JKH has more pace and burst speed than Garlett. Who on earth is disputing JKH's speed ?!

That's not his issue. He simply chooses when to use it, which is a common problem among a few too many on our list. His attack on the footy is soft - whether it be to dispose of or to collect the ball. I saw it yesterday and I saw it in our last brilliant MCG win (?).

He loves to run and he knows he's quick - see when he chased after the ball in a match race on the wing yesterday. It's no different to Howe loving to mark and slot goals in difficult places.

We just have to make complete footballers out of talent. That's up to development. They're not always going to make it happen because some players simply can't change themselves. So be it - out the door you go.

JKH has more pace and burst speed than Garlett. Who on earth is disputing JKH's speed ?!

That's not his issue. He simply chooses when to use it, which is a common problem among a few too many on our list. His attack on the footy is soft - whether it be to dispose of or to collect the ball. I saw it yesterday and I saw it in our last brilliant MCG win (?).

He loves to run and he knows he's quick - see when he chased after the ball in a match race on the wing yesterday. It's no different to Howe loving to mark and slot goals in difficult places.

We just have to make complete footballers out of talent. That's up to development. They're not always going to make it happen because some players simply can't change themselves. So be it - out the door you go.

I don't think so...

I'm sorry to burst some bubbles here, but JKH is not fast. Just because he is a small indigenous footballer, doesn't make him naturally quick. Do some research on him and look at his draft camp stats.

He's agile, quick, but not fast, and definitely not as fast as Garlett.

Sadly.

I'm sorry to burst some bubbles here, but JKH is not fast. Just because he is a small indigenous footballer, doesn't make him naturally quick. Do some research on him and look at his draft camp stats.

He looks fast but he isn't exceptionally quick. He is also not slow, just an average to slightly quick player. Maybe he looks deceptively quick as his legs do seem to move very quick, maybe he takes small steps.

He looks fast but he isn't exceptionally quick. He is also not slow, just an average to slightly quick player. Maybe he looks deceptively quick as his legs do seem to move very quick, maybe he takes small steps.

Fair enough. Must be my eyes playing tricks.

Appreciate opinion but people get on the defensive too easily in here. Juzz - I don't have the time nor the interest to look at draft combine stats or whatever. I have a job, a life. I enjoy footy as leisure. I'll let the Dees recruiters do the research, thanks. :-)

Howe, pick 6 & pick 24 for Prestia & pick 9 (from Dixon trade)?

We can dream!

And Bennell for steak knives!

JKH is [censored] load quicker then Bail who some mention has so call pace!? Something I have never seen him use at all in his time at the Dees.

I don't think JKH is super quick. But I also don't think he is fit enough to show it if he was.

JKH is [censored] load quicker then Bail who some mention has so call pace!? Something I have never seen him use at all in his time at the Dees.

There is different aspects to pace, which makes all statements about "speed" and "pace" confusing.

JKH has good acceleration, but a poor top speed, which is likely due to his small legs.

Rohan Bail has poor acceleration, but a really good sustained "pace"

Neither are exceptionally quick.

Fitzy and Watts are our two best 100m runners, I remember reading this somewhere, dont have actual source.

JKH can build his pace.

He might not find a home unless he can do something incredibly well, at the moment he looks like a jack-of-all-skills, master of you know what...

JKH is [censored] load quicker then Bail who some mention has so call pace!? Something I have never seen him use at all in his time at the Dees.

Supporting someone by comparing them favourably to someone you don't rate at all doesn't help your case.

Get off Bail Dazzle. He's achieved more than you ever will on a footy field, nearly lost his career early due to continually putting his head over the ball for the club you love (although you obviously have issues with some of the players) and lived through the dysfunctional years under Connolly, Schwab and Neeld. By AFL standards he falls short but he gave everything he could and deserves our support, not your continual snide remarks to deride him at every opportunity.

For a passionate supporter you really are a dunce at times.

Supporting someone by comparing them favourably to someone you don't rate at all doesn't help your case.

Get off Bail Dazzle. He's achieved more than you ever will on a footy field, nearly lost his career early due to continually putting his head over the ball for the club you love (although you obviously have issues with some of the players) and lived through the dysfunctional years under Connolly, Schwab and Neeld. By AFL standards he falls short but he gave everything he could and deserves our support, not your continual snide remarks to deride him at every opportunity.

For a passionate supporter you really are a dunce at times.

Are the old ' how many AFL games you have played' line.

Its almost like one of those nerdy try hard pick up lines that fail..

You are as bad as Saty when it comes to protecting players. Give it a rest 'Chap' I am allowed criticize whoever I wan't especially when im putting thousands of dollars each year into this club.

There is different aspects to pace, which makes all statements about "speed" and "pace" confusing.

JKH has good acceleration, but a poor top speed, which is likely due to his small legs.

Rohan Bail has poor acceleration, but a really good sustained "pace"

Neither are exceptionally quick.

Fitzy and Watts are our two best 100m runners, I remember reading this somewhere, dont have actual source.

I reckon it's the other way around. There was a moment in the GWS game where he sprinted across to the wing and I couldn't believe my eyes. He'd worked up pace in momentum, but in my book he has really poor acceleration, but pretty good agility. I'm just not sure he's really good at anything to make it though.

EDIT. Yeah, exactly.

JKH can build his pace.

He might not find a home unless he can do something incredibly well, at the moment he looks like a jack-of-all-skills, master of you know what...

Supporting someone by comparing them favourably to someone you don't rate at all doesn't help your case.

Get off Bail Dazzle. He's achieved more than you ever will on a footy field, nearly lost his career early due to continually putting his head over the ball for the club you love (although you obviously have issues with some of the players) and lived through the dysfunctional years under Connolly, Schwab and Neeld. By AFL standards he falls short but he gave everything he could and deserves our support, not your continual snide remarks to deride him at every opportunity.

For a passionate supporter you really are a dunce at times.

Not sure this is a great case mounted either. So you can't put a player down if you've never played the game at the top level? Jeez, I hate this argument. That's closer to acting the dunce in my book.

Perhaps this thread should be closed as it has gone off topic and I think most would agree Taylor has done a good job so far and a miraculous one when compared to Prendergast, the real "dunce".

Get off Bail Dazzle. He's achieved more than you ever will on a footy field, nearly lost his career early due to continually putting his head over the ball for the club you love (although you obviously have issues with some of the players) and lived through the dysfunctional years under Connolly, Schwab and Neeld. By AFL standards he falls short but he gave everything he could and deserves our support, not your continual snide remarks to deride him at every opportunity.

I agree with this sentiment. I do feel sorry for the players who have tried but come up short. I hate bagging them. Then again, I hate seeing us getting thrashed and beaten to a pulp so often because we've unearthed so many of these players.

He's agile, quick, but not fast, and definitely not as fast as Garlett.

Sadly.

Would have to agree - very agile and very quick off the mark and quick thinking. Can make up for pure speed.

I know he would be a dinosaur in today's game, but Greg Williams was amazingly 'quick' in thought and action, and strong in body, but really very slow across the ground.

I don't think JKH is super quick. But I also don't think he is fit enough to show it if he was.

He has had a rotten run with injuries: let's hope that is behind him and with a good preseason he gets a chance to show his wares 2016.

There is different aspects to pace, which makes all statements about "speed" and "pace" confusing.

JKH has good acceleration, but a poor top speed, which is likely due to his small legs.

Rohan Bail has poor acceleration, but a really good sustained "pace"

Neither are exceptionally quick.

Fitzy and Watts are our two best 100m runners, I remember reading this somewhere, dont have actual source.

and Interesting that both are mooted as delists / trades ? :-)

He looks fast but he isn't exceptionally quick. He is also not slow, just an average to slightly quick player. Maybe he looks deceptively quick as his legs do seem to move very quick, maybe he takes small steps.

i agree, but i think he has a bit more speed than he has shown so far

he often looks a little overawed and hesitant at times rather than putting in a burst of speed. i think he tends to misjudge the pace of the game too often

definitely a development issue. i think he suffered from 2nd year blues, maybe he thought his 2nd year would be easier.

This might have been mentioned before but he also brought in Vince, Tyson as recycled players. Along with Brayshaw, Salem and Petracca who will be great. Early picks I know and anyone could get them right but I think he's done well picking competitive players. The person he is he wouldn't have picked Watts at 1 and therefore I'm at peace

heeney looks a class above brayshaw. if mills is even better - and they say he is - it says so much for how valuable the academies are going to be for the northern state clubs.

I think the academies will be just as important for every club, once they're established. & especially for the game itself, to have the 'Local' club, get its local lads playing in they're own colours.

its sad they didn't wake up to this earlier, since the draft inception, to smooth out the drafts weak points. local tribalism.

I have been thinking about this for a while and our 2013 draft is looking quite worrying. I know many people hail him as our savior, but I don't share the optimism. It could be the pessimist in me that remembers these boards and similar thoughts about Barry Prendegast soon after our 2008 and 2009 drafts.

Looking at the 2013 draft two seasons on:

Pick 9: Christian Salem. Appears to be a good pick, is a good competitor with neat skills. I don't know about his speed at this stage, rarely gets out of a jog. Cant claim it as a fantastic pick as a Cripps, Sheed and McCarthy were all taken after him and have probably shown more. Injuries and lack of fitness have made it hard to get an accurate gauge.

Pick 40: Jay Kennedy-Harris: This pick is worrying as he is an undersized player who does not have great speed. He also lacks the evasive moves that would be required with this lack of speed. Kicking also lacks penetration. In fairness there was not too much still around at this point in the draft. The bigger concern was hearing rumours we rated him much higher than this and were surprised he was still available.

Pick 57: Jayden Hunt: Speculative pick that probably should have been a rookie. Have not seen much of him and when he does play doesn't get enough of the ball. Has some attributes which could make him an AFL standard player.

Rookies:

James Harmes: Lacks polish but moves OK, better speed than most of the plodders on our list. Doubt he makes it. Will be the new whipping boy if Matt Jones and Rohan Bail don't make it.

Max King: I think he shows some real promise. Good skills for a big man and worth at least giving the same amount of development we have given to Spencer.

Alex Georgiou: Terrible pick and a waste of 7 AFL games. Undersized KPP who gives no offensive drive.

My biggest concern, however, is rating Lewis Taylor in the top 9 Players in the 2013 draft. I cant understand how this was possible.

On a side note: have just read Emma Quayle's book The Draftees. I found it interesting to see we rated: Mccarrtin and Heeney at 1 and 2. Then as has been widely speculated Petracca, Brayshaw and Lever next.

What are peoples thoughts?

thanks Jason, is that you? nice post good try.

I reckon it's the other way around. There was a moment in the GWS game where he sprinted across to the wing and I couldn't believe my eyes. He'd worked up pace in momentum, but in my book he has really poor acceleration, but pretty good agility. I'm just not sure he's really good at anything to make it though.

EDIT. Yeah, exactly.

JKH can build his pace.

He might not find a home unless he can do something incredibly well, at the moment he looks like a jack-of-all-skills, master of you know what...

He's small & light, which in my opinion makes him quick of the first two steps, but lacks the muscles to form the power to be fast over 20Mtrs. so he's agile, & needs to be quick of mind to survive.

& his disposal skills have to be the best, or IMO he will get overtaken quickly.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/td-melbourne-demons

Time will tell but I must admit looking at the table below makes my heart beat a little faster

Melbourne Demons AFL Draft Picks at the end of Season 2014 2014 AFL Draft Summary Type Round Pick Player Current Team Games Since Drafted * National 1 2 Christian Petracca Melbourne 0 National 1 3 Angus Brayshaw Melbourne 21 National 2 40 Alex Neal-Bullen Melbourne 11 National 3 42 Father/Son Billy Stretch Melbourne 11 National 3 53 Oscar McDonald Melbourne 2 Rookie 1 2 Aaron Vandenberg Melbourne 14 Rookie 2 20 Mitchell White Melbourne 1

I'd be more interested in the clubs B&F voting than Demonland.

You were right. MFC B&F voting was much more generous than Demonland. He got 112 votes and finished 16th. Demonland had him about middle 20's.

DL voting as a KPI?

Oh dear...

DL got it pretty much right. Underrated Howe and Garland but the first 5 were spot on.

Last night much was made of having a team of competitive footballers. If Roos is true to his word Harry has a bit of work to do.

In this instance.

It still shouldn't be used as a KPI.