Training - Wednesday 11 January, 2017

[Dr. Gonzo 24,305]

4 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

Hogan spent at least 25 minutes practicing his goalkicking from every angle and distance, so he is earnest in improving

Same technique or a distinct lack of skipping?

[hardtack 10,627]

39 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

No, I just had a small SLR camera.

Ok...nice shots regardless.

[Whispering_Jack 30,674]

Thanks all for your reports and the pictures.

I can't begin to imagine how many more pages this thread would have covered had it been an "open" session.

In fact, I was shocked to discover that  there were no security people around this morning confiscating pens, iPhones and cameras in order to preserve the secrecy involved in closed sessions.

Something must be done about this!!!

[monoccular 17,575]

10 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

2+hours craft session

Joel Smith learning bodywork against Maxy and Pencil   fun to watch

Hogan 25 minutes goalkicking practice

Maynard doing stoppage work, bullock

Nev putting Clarry on his arse, not impressed

Watts and Harmes trying to outdo each other on the marking drill with the bag

Watching Macca and Jeff Garlett practicing goal sneak skills

 

6 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

Hogan spent at least 25 minutes practicing his goalkicking from every angle and distance, so he is earnest in improving

Thanks to all for their reports

Any comments on Jesse's run up?  Stttiilllll the sttttutttter?

[hardtack 10,627]

25 minutes ago, monoccular said:

 

Thanks to all for their reports

Any comments on Jesse's run up?  Stttiilllll the sttttutttter?

No pronounced stutter that I noticed.  

[ManDee 7,222]

Is there some plan to pick on Oliver? It seems the players are always into him.

[Lucifers Hero 40,364]

7 minutes ago, ManDee said:

Is there some plan to pick on Oliver? It seems the players are always into him.

As it is the team's senior leaders who are into him: Gawn, Jones and Lewis I would say 'yes'! 

Letting him know what they expect and what to expect if he doesn't follow the rules.  A good lesson to learn and learn it early.  

Its these little things that show how far our leadership team has come.  A far cry from the days when players didn't feel like training so cancelled it (related in Jim Styne's book). 

[Thrice 216]

22 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

As it is the team's senior leaders who are into him: Gawn, Jones and Lewis I would say 'yes'! 

Letting him know what they expect and what to expect if he doesn't follow the rules.  A good lesson to learn and learn it early.  

Its these little things that show how far our leadership team has come.  A far cry from the days when players didn't feel like training so cancelled it (related in Jim Styne's book). 

I have been wondering whether this was part of the 'punishment' for his DD episode during the off-season: it seems a coordinated approach. @Satyriconhome or others - is this something you could try to suss out?

[Copuchas 763]

I was somewhat surprised to see this: http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-01-11/key-position-demons-tom-mcdonald-and-cam-pedersen-shoulder-the-burden as I understood the concept behind a closed session was that the media and "spies" from other clubs weren't welcome.   Does it just apply to non-AFL media or is there a waiver if you write a positive article? !

Edited January 11, 2017 by Copuchas
content edit / typo

[old55 23,705]

14 hours ago, Clint Bizkit said:

As mentioned earlier in this thread (and you can see in my photos above), Petracca spent a lot of time on his goal kicking and quite simply when he shanked his kicks it was all because of the ball drop.

It's not easy to perfect and is why kicking off a tee in rugby league and rugby is so much easier, but it is the key to good kicking.

I'm interested to hear analysis of Nathan Jones' action in pic #23 in your set?  Particularly in comparison to Watts and Hogan.

 

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,909]

7 minutes ago, Thrice said:

I have been wondering whether this was part of the 'punishment' for his DD episode during the off-season: it seems a coordinated approach. @Satyriconhome or others - is this something you could try to suss out?

I assume DD episode means "drink driving" episode. Did we ever get definitive confirmation whether he was driving at above 0.05% or whether it was above 0.00% (the limit for probationary licensees which he would be given his age)? While I accept that whatever it was he had breached the law, in my mind driving above 0.05% for a probationary licence holder is a more significant event than if he was, say, driving at 0.01%. 

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Just now, Fifty-5 said:

I'm interested to hear analysis of Nathan Jones' action in pic #23 in your set?  Particularly in comparison to Watts and Hogan.

 

He leans back more than Watts does, but he still manages to guide the ball to his foot as you can see above which is why he tends to be a good kick.

It's not easy to do, most people (AFL players included) tend to drop the ball rather than place the ball on their foot.

We all love Hogan, but his technique is flawed. It doesn't mean he is necessarily a bad kick, it just means there is a greater probability that the ball will come askew when he drops it because he isn't able to guide the ball down to his foot as well. I was watching Petracca work on this very thing yesterday, he was actively trying to guide the ball to his foot better.

[Satyriconhome 10,879]

40 minutes ago, Thrice said:

I have been wondering whether this was part of the 'punishment' for his DD episode during the off-season: it seems a coordinated approach. @Satyriconhome or others - is this something you could try to suss out?

I don't think the Clarry situation is a punishment, he is an aggressive bugger, just think he takes on the wrong people at training

Yesterday he gave Nev a shove as he was matched up on him, Nev then strong armed him in the drill and Clarry ended up on the deck

Similar to the Vince situation the other week, he also tried to rough up Jonesy a few weeks back, wrong

The only exception is Clarry and Gawn, that's on any time they get near each other in drills

Clarry keeps coming back for more which is great to watch

[Satyriconhome 10,879]

Wednesdays are craft day, and it was obviously decided,  probably by Hogan himself,  that the  area he needs work on is goal kicking, so he spent a good part of the session doing work on it.

Watched him have at least 10 shots at goal, until I got bored with it, run up is smoother, hop skip and jump is still there, missed 2 whilst I was watching

 

[Moonshadow 17,677]

56 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

I'm interested to hear analysis of Nathan Jones' action in pic #23 in your set?  Particularly in comparison to Watts and Hogan.

 

Is that a set shot or a kick on the run? In which case they are quite different actions

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

5 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Is that a set shot or a kick on the run? In which case they are quite different actions

Set shot from memory.

[old55 23,705]

1 hour ago, Clint Bizkit said:

He leans back more than Watts does, but he still manages to guide the ball to his foot as you can see above which is why he tends to be a good kick.

It's not easy to do, most people (AFL players included) tend to drop the ball rather than place the ball on their foot.

We all love Hogan, but his technique is flawed. It doesn't mean he is necessarily a bad kick, it just means there is a greater probability that the ball will come askew when he drops it because he isn't able to guide the ball down to his foot as well. I was watching Petracca work on this very thing yesterday, he was actively trying to guide the ball to his foot better.

Cheers, I agree that Hogan has flawed technique and FWIW I don't rate Jones' kicking although he has improved.

Jones' right arm is also bent, like Hogan's whereas Watts' is straight but it does look like Jones lets go of the ball later than Hogan - so guides it more as you say (I changed my comments here after further analysis)

In relation to Dee Spencer's analysis of the ball in relation to the plant foot.  Jones' ball drop is not ahead of his plant foot either (like Hogan, unlike Watts) and he is leaning back even more than Hogan.

The other noticeable difference to me is the angle of the ball.  Both Watts and Hogan have the top of the ball ahead of the bottom but Jones has the reverse.

Very interesting stuff!

Edited January 11, 2017 by Fifty-5

[daisycutter 29,743]

Just now, Fifty-5 said:

Cheers, I agree that Hogan has flawed technique and FWIW I don't rate Jones' kicking although he has improved.

Jones' right arm is also bent (Watts' is straight) and this shot is earlier in the sequence than the Hogan shot above.  It's possible that Jones' hand will end up in a similar position to Hogan's at that point in the process.

In relation to Dee Spencer's analysis of the ball in relation to the plant foot.  Jones' ball drop is not ahead of his plat foot either and he is leaning back even more than Hogan.

The other noticeable difference to me is the angle of the ball.  Both Watts and Hogan have the top of the ball ahead of the bottom but Jones has the reverse.

Very interesting stuff!

in fairness, while the comments are all good analysis, we shouldn't judge too much just from one photo each

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

4 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Cheers, I agree that Hogan has flawed technique and FWIW I don't rate Jones' kicking although he has improved.

Jones' right arm is also bent (Watts' is straight) and this shot is earlier in the sequence than the Hogan shot above.  It's possible that Jones' hand will end up in a similar position to Hogan's at that point in the process.

In relation to Dee Spencer's analysis of the ball in relation to the plant foot.  Jones' ball drop is not ahead of his plat foot either and he is leaning back even more than Hogan.

The other noticeable difference to me is the angle of the ball.  Both Watts and Hogan have the top of the ball ahead of the bottom but Jones has the reverse.

Very interesting stuff!

It is interesting, I remember seeing Scully getting some sort of kicking analysis while he was still at Melbourne (it didn't seem to help) and it surpises me that there isn't more work done with this like golfers get with their swings.

My theory is that kicking actions are developed at a very young age, therefore by the time a player is at AFL level it is almost too late to change (aside from a tweak here or there).

[old55 23,705]

1 minute ago, daisycutter said:

in fairness, while the comments are all good analysis, we shouldn't judge too much just from one photo each

That's what I initially thought about the Watts v Hogan comparison but I think people have raised a lot of good points.

[ManDee 7,222]

35 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

I don't think the Clarry situation is a punishment, he is an aggressive bugger, just think he takes on the wrong people at training

Yesterday he gave Nev a shove as he was matched up on him, Nev then strong armed him in the drill and Clarry ended up on the deck

Similar to the Vince situation the other week, he also tried to rough up Jonesy a few weeks back, wrong

The only exception is Clarry and Gawn, that's on any time they get near each other in drills

Clarry keeps coming back for more which is great to watch

Whether it is a punishment, attitude adjustment tool or young bulls fighting, I like it providing no one gets hurt. Oliver has a huge upside and a tough, take no prisoners attitude will be beneficial in our run to our next flag. 

[ArtificialWisdom 4,045]

6 minutes ago, ManDee said:

Whether it is a punishment, attitude adjustment tool or young bulls fighting, I like it providing no one gets hurt. Oliver has a huge upside and a tough, take no prisoners attitude will be beneficial in our run to our next flag. 

Oliver is a clearance midfielder, there's every chance he will start getting alot of attention around the contest to get him off balance to minimise his influence particurly late in games when he is tired. This could just be as simple training him to deal with it. 

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

11 minutes ago, ArtificialWisdom said:

Oliver is a clearance midfielder, there's every chance he will start getting alot of attention around the contest to get him off balance to minimise his influence particurly late in games when he is tired. This could just be as simple training him to deal with it. 

I agree with this.

In fact, I think it is a sign that they rate him so highly.

[Vogon Poetry 2,095]

1 hour ago, Fifty-5 said:

Very interesting stuff!

I'd like you to get a similar photo of Spencer and see what people think.  Criticised for his kicking there is nobody in the AFL that has a ball drop closer to his foot.  He's a very reliable kick now IMO, contrary to popular opinion.

[pineapple dee 2,892]

1 hour ago, ArtificialWisdom said:

Oliver is a clearance midfielder, there's every chance he will start getting alot of attention around the contest to get him off balance to minimise his influence particurly late in games when he is tired. This could just be as simple training him to deal with it. 

I remember the Hawthorn game and I recall Oliver lining up on Breust in the centre at the start of the last quarter. I thought to myself, well how's this going to go? Soon after the bounce, Breust was on his knees and nowhere and Clarry had dished out the ball to a team mate in space. This is the precise thing we can expect Oliver to do an awful lot this year. The thicker the traffic, the better he likes it. Oliver will have a massive year this year! ( and I shook his hand in the supermarket ) The previous AFL player whose hand I shook was Buddy Franklin, and he's turned out OK.