On the question above - Grand New Flag, hardnut, Baghdad Bob, bandicoot among a few others (but not me) can take plenty of credit for seeing the writing on the wall early.

Hm, I guess it depends on your definition of "early". David King, early? Expressing doubts is different from categorically saying he is not the man for the job. I know GNF was strongly anti-Neeld but not sure how early. Myself and stuie were anti-Neeld but not until the beginning of the year, and even at that stage we were outnumbered in most Neeld discussions.

To be honest, I'm not sure if calling out a coach a few months into his tenure is ever a wise thing to do, irrespective of how it panned out. Coaches need to be given a decent chance to instill their game plan and ethos. Benefit of the doubt, as it were. Neeld's grace period inevitably expired.

Everyone here got sucked in by Pedo as he had some really good VFL performances for the Roos twos where he actually played like a man. It made sense that he wasn't getting a game being about 4th of 5th in line in there talls. Then, watching his 2 minutes of highlights he looked pretty damaging in his couple games.... what wasn't to like??

And then we saw the real man, squibbing contests, ducking his head, lifting his elbow when he was a meter passed a player.

Maybe we could off load him again for pick 88 noting he played some great games for Casey this year and would have another solid 1 minute of highlights to add to his 2 mins from the Roos. I remember one contested grab against the power and the running, couple bounces goal against GWS that all looked pretty flashy.

I liked Pedersen until I saw him rock up to preseason training and be looking like sausages Pedersen. Then in the preseason games where he was out performed by Sellar I thought we were in trouble.

The thing is I don't see him as a finished AFL product yet. I know he's 26 but he hasn't been in the system all that long and his body still has a heap of work to do. He can kick, he marks nicely at CHB and he knows how to find the footy. He could legitimately be an average or better AFL CHB if it all went to plan for him. You look at the last two premiership CHB's in Heath Grundy and Josh Gibson and they really aren't that special. Certainly they dont do the quality work that their number 1 defender they play along side in Richard and Lake respectively do.

Anyway we vastly over paid for a guy of limited talent, poor work rate, poor on field character with soft efforts and we played him in a position that he couldn't ever succeed in - ruck/forward. At least this year we can set up some programs that might develop his work rate and utilize the talents he does have by putting him in the right spot. Do that and he'll likely play very well for Casey at centre half back and might be good enough to impress if/when he got a chance back at AFL.

I liked Pedersen until I saw him rock up to preseason training and be looking like sausages Pedersen. Then in the preseason games where he was out performed by Sellar I thought we were in trouble.

The thing is I don't see him as a finished AFL product yet. I know he's 26 but he hasn't been in the system all that long and his body still has a heap of work to do. He can kick, he marks nicely at CHB and he knows how to find the footy. He could legitimately be an average or better AFL CHB if it all went to plan for him. You look at the last two premiership CHB's in Heath Grundy and Josh Gibson and they really aren't that special. Certainly they dont do the quality work that their number 1 defender they play along side in Richard and Lake respectively do.

Anyway we vastly over paid for a guy of limited talent, poor work rate, poor on field character with soft efforts and we played him in a position that he couldn't ever succeed in - ruck/forward. At least this year we can set up some programs that might develop his work rate and utilize the talents he does have by putting him in the right spot. Do that and he'll likely play very well for Casey at centre half back and might be good enough to impress if/when he got a chance back at AFL.

Agree, I'm willing to believe that there is some possibility that Roos can transform Pedersen into a useful key back.

The only thing about Pedersen I cant fathom is the extension. yes, mark me down as someone sucked in by the promo package. He looked a likely handy utility. FF a little and we all see what we see. Oh well we got dudded. ...FF a bit more and the guy gets signed for more...that to me is the only WTF !!

North supporters hate Melbourne. Unfortunately they've been able to kick sand in our face.

He's gotten aHead of himself since being on the footy show.

he seems to have gotten deeper into James Brayshaw's pouch.

Hm, I guess it depends on your definition of "early". David King, early? Expressing doubts is different from categorically saying he is not the man for the job. I know GNF was strongly anti-Neeld but not sure how early. Myself and stuie were anti-Neeld but not until the beginning of the year, and even at that stage we were outnumbered in most Neeld discussions.

To be honest, I'm not sure if calling out a coach a few months into his tenure is ever a wise thing to do, irrespective of how it panned out. Coaches need to be given a decent chance to instill their game plan and ethos. Benefit of the doubt, as it were. Neeld's grace period inevitably expired.

thats fair, & when a coach has to become a surgeon in the emergency department, & has to amputate damaged tissue, to help save the patient, he won't be very popular when the reality hits home. but may just have saved the place, even if the procedure is unpopular.

* enter the end of surgery, & new preseason, & a fresh 2014 approaches, with lot's of New growth appearing, & a healthier club to go forward with.

thats fair, & when a coach has to become a surgeon in the emergency department, & has to amputate damaged tissue, to help save the patient, he won't be very popular when the reality hits home. but may just have saved the place, even if the procedure is unpopular.

* enter the end of surgery, & new preseason, & a fresh 2014 approaches, with lot's of New growth appearing, & a healthier club to go forward with.

Yeah nah I can't agree with that. Whilst I agreed with many of his list changes, a couple of which may in fact end up being his legacy, overall he was a shocking appointment. He was unpopular because he was a terrible senior coach.

thats fair, & when a coach has to become a surgeon in the emergency department, & has to amputate damaged tissue, to help save the patient, he won't be very popular when the reality hits home. but may just have saved the place, even if the procedure is unpopular.

* enter the end of surgery, & new preseason, & a fresh 2014 approaches, with lot's of New growth appearing, & a healthier club to go forward with.

No I preferred the Bailey style tanking where we at least accumulated a bunch of kids and thought we had some talents about to hit their prime. The Neeld style non deliberate tanking wasn't any fun at all.

Yeah nah I can't agree with that. Whilst I agreed with many of his list changes, a couple of which may in fact end up being his legacy, overall he was a shocking appointment. He was unpopular because he was a terrible senior coach.

Yes Neeld was a terrible coach and lost the players, as a result a couple of required players left. The list changes that were made in those years aren't as bad as some make out. Most of the delistings weren't regrettable. Byrnes for 2 and Pedersen for 3 are.

If you want to look for the nucleus of our failure you can't go past Bailey's failure to understand the direction of the game and Prendergast's disastrous recruiting.

I wouldn't pump Bob up too much. He had a close eye on internal workings as his role as a volunteer and still thought Harrington and Prendergast were the bees knees.

"Thanks Bazz"

Snigger.

You are lying and it Is pathetic.

I know Bob didn't think that way. So do you.

the problem with Andrew bolt was that he was so careless with the truth that he damaged reputations in a genuinely gutless and unfair way. I wonder if irony extends far enough to see you so boastful, so defensive and so wrong in the same way as your idol.

Not that I expect Daniel Cross would ever read this forum, but if he did, I wonder what would go through his mind if he clicked on a thread welcoming him, only to find a bunch of over 40s (apologies to Hazy) trying to outdo each other over a massive pissing contest. Comical.

You are lying and it Is pathetic.

I know Bob didn't think that way. So do you.

the problem with Andrew bolt was that he was so careless with the truth that he damaged reputations in a genuinely gutless and unfair way. I wonder if irony extends far enough to see you so boastful, so defensive and so wrong in the same way as your idol.

Genuine question; is Bob your twin brother, you seem to leap to his defence at the drop of a hat?

Yes Nasher it is a strange thread that seems to have been completely derailed.

Me? I'm looking forward to Cross playing in the side I didn't think much of the mature recruits last year but I reckon Cross will be a Gem.

Now I'll wait for 12 months to see if I cop the crap that anyone on here cops if they offer an opinion.

You are lying and it Is pathetic.

I know Bob didn't think that way. So do you.

the problem with Andrew bolt was that he was so careless with the truth that he damaged reputations in a genuinely gutless and unfair way. I wonder if irony extends far enough to see you so boastful, so defensive and so wrong in the same way as your idol.

I may be many things Tim, but a liar isn't one of them, you vituperative toerag.

By all means Bob can denounce my comments. If he dares.

Not that I expect Daniel Cross would ever read this forum, but if he did, I wonder what would go through his mind if he clicked on a thread welcoming him, only to find a bunch of over 40s (apologies to Hazy) trying to outdo each other over a massive pissing contest. Comical.

Comical? With Ben involved it could be nothing else.

I reckon he'd think we're having a bit of fun. Welcome Crossy, a great get and a no brainier. We'd have won the R23 game if we'd had him a year earlier.

_{If Buddy can play until he's 35 then I think Cross might last until he's 38. Super fit individual. We should have offered a 7 year deal!}

Edited October 25, 201311 yr by Goodvibes

Comical? With Ben involved it could be nothing else.

Comical ?

"I think BBBP has an exceptional eye for talent evidenced by McDonald, Davis, Howe, Bail, McKenzie, Evans and Nicholson. He was gutsy with Cook and Gysberts.

We will miss his footy smarts, independent thinking and courage and if we are Premiers one day his fingers will be all over it.

Good luck Bazz."

Your thoughts on Prendergast are fken hilarious.

Not that I expect Daniel Cross would ever read this forum, but if he did, I wonder what would go through his mind if he clicked on a thread welcoming him, only to find a bunch of over 40s (apologies to Hazy) trying to outdo each other over a massive pissing contest. Comical.

And you reckon I write inane rubbish!

And you reckon I write inane rubbish!

Well yes you do, but what's your point?

This whole site is mainly inane rubbish and ego clashes, so why should you be odd man out.

_{If Buddy can play until he's 35 then I think Cross might last until he's 38. Super fit individual. We should have offered a 7 year deal!}

We might get a 100 games out of him and first dibs on father son.

Comical ? "I think BBBP has an exceptional eye for talent evidenced by McDonald, Davis, Howe, Bail, McKenzie, Evans and Nicholson. He was gutsy with Cook and Gysberts.We will miss his footy smarts, independent thinking and courage and if we are Premiers one day his fingers will be all over it.Good luck Bazz." Your thoughts on Prendergast are fken hilarious.

This is a perfect example of ego over riding intellect, common sense and reason (not to mention footy knowledge) Keep fighting the fight for argument sake Ben.

Edited October 25, 201311 yr by Demonsterative

Well yes you do, but what's your point?

This whole site is mainly inane rubbish and ego clashes, so why should you be odd man out.

"Well yes you do," No argument from me .However, my comment refers to a deep and profound online conversation between myself, Biffen and Lord weaver that involved many obscure Biblical references. Nasher , the Phillistine, deleted this high quality work and accused this writer of being inane. Outrageous!

"Well yes you do," No argument from me .However, my comment refers to a deep and profound online conversation between myself, Biffen and Lord weaver that involved many obscure Biblical references. Nasher , the Phillistine, deleted this high quality work and accused this writer of being inane. Outrageous!

Outrageous maybe, but was he wrong?

Never mix football with anything especially Biblical references.

BTW, and on topic, I think Cross is a great add to our list. Further, the one year contract is very clever. However, I'm tipping that, injury free, Cross will play a further 1 or 2 years!

Cue several pages of me being shouted down by the Neeld bandwagon including Ben "Love the Bloke" Hur

Anyway, my point about BH was not that he made a bad call (or several shocking calls as the case may be) but that he shouldn't be so vicious and pompous when his own record is so abysmal.

In any case, I think Cross is a good pickup, especially since we didn't give him a 3 year "pedersen special".

I just re-read that thread, which was something of a mistake.

Aside from it being abysmal at times, what I did note was that you weren't at all 'shouted down'. People disagreed with you, just like you disagreed with them. There was a major p!ssing match between some trolling fools, but take those out and it essentially was you asking people why they were happy to put faith in Neeld, and them telling you why they believed it was fair at the time to have faith in Neeld.

FWIW, you'd do well to remove your own pompousness (e.g. continually cherry picking moments in the past where you said something that later proved correct, or someone else said something that later proved wrong). You may well be a more rational and open-minded poster than some, but your attitude to proving it is just as bad as those you get upset with.

We might get a 100 games out of him and first dibs on father son.

Not exactly first dibs, we'd have equal dibs with the Dogs. Player to choose one or either. Or neither if he'd fancy his chances in the draft.