Welcome to Demonland: Jake Lever

[AzzKikA 2,371]

My only issue with the deal is that there may be a bad taste in the mouth of current players not being paid as highly as they may deserve and feeling a little annoyed about that.

[SFebes 4,860]

5 minutes ago, AzzKikA said:

My only issue with the deal is that there may be a bad taste in the mouth of current players not being paid as highly as they may deserve and feeling a little annoyed about that.

Listen to Mahoneys interview from yesterday, the club has a system in place to ensure players are paid accordingly. I was also concerned, but not after hearing him speak about it.

[AzzKikA 2,371]

Just now, SFebey said:

Listen to Mahoneys interview from yesterday, the club has a system in place to ensure players are paid accordingly. I was also concerned, but not after hearing him speak about it.

Thats good to know, last thing we need is backstabbing inside the club.

[beelzebub 23,239]

12 hours ago, picket fence said:

We have been screwed yet again MASSIVE MASSIVE overs for a player who is "A  better mans Oscar Mac""!

Our negotiation and management skills are Abysmal!!

Should have played hardball !!No gonads!! MFC

 

it might be argued ( for no real outcome ) that possibly we blinked first and maybe a slightly better deal would result if say sorted monday or tuesday after the Crows could "sweat" it out over the weekend. But that's probably more fanciful dreaming than practical.

Lever  went at 14 in a fairly decent draft year. He's now had THREE years of development and conditioning . He landed an AA squad possie in only his third year and leads  ( or near to ) the comp in some very demanding and impressive  areas.

So in effect he's now a value added #14...ready to go ...( and more )  player who seems for all intents able to keep his feet , not just stay on the field 

It's very easy to talk up new acquisitions I grant you that.  What we are dealing with here is an absolute known.  There's no guessing. There's no real development required. And he's good to go  NOW. The various values ever applied to Picks are notoriously wanderous in nature. All picks come under the "What If" banner., all a bit Russian Roulette  only with more chambers full..i.e NO Guarantees about anything.

I'm not sure what playing hardball would have achieved if at the expense of playing  'clever' ball.  Often in the trade period we see deals unfold , or indeed FOLD because of time constraints. Irrespective of how long trade periods are  many will go down to the wire...and many opportunities present as things  become fragmented.

The one aspect of Josh that impresses me ( there might be some that don't ...but that's not for here )  is his teams ability to conjure. If  i would suggest to anyone anything about trade is judge it best at the end.

I think we've paid just about market for Jake in terms of ability, availability  and expedience of business.

[jnrmac 19,927]

14 hours ago, waynewussell said:

Goodwin critics are premature...

But there's a nasal spray for that apparently......

[DaveyDee 421]

19 hours ago, Fifty-5 said:

Yes agreed I said Lever would cost more than the 2100 points you predicted and I was wrong - I owe Dland a donation - that's why it's a good deal.

Perhaps you'll also agree that your assertion that we are "up to our eyeballs" in the Stringer trade is also incorrect?

Cheers. The Stringer trade is very important to us - now you can read into that what you want. 

[beelzebub 23,239]

14 hours ago, waynewussell said:

Goodwin critics are premature...

Anyone can be critiqued at any time. How much weight you or anyone wished to apply to it is another thing.

Everyone gets evaluated.

I hope Simon holds up the Cup one day. In reality though  I just want SOMEONE to hold up that bloody cup. My little jury of one is out currently. 

When do you think a good time might be to appraise ?  ( for me it's continuous )

[old55 22,943]

1 minute ago, DaveyDee said:

Cheers. The Stringer trade is very important to us - now you can read into that what you want. 

Don't back pedal now.  You've consistently maintained that we should be and are in the market for trading Stringer in to MFC.

[DaveyDee 421]

1 minute ago, Fifty-5 said:

Don't back pedal now.  You've consistently maintained that we should be and are in the market for trading Stringer in to MFC.

Not sure I went that far - I've always wished the boy well, refused to listen to the internet rumours just like Essendon & Geelong have, thought it was going to be very difficult to land him. However, we are up to our eye balls in this trade because its very important to us. 

[old55 22,943]

2 minutes ago, DaveyDee said:

Not sure I went that far - I've always wished the boy well, refused to listen to the internet rumours just like Essendon & Geelong have, thought it was going to be very difficult to land him. However, we are up to our eye balls in this trade because its very important to us. 

[Demons1858 1,725]

3 hours ago, Fifty-5 said:

You fail to understand a fundamental FA fact in your spurious argument about 4 years vs Macca's very reasonable "10 year player" observation.  You're the one who looks silly.

Thanks for your input fifty. Still doesn't change the fact we have him contracted for 4 yrs on not 10. We expect he will play 10 for someone likely to be us but no certainty. Also doesn't change the fact we paid overs but not by as much as some are suggesting.

The best player in the comp came cheaper then Lever

The Cats have given up young midfielder Dean Gore as well as picks No.9 and No.28 to snare the superstar midfielder.

The Cats gain Dangerfield and Adelaide's third-round draft pick, currently No.50.

Gore was recently delisted by the way and was really just the 'steak knives'

Edited October 13, 2017 by Demons1858

[Its Time for Another 4,088]

For those worried about us losing out on youth by trading out the two years of first rounders. Have a look at this demographic breakdown of the list. We don't need to worry about getting youth into the list. 22 players, half the list is 23 or under. 6 20 or under. 

Melbourne players who are 20 years and under:

Oliver, Weideman, McKenna, King, Johnstone, Filipovic

23-21years :

Viney, Petracca, Hogan,  Hunt, Brayshaw, Salem, Harmes, McDonald, Stretch, ANB, JKH, Kent, Hannan, Wagner, Joel Smith and now Lever.

24 years: Tyson Frost Bugg are 24. 

[old55 22,943]

1 hour ago, Demons1858 said:

Thanks for your input fifty. Still doesn't change the fact we have him contracted for 4 yrs on not 10. We expect he will play 10 for someone likely to be us but no certainty. Also doesn't change the fact we paid overs but not by as much as some are suggesting.

The best player in the comp came cheaper then Lever

The Cats have given up young midfielder Dean Gore as well as picks No.9 and No.28 to snare the superstar midfielder.

The Cats gain Dangerfield and Adelaide's third-round draft pick, currently No.50.

Gore was recently delisted by the way and was really just the 'steak knives'

For someone so keen on the facts you are very loose with them.  You'll find that the trade for Dangerfield represented more draft points than the trade for Lever.

[Demons1858 1,725]

Just now, Fifty-5 said:

For someone so keen on the facts you are very loose with them.  You'll find that the trade for Dangerfield represented more draft points than the trade for Lever.

Can you have an independent opinion without making references to some sort modeled points system which is a guide at best.

Points don't consider whether the players is out of contract. Points don't take into consideration that Lever was prepared to go to the draft and put a price on his head. They don't consider their current marketing value. They don't consider their proven (not potential) leadership etc etc.

At best, we should be paying a fair bit below what the best player in the comp is worth and it shouldn't be so line ball. Tom Mitchell was a 1st rounder for Christ sake

[old55 22,943]

35 minutes ago, Demons1858 said:

Can you have an independent opinion without making references to some sort modeled points system which is a guide at best.

Points don't consider whether the players is out of contract. Points don't take into consideration that Lever was prepared to go to the draft and put a price on his head. They don't consider their current marketing value. They don't consider their proven (not potential) leadership etc etc.

At best, we should be paying a fair bit below what the best player in the comp is worth and it shouldn't be so line ball. Tom Mitchell was a 1st rounder for Christ sake

So I should just take your word for it?  Someone loose with the facts?

[Dr. Gonzo 23,874]

48 minutes ago, It's Time said:

For those worried about us losing out on youth by trading out the two years of first rounders. Have a look at this demographic breakdown of the list. We don't need to worry about getting youth into the list. 22 players, half the list is 23 or under. 6 20 or under. 

Melbourne players who are 20 years and under:

Oliver, Weideman, McKenna, King, Johnstone, Filipovic

23-21years :

Viney, Petracca, Hogan,  Hunt, Brayshaw, Salem, Harmes, McDonald, Stretch, ANB, JKH, Kent, Hannan, Wagner, Joel Smith and now Lever.

24 years: Tyson Frost Bugg are 24. 

I'm not "worried" per se - however it is the under 20 bracket which could present an issue down the track. Oliver is the only surefire one to be there in 2 years let alone 7 or 8.

[Red and Bluebeard 2,080]

4 hours ago, beelzebub said:

Anyone can be critiqued at any time. How much weight you or anyone wished to apply to it is another thing.

Everyone gets evaluated.

I hope Simon holds up the Cup one day. In reality though  I just want SOMEONE to hold up that bloody cup. My little jury of one is out currently. 

When do you think a good time might be to appraise ?  ( for me it's continuous )

Someone in red and blue of course ...  ?

[Its Time for Another 4,088]

26 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I'm not "worried" per se - however it is the under 20 bracket which could present an issue down the track. Oliver is the only surefire one to be there in 2 years let alone 7 or 8.

Fair point. But we have plenty of time to start bringing in younger players in a few years time.

 

[layzie 33,260]

Calculated risk. Hope he stays injury free and helps lead our backline for years to come! 

Welcome Jake!

[TGR 1,367]

Adelaide were going to take what they could get.

Which club was going to offer anywhere near what we did?

 

Like going to an Auction, and bidding 200K above reserve with your first bid

[whatwhat say what 22,302]

Rationalize it as 7 first round picks over 7 years and you might feel better (2012-18)

Lever is a jet; can’t wsit to see him run out for us in round 1

[Bay Riffin 1,454]

2 hours ago, It's Time said:

For those worried about us losing out on youth by trading out the two years of first rounders. Have a look at this demographic breakdown of the list. We don't need to worry about getting youth into the list. 22 players, half the list is 23 or under. 6 20 or under. 

Melbourne players who are 20 years and under:

Oliver, Weideman, McKenna, King, Johnstone, Filipovic

23-21years :

Viney, Petracca, Hogan,  Hunt, Brayshaw, Salem, Harmes, McDonald, Stretch, ANB, JKH, Kent, Hannan, Wagner, Joel Smith and now Lever.

24 years: Tyson Frost Bugg are 24. 

not to mention Lever is young as well.

[Grimes Times 1,278]

43 minutes ago, DemonAndrew said:

Rationalize it as 7 first round picks over 7 years and you might feel better (2012-18)

Lever is a jet; can’t wsit to see him run out for us in round 1

Correct.

We have hit the first round hard over the last 4 years. 

An A grade defender wants to come to us and some are arguing the fact that we may have paid a little over. just get the the deal done.

2012 - Hogan, Viney*

2013 - Salem, Tyson*

2014 Trac, Brayshaw, Lever*

2015 - Oliver, Weed

Thats 9 first round draft picks into the club from the last 4 drafts. Not using one in this year or next draft isn't going to make a huge difference with what we have done and planned for the last 3-4 years.

 

[Axis of Bob 11,285]

4 hours ago, Demons1858 said:

The best player in the comp came cheaper then Lever

The Cats have given up young midfielder Dean Gore as well as picks No.9 and No.28 to snare the superstar midfielder.

The Cats gain Dangerfield and Adelaide's third-round draft pick, currently No.50.

Gore was recently delisted by the way and was really just the 'steak knives'

Dangerfield was also a free agent. Geelong could have got him for nothing, but instead paid more than we did for Lever.

[Its Time for Another 4,088]

1 hour ago, Bay Riffin said:

not to mention Lever is young as well.

He's in there as one of the U23's. He's barely out of draft age.