I didn't know anything, just that Todd was at a ton of poineers games, the media had it written down as an almost certainty and that Ollie even said himself he wanted to come to the Melbourne football club and wasn't at all daunted by the challenge, thought he and Jack would play well together.

You don't know anything, yet you make the definitive statement: "for so long we were going to take Ollie regardless of what else happened"

Anyway, don't worry... I'm just nit-picking. Wines/Toumpas draft is history and I am not prepared to write off Toumpas just yet as this will be his first season that he enters with the benefit of being fully fit.

Geez, this is going to be popular.

In fairness, Sorrento is about an 1 hour 20 minutes these days. Maybe he is getting away, coming back for training then go back down. The freeway exit is right by AAMI Park. When I heard him say it, I did think it was odd though

In fairness, Sorrento is about an 1 hour 20 minutes these days. Maybe he is getting away, coming back for training then go back down. The freeway exit is right by AAMI Park. When I heard him say it, I did think it was odd though

Maybe he had a craving for some ice cream from Slips Ice Cream Parlour... although he may need a time machine.

Toumpas was the 3rd leading tackler for the Dees with 5. I saw him go in hard and lay a couple of good tackles.

Still waiting for Jack Watts to do that.

Anyway i still have the faith we can still develop him into a good player for us. Its not like he is a Morton Blease Watts that just goes through the emotions, I did see him putting in the hard yards and running hard to provide an option.

he will come good.

I think Watts's biggest weakness is his marking, people go on about Dawes but I think he is worse. He will always look laconic and weak that is just his make up.

Brad Johnson who watches a fair bit of under 18's football said he used to clunk all his marks at that level. He said he has been working on his marking this pre season, so if he can get back to clunking marks again that should give him enough confidence to kick at least an extra 10 to 15 goals a season which will make him more than a handy player and should keep the doubters off his back.

Toumpas just needs a little love as he is a confidence player. He just needs a bit of continuity in his game to turn his fortunes around. Under Bailey or Neeld I would say he was no chance to turn it around but under Roos who is one of the finest and most respected teachers going around (although I seriously doubt that Toumpas will be anywhere near as talented as Macrae, Stringer and Wines)Roos can turn him into a fine player.

Why is this even a subject considering one has played 6 seasons and the other has only played 2?

Toumpas just needs to find it more, an injury uninterrupted season or two and he might be able to change that. I can see he wants to take the game on, and he has great foot skills, so I'm willing to back him in.

Toumpas just needs to find it more, an injury uninterrupted season or two and he might be able to change that. I can see he wants to take the game on, and he has great foot skills, so I'm willing to back him in.

Toumpas will have a good year this year. He looks in good nick.

Ollie wines was a big standout as a junior, I remember him and Jack Billings(a year below) and thinking to myself how we needed to land one of these guys, but Toumpas was always seen as a class player, with great leadership, but making the transition to AFL (better opposition) some make it some don't.

I would like us to give Toumpas as many years as we have to Watts.

I was watching Toumpas in the first half against Fremantle, at time it was like he was running to a position where the ball was never going to go and he looked physically exhausted. When he plays like this he is a massive liability to our team, at minimum he should be guarding an opposition player , watch Lumumba, he is eithor attacking and running off his player or he is 1cm away from his opponent pressuring them and staying in contact with them, there shouldn't be an in between, unless we get caught from a bad turnover( Max Gawn, Colin Garland!)

Ollie wines was a big standout as a junior, I remember him and Jack Billings(a year below) and thinking to myself how we needed to land one of these guys, but Toumpas was always seen as a class player, with great leadership, but making the transition to AFL (better opposition) some make it some don't.

I would like us to give Toumpas as many years as we have to Watts.

I was watching Toumpas in the first half against Fremantle, at time it was like he was running to a position where the ball was never going to go and he looked physically exhausted. When he plays like this he is a massive liability to our team, at minimum he should be guarding an opposition player , watch Lumumba, he is eithor attacking and running off his player or he is 1cm away from his opponent pressuring them and staying in contact with them, there shouldn't be an in between, unless we get caught from a bad turnover( Max Gawn, Colin Garland!)

199 games versus like, 12?

Strange comparison.

I'd take Watts over Toumpas every day of the week. I'm yet to see anything that tells me Toumpas will make it in the AFL.

Ollie wines was a big standout as a junior, I remember him and Jack Billings(a year below) and thinking to myself how we needed to land one of these guys, but Toumpas was always seen as a class player, with great leadership, but making the transition to AFL (better opposition) some make it some don't.

I would like us to give Toumpas as many years as we have to Watts.

I was watching Toumpas in the first half against Fremantle, at time it was like he was running to a position where the ball was never going to go and he looked physically exhausted. When he plays like this he is a massive liability to our team, at minimum he should be guarding an opposition player , watch Lumumba, he is eithor attacking and running off his player or he is 1cm away from his opponent pressuring them and staying in contact with them, there shouldn't be an in between, unless we get caught from a bad turnover( Max Gawn, Colin Garland!)

re The Prince I thought I did that in the 70's and early 80's. At metropolitan leve, run with your opponent when they have the ball and take off when we have it.

Why is that so hard to do for some of our players?

Edited March 7, 201510 yr by Earl Hood

Both vying for the quarterback position

Both vying for the quarterback position

So they've taken up American football?

A quarter back is someone who sweeps behind the pack setting up forward thrusts

A quarter back is someone who sweeps behind the pack setting up forward thrusts

It's an expression that has been picked up from American football, to the best of my knowledge.

From the AFL Positions WIki page: "A player who is really good at setting up attacks from defence, due to their quality ball skills and decision-making abilities, may be referred to as a Quarterback (this slang term is a reference to American Football)."

Call me a traditionalist, but I hate, no, despise the adopting of these terms which all seem to be taking away from the unique nature of our game.

You might as well call them point guards. It's about as relevant.

Quarterback, distributor, architect, whatever. We've had a few;

Brett Lovett

Travis Johnstone

Adam yze

The flash

Now it's time for someone new, either toumpas or watts. It's the only position that really fits them. Watts most definetly.

Aren't the grooming Salem for the role?

Salem can play anywhere. Maybe swapping with Viney.

199 games versus like, 12?

Strange comparison.

I'm not comparing the two, only saying that Lumumba could teach a lot of our boys how to mark an opponent when the opposition have the ball.

re The Prince I thought I did that in the 70's and early 80's. At metropolitan leve, run with your opponent when they have the ball and take off when we have it.

Why is that so hard to do for some of our players?

The Prince is doing it in 2015 and it seems to be working for him, his attacking play is what stands out, but his marking a defensive work is equally impressive.

I'm not comparing the two, only saying that Lumumba could teach a lot of our boys how to mark an opponent when the opposition have the ball.

If we need a new player from another club to tell our players how to play AFL, we're in deep kaka.

Thus far, Toumpas is at the crossroads.

Hahaha!!! What a waste of time these comments are. All the Watts/Toump doubters will quickly jump on board during the season.

I can't wait for the "I told you so's" to come. It's going to be fun to watch some eat their piece of the humble pie being baked right now.

See you then.

Based on what?

Typical Melbourne supporter's view.

Because you got told how good they were when they were 17?

Because they both went as high draft picks?

Jimmy Toumpas looks like a boy playing against men.

Watts looks like he doesn't even want to be there.

I hope you're right mate, I'll come and cut the pie and eat the first piece!

But I've seen nothing encouraging yet.

A quarter back is someone who sweeps behind the pack setting up forward thrusts

give me a break.........quarter back....fmd