Jay Clark has just said Dees to trade Jack Watts for a ''decent player'' or a Top 20 pick??

What's the difference between Jack Watts and a Car?

You get a better value when you trade a car in after 6 years.

Ouch

What's the difference between Jack Watts and a Car?

You get a better value when you trade a car in after 6 years.

A car can move with the ball in hand

What's the difference between Jack Watts and a Car?

You get a better value when you trade a car in after 6 years.

Thats the sort of joke that would have been funny in grade 3 buddy....

Every time I open this thread I'm hoping to read news of another NQR having left the building.

There's still time, but it needs to happen.

I am coming around to this need for culture change. The new players still have a burning hunger to succeed, whereas the older players could well be burnt out by constant failure. Anyway we will have changed 75% of the list by December.

burnt out by failure yes, but when kids first come into an AFL club, they immediately adopt the ways of the peers, within the first month.

...... if the peers are only semi Pro & are casual about success, (as we have been mostly for Decades, saving for some brief stints under Barass/Northey era's) this club has been totally cosy, all mates, nice, & casual about real success.

We pay them too easily for little return, & after generations of players have been easily satisfied, just with pats on the back, or the soft sounds of nice condolences after losses. but they still get payed all the same... the pain is easily removed by Monday, along with the bruises, if any. These generations of players each added layer upon layer of 'soft', to this clubs culture... that culture accepted by the players, & this they're domain, they guard and protect as they're own.

............................. at least it has been that way.

Our culture has been woefully soft for as long as I care to remember. Apart from when we had some real coaches, who payed heavily trying to get the place shipshape, Yet again..... only to leave, & then see it return to where it was, cosy, & in slippers...

.

Edited September 29, 20159 yr by dee-luded

or PTSD - negligence in regard to their duty of care.

hunger desire breeds courage to do anything to get what you need, if its in deep enough. but they still need natural talent to build onto.

but without that desperate hunger, all the skills in the world wouldn't equal a sammy newman hairpiece.

Eric Wallace just got delisted? he can ruck... useless around the ground

I hope another club gives him a chance, some VFL games he looked the goods.....

In addition to these six rookie-listed players, each club can include up to three additional players (now referred to as Category B rookies) on its Rookie List provided the player either:

• has not registered in an Australian Football competition for three years immediately before inclusion on the Rookie List;

• is an international player, meaning he is not an Australian citizen and has not lived in Australia for a substantial period;

• is a former NSW Scholarship player with that club;

• is a former International Scholarship player with that club;

• is a rookie Zone Selection for clubs based in NSW or Queensland.

Given that he can't be taken as a Category B again, I'd say it's unlikely that he'll get picked up.

On this topic, I'd quite like to see us use the international rookie list more than we have. I don't think that guys like Maia Westrupp are the type of athlete that the list should be used for. We should use it to try out athletes from sports where there is a bit of crossover in skills. Some NCAA basketballers could make good tap ruckmen, while it would be good to try some rugby players and American footballers as ruckmen in the Mike Pyke mould. Having played footy in different countries and against people from different countries, I think you'd be very lucky to train somebody that hasn't grown up with the sport to be a successful midfielder (Gaelic footballers are an exception). It's too difficult to teach people the basic skills that AFL players have developed from a young age, let alone to get them to AFL quality.

I believe that there are many international athletes out there that possess the raw athleticism of a guy like Nic Naitanui and could become very successful AFL Players. Category B rookies don't take up a spot on your primary list, so it's really a low-risk/high-reward scenario.

Just added them up and with Cross having been given the tap on the shoulder, if we were to trade all of Howe, Watts and Grimes, that is 562 games experience we'd be pushing out the door in an already very inexperienced side.

Cool heads needed at club HQ. All very well to move these guys on, but not if you're replacing them with four rolls of the dice. As good as our youngsters look, we know better than any club what can happen when they are given too much responsibility too soon.

I agree that we can't have a repeat of last time but there's a big difference in the quality of who we moved on last time and Howe/Watts/Grimes. Plus we have young players who are more accountable for their actions and are determined to win. In the worst case scenario that we can't move them on, if we have a full list to choose from Watts and Grimes are no longer best 22 for mine. As much as he frustrates me Dawes looks to be safe for 2016.

Jay Clark has just said Dees to trade Jack Watts for a ''decent player'' or a Top 20 pick??

Sounds definitive.

Jay Clark at his speculative best.

Agree completely, although Hannebury had the best beep test result at the draft camp in his year

Don't think it was the best but he was up there.

Was first in the 3km time trial.

He's always been a runner.

Fyfe said it himself yesterday, he has the players around him who do the dirt jobs and protect him to allow him to hunt the ball and take great marks. Freo has a lot of older players who could lead Fyfe when he first entered the club.

Unfortunately for the players we picked up that draft they walked into a club with no leaders. Getting rid of McDonald and Cam.B was the worst thing we could have done for the development for those players.

So Richmond, West Coast, Port, North, Carlton, the Bulldogs and Sydney had poor leadership too?

For a different argument, we didn't get rid of Bruce - he left. We offered him what he was worth, he knocked it back. We won in that situation, mainly because he was a turnover merchant, a soft player and not a leaders [censored]. How did he fare at Hawthorn? Play some good footy?

There's been a lot of talk of Watts leaving, even when his manager confirmed he'd be at the Dees for 2016 and he's on the memberships and calendars.

As much as i'm disappointed with Watts, you don't give away talls. Stef Martin is an example. (Except Dawes which i'd swap for a cold pie)

We just have to forget he's a former #1. He's 25 and played 100 games.

I wouldn't trade Howe for a 2nd round pick (weak draft predicted). 1st round yes or a decent player like Redden. He plays his best footy across half back. With Cross gone who's taking intercepts?

Same above with Toumpas, not sure he's been given enough continuity yet. Unless its part of a sweetener for a supposed A grader which I doubt.

Eagles didn't move in trades last year and look at them albeit with much better talent than us.

I think a lot of the trade speculation for Watts and Toumpas is just that, speculation.

I expect at least one of Watts/Howe/Toumpas to still be at the club next season, possibly even 2 of them.

There's been a lot of talk of Watts leaving, even when his manager confirmed he'd be at the Dees for 2016 and he's on the memberships and calendars.

As much as i'm disappointed with Watts, you don't give away talls. Stef Martin is an example. (Except Dawes which i'd swap for a cold pie)

We just have to forget he's a former #1. He's 25 and played 100 games.

Watts doesn't play tall. He never has. For someone of his height he is an awful contested mark - I dare say Jesse has taken more contested marks in his first season than JW has in his entire career. He's nothing more than an awkward sized, soft, outside mid.

Watts doesn't play tall. He never has. For someone of his height he is an awful contested mark - I dare say Jesse has taken more contested marks in his first season than JW has in his entire career. He's nothing more than an awkward sized, soft, outside mid.

You're not far off.

Watts total contested marks: 82

Hogan 2015 contested marks: 47

I see Watts as a good 3rd tall though so wouldn't mind keeping him.

Jordan Murdoch was thrown up on Footy Classified as a player than may be part of the Dangerfield deal. I would look at trying to land him for a draft pick or Toumpas, which would go to Adelaide if he wants to stay in Victoria.

"Playing Tall" always reminds me of Brad Green and Cam Bruce. Brad played tall at 183cm but Cam's 190 cm always seemed shorter.

Watts doesn't play tall. He never has. For someone of his height he is an awful contested mark - I dare say Jesse has taken more contested marks in his first season than JW has in his entire career. He's nothing more than an awkward sized, soft, outside mid.

Yeah I agree with you, he's not a key position tall. He might be used as a quasi ruck man this year as the sub rules gone.

Yeah I agree with you, he's not a key position tall. He might be used as a quasi ruck man this year as the sub rules gone.

Watts would be 3rd man up at best. He is not suited to the ruck position (quasi or genuine) at all.

Watts would be 3rd man up at best. He is not suited to the ruck position (quasi or genuine) at all.

Watts was terrific as third man up this season. But of course he's not going to work as a a back up ruckman.

One thing that the club will consider, even if many fans don't, is the age profile of the club. If we trade Watts, Jones, Terlich and Howe in addition to the older players we have already axed we will have will have a whole bunch of players 18-22, some 22-24 and SFA 25 and over. That does not work which means that if they trade Watts and Howe it will have to be for a player with a similar age profile not a draft pick. Look at the caning Melksham is getting on here. What mid twenties player that might be swapped for those two is going to have DL jumping up and down for joy?

Jordan Murdoch was thrown up on Footy Classified as a player than may be part of the Dangerfield deal. I would look at trying to land him for a draft pick or Toumpas, which would go to Adelaide if he wants to stay in Victoria.

I'm not a fan, has some good games but falls into the category of athlete not footballer for me.

You're not far off.

Watts total contested marks: 82

Hogan 2015 contested marks: 47

I see Watts as a good 3rd tall though so wouldn't mind keeping him.

Watts 196cm 88kg

Lynch 192cm 87kg

I think Watts is gone, we made a play for Lynch and failed.

Let him be someone else's problem.

The contested mark stat is interesting, how many years on the list?

Watts 196cm 88kg

Lynch 192cm 87kg

I think Watts is gone, we made a play for Lynch and failed.

Let him be someone else's problem.

The contested mark stat is interesting, how many years on the list?

I don't get your point with the height and weight? What has that got to do with anything? Also, 4cm's is not much anyway.

I'm not really worried if he stays or goes to be honest. But I don't see the point in trading him in a weak draft for a pick over 25.

Thats the sort of joke that would have been funny in grade 3 buddy....

Dad joke?