hmm it is a very interesting point. Because Jeremy Howe has played exactly the same hand.

As a member i get angry, But if i was a Sponsor i would question what is the point if the players in the senior side are in 2nd gear

We have seen it 3 times in the last few years

F$&@ing stinks.

It's [censored], but we're hopefully nearing the end of apathetic senior/junior players. One of the reasons I want Garland to be moved on too.

Will id rather see chip win a flag than a certain gws player. At least chip hung around for more than 2 seasons.

I wouldn't at least TS if he wins a flag deserves it , chip took the easiest option then comes out with the Bali remark I have full confidence in Roos to weed these non winners out Howe and garland are the last two

I wouldn't at least TS if he wins a flag deserves it , chip took the easiest option then comes out with the Bali remark I have full confidence in Roos to weed these non winners out Howe and garland are the last two

Not sure about that. I'd argue Watts can fall into this too.

It's [censored], but we're hopefully nearing the end of apathetic senior/junior players. One of the reasons I want Garland to be moved on too.

You and I are On the same page mate sooner the better

Not sure about that. I'd argue Watts can fall into this too.

Maybe mate JW loyalty can't be questioned but his commitment is another matter

It's [censored], but we're hopefully nearing the end of apathetic senior/junior players. One of the reasons I want Garland to be moved on too.

yep. We just cannot hang on to battlers anymore. 3 years should be long enough in this modern era to know if a player has got what it takes.

Frawley should just be enjoying the moment .

Taking a cheap shot at Melbourne just shows a complete lack of class by the guy.

Frawley played really well last night. I didn't like his comments afterwards though, it shown a real lack of class for mine.

Maybe mate JW loyalty can't be questioned but his commitment is another matter

I think Jack is in a similar category to Nathan Jones. They were both around during ordinary times. I think they both get passes though, because they bring something really valuable that offsets their weaknesses. That said, Jones should and will play out his days at Melbourne. If we could find a suitable trade for Jack (ie bringing in an A grade talent), I think we should pull the trigger.

yep. We just cannot hang on to battlers anymore. 3 years should be long enough in this modern era to know if a player has got what it takes.

The problem is you can't shed all the battlers at once, because it means you have to replace them all.

Next year will be a big year for JKH, Newton (if they keep him), Michie (if they keep him), Grimes (if they keep him), Trengove and Toumpas (if they keep him). Pressure for spots will start to heat up and expectations internally will rise, amongst both the playing group and the coaches. This will be the formation of a winning culture. I'm excited by this.

Next year we can expect more wins, less inconsistently (although there will still be some) and less gaping holes in our list and 22. We really must address the lack of speed on our list and quality ball users - I'm sure these are top of our priority list in the off season. I'm sure certain players won't come on and they'll then be under the microscope, but I'm buoyant about our future. I hope the rest of you are too. Signed, Paul Roos.

Frawley should just be enjoying the moment .

Taking a cheap shot at Melbourne just shows a complete lack of class by the guy.

Never seemed like a particularly shape bloke though.

Deep down he'd know he hasn't really assisted with the Hawks making and possibly winning another premiership.

Personally I think there would be a massive difference in working hard from bottom up to just walking into a grand final and premiership.

He still has one match left to cost them a premiership. Please, football Gods, make it happen.

Dropped defensive mark in the dying seconds followed by Josh Kennedy goal to win the match for the Eagles.

He still has one match left to cost them a premiership. Please, football Gods, make it happen.

Dropped defensive mark in the dying seconds followed by Josh Kennedy goal to win the match for the Eagles.

Conversely, if he takes a grand final winning mark (ala Leo Barry), it totally makes him at Hawthorn. That last game for the season makes players. Just ask Tom Hawkins. If you can do it on that big stage, you can do it anywhere.

Edited September 26, 201510 yr by AdamFarr

Frawley played really well last night. I didn't like his comments afterwards though, it shown a real lack of class for mine.

Just showed a lack of IQ I thought.

Being originally from Perth this Grand Final is a lose-lose for me.

1) The eagles win and I have to hear about it for months from moronic Eagles supporters who claim that the fact their club had +349 free kicks over the last 4 years is because they are first to the ball.

2) The Hawks win their 3rd in a row, Frawley gets a flag after jumping ship and I have to hear about how great the Hawks are from the people at work.

Talk about between a rock and a hard place!

Frawley should just be enjoying the moment .

Taking a cheap shot at Melbourne just shows a complete lack of class by the guy.

Have to accept the MFC was has been a basket case... It's the club responsibility to create an environment were players want to stay... It's not always premierships but what occurred from 08-13 was a disgrace & don't blame players who left to seek more opportunities..

So brave of Frawley to jump ship at the Demons and run off to ride the coat tails of the back to back premiers.

So, so brave.

Nearly as brave as bagging him on the internet using a pseudonym

Just showed a lack of IQ I thought.

my thoughts exactly - he is not the sharpest tool in the shed.

who is this Frawley chap ? can't say I have much of a care

We should all just be thankful that it's Frawley and not Mitch Clark who is line to win a flag. At least Chip gave us 8 years of service. He might not be the sharpest tool in the shed and his comments were pretty poor, but that's life. No one is perfect.

Not a fan of Chip but his comments were nothing. Didn't have a go at the Dees. Just said that's why he went to Hawthorn. Fair enough really.

I don't think it was a cheap shot. He left Melbourne for a chance at a flag, to play finals

Every Melbourne player that has left on their terms over the past few years has made an effort to get to a top side. Harsh reality is that these blokes were at the club for a decade and never played finals,or only played in one or two, 8-9 years ago.

Just showed a lack of IQ I thought.

Yep, hard to have class when you lack IQ

If he wins a flag so be it. He has hardly earnt it.

Boy, there's a lot of bitter and twisted posters on here. Most of you guys were pushing him out the door last year and rejoicing that we got Pick 3 for him. Yes he didn't have a great year last year but a lot of that was because he was forced to play forward. Fast forward 12 months Hawthorn tried him in the forward line and was ordinary there. He is a backman through and through.

He gave us very good service for 7 years in the darkest years of our history. His comments the other day were not derogatory towards his former club. He just explained why he left....for an opportunity to be a premiership player. Isn't that the goal of 95% of AFL players? If he didn't go last year after the club only won 4 games, he would have missed the boat.