2. The McMahon match. Strange player positionings (Frawley going down to the forward line) and odd match-ups (Johnson on Nathan Brown). Also the low number of rotations.

3. The St Kilda match - round 22. A focus on why Chris Connolly was on the bench as football manager during the game; why was Frawley taken off Reiwoldt and replaced with Dunn, and why was Liam Jurrah taken off after he kicked 3 goals.

Good luck making those, well, for want of a better word, "accusations" stick. Is the AFL now going to put in place an organisation to police all positional moves?

Can. Of. Pandora's.

I refuse to believe that this is all the AFL have... I know they can't have much, but really... that's just embarrassing!

We were actually winning the game...we had won three out of four qtrs, right up until Jordan !!

So inspirational positional changes are now outlawed, unless some sort of consensus approves ?. Wtf !!!

Finks must be sharpening his knives as we ponder.

Nothing new in CH 7 report....How they can point the finger at the MFC against St.Kilda....The Saints played in the GF that year..

Please.

The only way a coaching move can possibly be used as evidence of tanking is if it is absolutely clear and unequivocal that that move was made for the sole purpose of trying to lose.

An example of this would be pushing your entire team forward, leaving no one in the defensive half of the ground for a long period of time.

All other moves like player positioning and match ups can be justified by other purposes and it will have enormous (and to be honest farcical) implications if the AFL were to decide that certain player moves are evidence of tanking.

Moves like Bate to the midfield (a sign of things to come) and Miller in the ruck (one year later we saw the 2nd tall forward play the ruck relief role - Leigh Brown at the Pies) cannot be evidence of tanking. Some of the moves even worked and made us play better!

I'm sick of the biased media continually bringing up player moves. Why aren't they all screaming that Hawthorn tanked when leaving Zac Dawson on Rocca all game? If Dunn cannot play on Riewoldt does that mean a young player can never be given a difficult role if there is another player more suited for the role?

What a joke.

Anyone remember when Sylvia was at times being played as a relief ruckman..?

The only way a coaching move can possibly be used as evidence of tanking is if it is absolutely clear and unequivocal that that move was made for the sole purpose of trying to lose. An example of this would be pushing your entire team forward, leaving no one in the defensive half of the ground for a long period of time. All other moves like player positioning and match ups can be justified by other purposes and it will have enormous (and to be honest farcical) implications if the AFL were to decide that certain player moves are evidence of tanking. Moves like Bate to the midfield (a sign of things to come) and Miller in the ruck (one year later we saw the 2nd tall forward play the ruck relief role - Leigh Brown at the Pies) cannot be evidence of tanking. Some of the moves even worked and made us play better! I'm sick of the biased media continually bringing up player moves. Why aren't they all screaming that Hawthorn tanked when leaving Zac Dawson on Rocca all game? If Dunn cannot play on Riewoldt does that mean a young player can never be given a difficult role if there is another player more suited for the role? What a joke.

Yeah if i was Bailey, i'd say Frawley was one of our best players at the time and he put him forward because he wanted some goals.

Connolly was on the bench because we were struggling and he has senior coaching experience to offer. God help us if Josh M (sp?!) or Criag sit in the box this year!

if the AFL dont likethese responses then off to court we go. Try making such things stick in a court of law! they're unable to be proven beyond doubt!

And lack of rotations? You can argue that we were trying to see what sort of tank the players really had. Jurrah confirmed he didn't have much of a tank at all, so he was taken off stuffed.

If all that is all the AFL has, it sounds like they just want MFC to make a list of responses which isn't entirely farcical and then put it all to bed. Let's hope so.

I too saw the Channel 7 News and I am flabbergasted if the AFL legal advisers are basing accusations on the featured items. This is becoming a joke that we can have a 44 page post (and growing) on the flimsiest of charges. All I can say that Carlton must be operating their shredder over the Xmas break as there is a lot more that they should be worried about!

Oh yes it does. Grimshaw, Jalland, Howcroft and others hold very senior business positions. With plausible deniability they could avoid involvement and they would make decisions based on what's best for the club. If their reputations are on the line that objective will be seriously muddied.

Didn't Joe insist the club "fess up" to ensure his own corporate governance wasn't compromised.

I too saw the Channel 7 News and I am flabbergasted if the AFL legal advisers are basing accusations on the featured items. This is becoming a joke that we can have a 44 page post (and growing) on the flimsiest of charges. All I can say that Carlton must be operating their shredder over the Xmas break as there is a lot more that they should be worried about!

couldn't agree more.

12 in a row Carlton. 12.

Just made myself a promise I am staying off this thread until something happens.

I have just read three pages of the same crap we have been talking about for 6 months.

couldn't agree more.

12 in a row Carlton. 12.

14 in a row Tigers in 2004 .

8 in a row Pies in 2005

Hawks do something similar in 2004 and 2005 - 2 Priority picks

Ditto for the Doggies in 2003 and 2004 - 2 Priority picks

There's lots more ....

14 in a row Tigers in 2004 .

8 in a row Pies in 2005

Hawks do something similar in 2004 and 2005 - 2 Priority picks

Ditto for the Doggies in 2003 and 2004 - 2 Priority picks

There's lots more ....

This is not crying poor.

This sh!t is slanderous having this on the nightly news while all other clubs sleep tight.

Angry.

This is not crying poor.

This sh!t is slanderous having this on the nightly news while all other clubs sleep tight.

Angry.

I've been telling everyone I know about all the indiscretions ... Tiger fans are now worried about Wallace's comments . Terry's views are out in the public domain .

But many have forgotten and in a lot of cases had no real idea of the extent . Probably because it was viewed like 'The cat that got the cream' in those times .

Past always catches up hey ...

Just made myself a promise I am staying off this thread until something happens.

I have just read three pages of the same crap we have been talking about for 6 months.

never stopped Seinfeld.

You'll be back before something happens,

which wont happen.

we're set now anyway.

We have more than a few good men.

They cant handle the truth.

This is not crying poor.

This sh!t is slanderous having this on the nightly news while all other clubs sleep tight.

Angry.

Oh please WYL, give me a spell with this other club palaver or indeed the suggestion this is slanderous. The whole footy world knows this is a joke - particularly rubbish about questioning positional moves. For gods sake Dunn is now a defender, Watts is down back full time and our best back played the second half of last season as a forward (helped out at times by Garland). Slanderous smanderous.

Other clubs sleep tight? What emotive nonsense.

I reckon the sponsors would be rapt - Opel and Webjet have had more air time in the last few months than they had all season.

Relax - all will be well.

Oh please WYL, give me a spell with this other club palaver or indeed the suggestion this is slanderous. The whole footy world knows this is a joke - particularly rubbish about questioning positional moves. For gods sake Dunn is now a defender, Watts is down back full time and our best back played the second half of last season as a forward (helped out at times by Garland). Slanderous smanderous.

Other clubs sleep tight? What emotive nonsense.

I reckon the sponsors would be rapt - Opel and Webjet have had more air time in the last few months than they had all season.

Relax - all will be well.

glad you were entertained.

14 in a row Tigers in 2004 .

8 in a row Pies in 2005

Hawks do something similar in 2004 and 2005 - 2 Priority picks

Ditto for the Doggies in 2003 and 2004 - 2 Priority picks

There's lots more ....

you ommitted to mention Collingwood and Freo in 1999 when it all started!

I've been telling everyone I know about all the indiscretions ... Tiger fans are now worried about Wallace's comments . Terry's views are out in the public domain .

But many have forgotten and in a lot of cases had no real idea of the extent . Probably because it was viewed like 'The cat that got the cream' in those times .

Past always catches up hey ...

& don't forget Wet Coasters...

you don't have to aim directly at the PriorPicks when you have the framework of an existing premiership team on the field...

all you need to do is go down low on the AFL Ladder for 2 or 3 years & scrutinise the U-18's really well, & tell a few boys to get up to no good to relegate they're draft values.

I've been telling everyone I know about all the indiscretions ... Tiger fans are now worried about Wallace's comments . Terry's views are out in the public domain .

But many have forgotten and in a lot of cases had no real idea of the extent . Probably because it was viewed like 'The cat that got the cream' in those times .

Past always catches up hey ...

We need to get Fev, Libba and Terry Wallace on On The Couch as soon as possible.

I find the questioning of the interchange laughable - if it wasn't a Grand Final but a home and away game late in the season would Ross Lyon have been questioned for leaving Luke Ball on the bench for so long in the 09 Grand Final (a move that arguably cost the Saints the game as he was their best player in conditions that suited him down to the ground)?

I don't think Bailey will have any problems defending his Coaching moves.

& don't forget Wet Coasters...

you don't have to aim directly at the PriorPicks when you have the framework of an existing premiership team on the field...

all you need to do is go down low on the AFL Ladder for 2 or 3 years & scrutinise the U-18's really well, & tell a few boys to get up to no good to relegate they're draft values.

Yeah, it's not just the priority pick years .

The Bryce Gibbs cup in 2006 was essentially for the no.1 pick . Both teams tanked so well it ended up being a draw

you ommitted to mention Collingwood and Freo in 1999 when it all started!

Might have even started a little earlier but .....don't mention the war

We need to get Fev, Libba and Terry Wallace on On The Couch as soon as possible.

no not on the couch but primed and dressed and sitting on our bench in full view of the AFL goons.

This is a game. We need to lead them to the point of checkmate and allow them to walk. But with a chit.

They (our adversaries) need to be in no doubt as to what can be done, push come to shove !