I have never bounced between threads on DL so often as I have in the last 7 days...

The thought of having a midfield that possibly consists of 

• Jones
• Viney
• Tyson
• Lewis
• Rockliff

With the below rotating through

• Vince
• Oliver
• Petracca
• Brayshaw

Gives me goosebumps!!!

If this scenario eventuates I will be a happy man... and I am sure I will not be alone in this feeling of joy

And of course adding Fyfe next year as well 

1 minute ago, ProDee said:

1 year and 9 months.

Ok 9 months

Anyway, Lewis is a much better player than Jones in terms of match-winning capabilities, game-breaking style and many many other areas (including Lewis' immeasurable nasty side and leadership qualities) That's not to say that Jones isn't a good footballer or a decent leader - of course he is.  It's just that Lewis is better. 

We've overpaid in the past and that influences the thinking here ... this time around, we'd be getting a bargain if we got Lewis for pick 48.  And we won't be getting ripped off if we have to part with a 2nd rounder.  Or a late 2nd round pick.

It wouldn't surprise me if it ends up as a pick in the mid to late 30's.

17 minutes ago, Macca said:

Oh come on LH, you can't start using pick 48 in that sense.  Pick 48 is not good compensation for a gun footballer with 3 elite years left.  It just isn't.  If you don't value him that highly then that largely explains our point of difference.

If we do get him for pick 48 great ... I'm just not sure its a 'fait accompli.'  If the deal falls through we'll be hearing the spin. 

The comparison is 8 months. 

By the way, some of the reports are that we've offered Lewis a 3 year deal on good coin without any conditions.  My reading of that is that the club may feel we'll get more than 3 years out of him. 

You want quality, you have to pay for it.

macca, you have to balance that against the fact that hawthorn are only offering a year by year contract and at a below market value. so the reality is that hawthorn don't value him that highly based on what sort of contract they offer. can't have your cake and eat it

Just now, daisycutter said:

macca, you have to balance that against the fact that hawthorn are only offering a year by year contract and at a below market value. so the reality is that hawthorn don't value him that highly based on what sort of contract they offer. can't have your cake and eat it

But that thinking can and might change ...

I don't ever believe anything is ever locked-in with trades until it is actually locked in.  Faced with the prospect of losing Lewis for a negligible pick, they could easily up the ante and offer him a more palatable deal.

Technically, he is their property and they've had the whole weekend to possibly talk him around (if they want to talk him around)  There's probably a lot that we don't know about dc.

What we're 'hearing' sounds terrific for us but a lot of it might be hearsay. 

Hawk fans on BF have Frost in the deal.  I could see that with Hibberd coming in and J.Smith improving fast.

5 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Hawk fans on BF have Frost in the deal.  I could see that with Hibberd coming in and J.Smith improving fast.

frost and hibberd are very different types of backs... Me thinks BF is dreaming

9 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Hawk fans on BF have Frost in the deal.  I could see that with Hibberd coming in and J.Smith improving fast.

Neither of those 2 are key position though, Smith is still an unknown, doubt very much we trade Frost after targeting and giving up pick 23 for him. Other than the Mac boys we have no young KPDs.

Edited October 16, 20168 yr by TheoX

Joel Smith could be a star and may well take the Frost role.  He's as fast with an incredible leap.  A tad shorter, but he plays tall.

I can see Smith being a staple in defence next year if he has a big summer.

Edited October 16, 20168 yr by ProDee

I'd be keeping Frost. His standing height is about the only thing about to prevent the Danhier's, Lynch's, Wright's and Moore's of the world. I don't think we will, but I'd be disappointed if we traded Frost.

Joel Smith is a Howe type, in fact he's exactly the same height. He's not a key position defender. Replacing Frost with Smith leaves us with 1 defender (TMac) who can handle the larger forwards. Not a great move.

 

 

I don't care if first pick is in the 80's. We have good talent coming through - Oliver, Brayshaw, Petracca, Salem, Hunt, Hogan, Weed, and more. Lewis, Rockliff and Hibberd would be massive for us. Then we take a couple kids late in the draft around 80. VFL kid, preferrably a mid from Dogs.

12 minutes ago, ThreeOneSix said:

I don't care if first pick is in the 80's. We have good talent coming through - Oliver, Brayshaw, Petracca, Salem, Hunt, Hogan, Weed, and more. Lewis, Rockliff and Hibberd would be massive for us. Then we take a couple kids late in the draft around 80. VFL kid, preferrably a mid from Dogs.

I completely agree, I do not think we need any participation in this years draft. We are stacked with young players (bloody good ones too), so there is no need to worry about the future in 10 years, instead to get these deals done and stack up our team for the next 3-5. That's how we can win a premiership

Hawks supporters on BF are the biggest flogs imaginable. They all know everything and believe all Hawks players are better than any player at another club.

1 hour ago, KrazyJay said:

I have never bounced between threads on DL so often as I have in the last 7 days...

The thought of having a midfield that possibly consists of 

• Jones
• Viney
• Tyson
• Lewis
• Rockliff

With the below rotating through

• Vince
• Oliver
• Petracca
• Brayshaw

Gives me goosebumps!!!

If this scenario eventuates I will be a happy man... and I am sure I will not be alone in this feeling of joy

A potential big benefit of this is midfielders such as Tyson, Brayshaw, Vanders will now being going up against opposition rotating midfielders rather than their best. While Petrecca, Harmes, ANB learn the craft with smaller stints against opposition 3rd rotations.  Of course this also free's up players like Vince, Salem, Hunt and even Kent to play more outside.

Oliver is an exception as I believe he's the type of player whose development is best suited to being thrust straight into the heart of the action, still having Lewis, Jones, Viney and Rockliff around him is only going increase his effectiveness ..

Note: at a starting bounce you only have 3 midfielders at Gawn's feet; while around the ground you may increase this by a couple - the rest are still around the contest but there is a limit to how many are actually the ruckman's target (before it gets to congested to take a clean possession).  A very good position to be in when one of Jones, Viney, Lewis and Rockliff starts outside the ruck contest.

 

 

31 minutes ago, Clintosaurus said:

Hawks supporters on BF are the biggest flogs imaginable. They all know everything and believe all Hawks players are better than any player at another club.

In their defense they have won three of the last four flags 

 

2 hours ago, Demons11 said:

If I hear 1 more person say that pick 48 is overs for Lewis I'll throw up. 

The bloke is a star.  VC of the best team for the last 10 years, BOG in the first final this year before playing injured in the 2nd final. Runner up in the b&f for a team that finished 3rd on the ladder.  

48 is a steal!!!!!

Correct.  If he isn't worth 48 or higher I don't want him.

I think he's worth pick 48, just not sure we need to use it. Do a deal with Lewis to join us after next season if the Hawks want to play hard ball.

2 hours ago, Emerald said:

You left out Lewis winning another couple of premierships while playing for Melbourne.

I'll go one further- Lewis goes on to become a 7 time premiership player.....

What Lewis is worth and what he's traded for may be two separate things.

12 minutes ago, Vogon Poetry said:

Correct.  If he isn't worth 48 or higher I don't want him.

On form alone he's absolutely worth higher, but i'd still be surprised if we had to pay any more than our third round pick for him, the Hawks are professional enough to know there has to be some value there for us, and it's clearly the right move for Lewis.

So where does he actually fit into the 22?

Take the team below for argument's sake:

B: Frost  O Mac  Jetta
HB: Hibberd  TMac  Hunt 
C: Salem  Jones  Stretch
HF: Petracca  Hogan  Watts
F: Garlett  Pedo/Weed  Kent
R: Gawn  Tyson  Viney
I: Oliver  Brayshaw  Vince  Melksham

Who goes out? Melksham's name sticks out but he's just been brought in, and it isn't to play at Casey. The rest are either mainstays or young players for whom games at senior level is now very important.

I'm in favour of getting him on the cheap as we lack leadership and experience but I'm interested in logistics of where he slots in with his attributes. Granted there will always be injuries but we had a decent injury run with our midfielders last season.

8 minutes ago, P-man said:

So where does he actually fit into the 22?

Take the team below for argument's sake:

B: Frost  O Mac  Jetta
HB: Hibberd  TMac  Hunt 
C: Salem  Jones  Stretch
HF: Petracca  Hogan  Watts
F: Garlett  Pedo/Weed  Kent
R: Gawn  Tyson  Viney
I: Oliver  Brayshaw  Vince  Melksham

Who goes out? Melksham's name sticks out but he's just been brought in, and it isn't to play at Casey. The rest are either mainstays or young players for whom games at senior level is now very important.

I'm in favour of getting him on the cheap as we lack leadership and experience but I'm interested in logistics of where he slots in with his attributes. Granted there will always be injuries but we had a decent injury run with our midfielders last season.

I wouldn't like him to replace any of the above but it would be an absolutely miracle if we didn't have an injury or two at the end of the preseason! I couldn't think of better insurance than Lewis and/or  Rockcliff  going into 2017.

Edited October 16, 20168 yr by CBDees

19 minutes ago, P-man said:

So where does he actually fit into the 22?

Take the team below for argument's sake:

B: Frost  O Mac  Jetta
HB: Hibberd  TMac  Hunt 
C: Salem  Jones  Stretch
HF: Petracca  Hogan  Watts
F: Garlett  Pedo/Weed  Kent
R: Gawn  Tyson  Viney
I: Oliver  Brayshaw  Vince  Melksham

Who goes out? Melksham's name sticks out but he's just been brought in, and it isn't to play at Casey. The rest are either mainstays or young players for whom games at senior level is now very important.

I'm in favour of getting him on the cheap as we lack leadership and experience but I'm interested in logistics of where he slots in with his attributes. Granted there will always be injuries but we had a decent injury run with our midfielders last season.

for me, Frost goes out, Salem or Stretch go to half back and Lewis plays on the Wing

i know our backline looks a bit short with just the two but given we play a zone we're seeing our defenders sacrifice height in order to be aggressive anyway.

10 minutes ago, P-man said:

So where does he actually fit into the 22?

Take the team below for argument's sake:

B: Frost  O Mac  Jetta
HB: Hibberd  TMac  Hunt 
C: Salem  Jones  Stretch
HF: Petracca  Hogan  Watts
F: Garlett  Pedo/Weed  Kent
R: Gawn  Tyson  Viney
I: Oliver  Brayshaw  Vince  Melksham

Who goes out? Melksham's name sticks out but he's just been brought in, and it isn't to play at Casey. The rest are either mainstays or young players for whom games at senior level is now very important.

I'm in favour of getting him on the cheap as we lack leadership and experience but I'm interested in logistics of where he slots in with his attributes. Granted there will always be injuries but we had a decent injury run with our midfielders last season.

I'd have the same best 22. So to fit Lewis in I'd have the following options:

1. Injuries - they always happen
2. Melksham out, with Vince, Brayshaw and Garlett also possibilities depending on form
3. Go small down back with Hibberd as the 3rd tall. Hunt, Jetta, Melksham, Vince all strong overhead and can half contests against taller opponents/come third man up
4. Use the small forward line with Watts rucking, Petracca, Brayshaw and even Lewis can all play as marking forward targets

I know he doesn't have the pace but I'd be trying to use Lewis like the Hawks use Burgoyne as a utility. Even if he doesn't star I think if we keep the established guys in position and float Lewis around we'll get better value from him that plugging him in the midfield.