsewhere. That is hard line and so they are going to throw him away for nothing. It's poor all round. 

1 hour ago, mauriesy said:

Time to draw the discussion back from "Jack haters" vs "fanboys". It's leading nowhere.

Agree. I have had no interest in this thread other than scanning for updates. To be honest i have been hoping that there will be an update saying something has drastically changed and he is going to say.

That's because i'm a huge Jack 'fanboy'. As i have said before he is in my top 10 favourite Melbourne players - and i have seen a lot of players in the more than 40 years i have passionately followed the club.

But the key word is fan. i'm not a coach or member of the FD. Obviously. No really i'm not. I'm allowed to be emotionally invested and think through that lens. The coach and the FD not so much (though as Roos said in that great interview on Deetales footy is an emotional game, much more so that business, and that is why some strange decisions are sometimes made)

To be honest i think it is pretty simple. Goody wants 22 warriors. And Jack isn't - and never will be - the warrior type. Now i might disagree with that be he is the coach and it is his call. Goody has made the call. And i very much doubt he has done so lightly. I support and respect his right to make that call. That said it is a big call and quite rightly he will be judged on it - and goody would expect nothing less. 

And i like the fact the club has allowed him to make that call. Many is a time that a head coach would have been over ruled at the demons - which is just one of the reason we have been so unsuccessful for so, so many years. this why PJ is quiet. He ha invested in the FD and like all good managers know you have to trust your key appointments. Micro management is an anathema to success. 

I will be totally gutted to see jack play at another club. The last time i felt this way was when Greg Wells left when i was about 11 years old. But like then i hope Wattsy gets all the success in the world. And as harsh as it sounds if we get the success we all crave the fanboys and haters will have consigned all of this palaver to the memory vault. 

Edited October 15, 20177 yr by binman

Apoligies if this has been posted before.

From mfc. 

Thank you for taking the time to contact the Melbourne Football Club.

 

 

We understand AFL is based on emotion and that's what makes our game great, however the role of football departments is to make decisions based on analytic thinking. We hope that our members can see any decision made are only trying to benefit the club and assist in reaching ultimate success.

 

This does not mean Jack is leaving the Club. He is a contracted player and if we believe that after looking at all the options, the best thing for the club and for Jack to remain at the footy club, then that will happen.

 

Over the last 4 years, our list management group and coaching staff, have had an excellent track record in their respective roles. We have built a young and talented playing group who are made of the right character and as they grow and develop, they will deliver sustained success for our Club.

 

The Club is bigger than any one individual and with that in mind, we are fully focused on making all decision in the best interests of the Club.

 

Please feel free to listen to the attached interview with our General Manager of Football Josh Mahoney, talking about Jack Watts.

 

http://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2017-10-04/melbourne-confirms-is-wants-lever

 

8 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

It's been handled really poorly.

Only if you listen to the echo chamber of the herald sun or D'Land...

 

Just now, Unleash Hell said:

The most interesting thing here @Lucifer's Hero is that the club (and I'm happy to be corrected here) has never said jack didn't train hard.

They simply said he didn't meet the standards set without specifying what the standards were.

It's Demonland, the individuals and the media who have run with the commentary on the issue. So called in the know posters running the agenda such as GNF.

 

You've talked about handing the trade poorly LH, but look at the Stinger saga, apart from upset supporters and a lot of speculation the JW trade is no where as near as bad as Stringer situation.

 

With respect UH there may be a bit of 'hair splitting' in the bits i've higlighted.  Goodwin talks about 9 years of being in rut.  Jones talks about his activities away from the club.  etc etc. 

I haven't posted on this thread for a while as it was going round in circles but I feel hearing from Jack's father and by implication his mother, has changed things a bit.

The Stringer situation looks worse because of the girlfriend's interview and WB botched the trade and didn't take pick 11.  But they had one shot (Beveridge's interview) and made a clean cut of Stringer.  For Jack its been like the 'death of a thousand cuts' from the various commentary since our last game.  So while the Stringer situation looks worse and it could be rated 9 out of 10 bad then mfc with Jack is about 7.5 out of 10 bad.  Still very bad in my book.

Just for comparison.  It is very well known that Kent is being heavily shopped around.  But the club has been very respectful to him and handled it quietly.  A far cry from what we are seeing with Jack. 

I fear this will not end well for anyone. 

I have no idea why the club chose its path.  But for mine it was not a good choice.

So they've rolled out the old man for a few comments now, have they? 

Of course he will stand up for his son.  So he should, and you wouldn't expect any less.

It still means we can put as much credence in his comments as any on here, which isn't much.

Just now, Lucifer's Hero said:

With respect UH there may be a bit of 'hair splitting' in the bits i've higlighted.  Goodwin talks about 9 years of being in rut.  Jones talks about his activities away from the club.  etc etc. 

I haven't posted on this thread for a while as it was going round in circles but I feel hearing from Jack's father and by implication his mother, has changed things a bit.

The Stringer situation looks worse because of the girlfriend's interview and WB botched the trade and didn't take pick 11.  But they had one shot (Beveridge's interview) and made a clean cut of Stringer.  For Jack its been like the 'death of a thousand cuts' from the various commentary since our last game.  So while the Stringer situation looks worse and it could be rated 9 out of 10 bad then mfc with Jack is about 7.5 out of 10 bad.  Still very bad in my book.

Just for comparison.  It is very well known that Kent is being heavily shopped around.  But the club has been very respectful to him and handled it quietly.  A far cry from what we are seeing with Jack. 

I fear this will not end well for anyone. 

I have no idea why the club chose its path.  But for mine it was not a good choice.

It changes nothing.  Of course he will stick up for his son if he is asked about, any father would. 

And this will end fine for the club.  Jack will be moved on, the sun will come up in the morning and the MFC will roll on.

Tru

2 minutes ago, binman said:

 And as harsh as it sounds if we get the success we all crave the fanboys and haters will have consigned all of this palaver to the memory vault. 

True. If a flag comes our way then watts lever and any other move will be vindicated. I just don't think that when this time of year is for improving your list that trading watts for a second round pick does that. When in today's age of footballer, sensitive and unhardened, that making the group uncomfortable and kicking out a much loved teammate in this  public way, does a whole lot for the comraderie of the rest of the group. I personally think they should all push hard and pull out all stops. We've had no success for 53 years. But this and the Viney co captain decision, sort of fly on the face of what Richmond have done and united as one.

man...this thread! its like ground hog day. 

I can see already what 2018 is gonna look like. Everytime we lose...the JW fans are going to chime in with the incompetence of this decision. "Shambolic incompetence ...the club has been set back 5 years"

Everytime we have a good win the opposite side is going to say the opposite

I hope the wounds heal fast here. I dont know whats the right move to be honest. Its my love for JW vs my respect for THIS football dept ( which is worthy of it)   Ive stated my confusion many times. I just hate seeing us all pitted against each other. 

Only some real success is ever going to sort this out. Heres hoping we get it. 

16 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Extract from Trade Radio: 

Andrew Watts is Jack's father.

Expanding on 'reprobate' he says:

Clearly his father is taking issue with the derogatory rumours spread about his son, largely based on comments from Goodwin, Jones, Mahoney. 

We may not like his father's commentary but no one is publicly standing up for Jack.  Even his kind hearted video to a fan was presented as having a cheap shot at mfc and nothing was further from the truth.

I really admire a father standing up for his much maligned son.    It isn't good for MFC when a father needs to do that.  It is exceptionally rare for a player's father to come out and defend them.  I would think for Jack's family to do that involves very unusual circumstances. 

I do not know who or what to believe anymore.  As each day passes more and more people are coming out and casting doubts on MFC's narrative on Jack's season. 

Posters may want to blindly tow the company line but I fear there will be some bad fallout from this.  Not so much Jack leaving but moreso the way it has been handled.

A very sad situation just became moreso.

 

It is very sad and Jack is a nice lad, no denying that. I do feel really sorry for him and we did let him down in his younger years. We don't know why all this is happening, or the motive from the club, I do agree it's been handled poorly, from Goodwin/Jones to Mahoney. Clearly the club has lost patience with him over whatever reason, all we see is his inconsistency so can only assume. Jones dug in and busted his gut when the cookies crumbled, Watts possibly hasn't. But it is sad to see his family hurt & that it is our club that has done this. My opinion on Jacks "effort" remains but I still feel for him. Bizarre set of circumstances that I hope we eventually find out what happened.

Over 5000 posts and some still can't get their head around why Jack Watts may be traded.  The only reason jack Watts is up for trade is he has some trade value and is expendable.  Make no mistake Jack made himself expendable by his out put in the last half of the year.

I like Jack Watts and would love to see him become the player he can be, the fact is that hasn't happened so far at his time at Melbourne or what we have seen is the best he will offer which will be a real shame.