Lucas Cook, Jack Fitzpatrick etc

[satyricon 267]

I am not posting as regular because I am getting rather bored with the negativity and the constant hijacking of threads by a minority

But back on topic

I had the opportunity on Sunday to ask Josh Mahoney a direct question to which he gave me a direct answer, which I am sure he won't mind me quoting re Lucas Cook and Jack Fitzpatrick

I will have to paraphrase a bit because memory not the same as it used to be

I asked "with the rumour we are chasing Travis Cloke, does that mean we don't think Cook and Fitzpatrick will make it"

He answered "don't believe everything you read about Cloke, but saying that young players need time to develop, especially key position, at least two or three years, and the Club can't afford to stay at the bottom for that time, so there is a need to try and recruit ready to go players, whilst the younger ones develop"

[binman 43,762]

I am not posting as regular because I am getting rather bored with the negativity and the constant hijacking of threads by a minority

But back on topic

I had the opportunity on Sunday to ask Josh Mahoney a direct question to which he gave me a direct answer, which I am sure he won't mind me quoting re Lucas Cook and Jack Fitzpatrick

I will have to paraphrase a bit because memory not the same as it used to be

I asked "with the rumour we are chasing Travis Cloke, does that mean we don't think Cook and Fitzpatrick will make it"

He answered "don't believe everything you read about Cloke, but saying that young players need time to develop, especially key position, at least two or three years, and the Club can't afford to stay at the bottom for that time, so there is a need to try and recruit ready to go players, whilst the younger ones develop"

Interesting and reflects the philosophy of Neeld - ie combining ready to go players and youth. Not rocket science obviously and you only need to looks at clubs that have sustained periods of success to see that it works (eg Swans, Geelong, Collingwood).

This approach was evident in his recruitment last year of Magner and Couch and i'm sure we'll see more early to mid 20 players getting drafted in from VFL and other similar leagues, along with whatever ready to go players we can trade in (think Boak, Caddy and some from left field that might be part of complex trade deals with multiple clubs).

At the same time we will put the time and effort into developing the young kids, and if need be that will be in the VFL (as it should be). The model of developing craft and experience in the magoos harks back to a time where it was common for players to play 30-50 in the 2's before getting a chance in the seniors. Think of the Hawks and players like Ayres and Tuck. Granted there are smaller list these days but still being patient with players and giving them the time is a terrific approach i reckon

With another solid pre season and some new blood (and a half decent run with injury) i am hopeful we will move away from the bottom of the ladder next year

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,809]

Good question to Josh, Satyricon!

Good answer, too.

I am hoping that our real motive is to bump up Cloke's asking price, in the hope that salary cap squeeze will force Coll. to release a midfielder(eg Sinclair, who should be with us anyway as the son of a former Demon.)

Obviously Josh couldn't reveal it , if that's their real motive.

I subscribe to the theory that Cloke is pretty inconsistent at Coll. , despite first class delivery. I reckon he'd be even more unreliable with us, apart from the fact that I worry about having so much of our sal. Cap devoted to one player.( as it is with Mitch, who has really justified it though.)

[Bossdog 2,002]

And look how much time Geelong took with Hawkins......

[low flying Robbo 979]

was this a one-on-one question to Josh? or in BTB?

[satyricon 267]

No it was a small group, but I asked him directly, if that makes sense, the group I was with all have very good 'bulldust detectors",so what we got was an answer, I have asked a couple of similar questions to Jade Rawlings, Leigh Brown and Mark Neeld on previous occasions and you get the same consistent answer.....I for one along with Nathan Jones believe we have the right people in the right jobs.....what they are doing is for the long term....it may be painful, it requires patience but it will work......developing Key Position Players being one part of it

Edited August 7, 2012 by satyricon

[Clark_Kent 315]

This is good to know. Too many on here want to just trade/de list some of our young players.

Some of these kids take time to really develop we can't just expect them all to come in and dominate.

I've got faith that Lucas Cook will be a very strong forward for us and will play either a 2nd or 3rd

tall which is what most premiership aspiring teams have.

[rpfc 28,779]

This is good to know. Too many on here want to just trade/de list some of our young players.

Some of these kids take time to really develop we can't just expect them all to come in and dominate.

I've got faith that Lucas Cook will be a very strong forward for us and will play either a 2nd or 3rd

tall which is what most premiership aspiring teams have.

Some struggle to justify why they would delist Cook but, equally, you would struggle to justify your faith that he could a be a 2nd or 3rd tall in a flag winning team.

I have hope for him too but there are going to be players whose contracts will be up in the air until the outcome of FA and trade week is more crystallised.

Cook may be one of those.

[Bossdog 2,002]

Some struggle to justify why they would delist Cook but, equally, you would struggle to justify your faith that he could a be a 2nd or 3rd tall in a flag winning team.

I have hope for him too but there are going to be players whose contracts will be up in the air until the outcome of FA and trade week is more crystallised.

Cook may be one of those.

I'm sure Geelong thought this about Tom Hawkins......4 years ago

[rpfc 28,779]

I'm sure Geelong thought this about Tom Hawkins......4 years ago

Yes, and we thought the same at some point with regard to Nick Smith and Luke Molan.

All talls need time, not all talls make it over time.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

I'm sure Geelong thought this about Tom Hawkins......4 years ago

Hawkins was and always been a massive unit and there was something to work with, he's as strong as an ox, unlike Cook who is massively underweight and needs to put on at least 10 kegs to be able to compete.

No comparison.

[Bossdog 2,002]

Hawkins was and always been a massive unit and there was something to work with, he's as strong as an ox, unlike Cook who is massively underweight and needs to put on at least 10 kegs to be able to compete.

No comparison.

Disagree Rob.......The kid couldn't mark....couldn't kick....and has just now learnt to use "his now" massive body

Cook can mark...can kick....just needs to get a bigger body......is now just 20 years old.......4 years younger.....

[rpfc 28,779]

Didn't Hawkins smash us in 2005?

Edit: Nah, 2007 and he only had 7 kicks but kicked 4.1.

Edited August 7, 2012 by rpfc

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Didn't Hawkins smash us in 2005?

Yep his first game.

[Range Rover 1,935]

Disagree Rob.......The kid couldn't mark....couldn't kick....and has just now learnt to use "his now" massive body

Cook can mark...can kick....just needs to get a bigger body......is now just 20 years old.......4 years younger.....

Hawkins was, is and will always be a big lump of a lad.

It was a massive punt to think that a skinny rake could miraculously morph into a pack bustling KPF.

[Bossdog 2,002]

Yep his first game.

2005...April Melb by 48pts.....Hawkins did not play

Sept 2005......Elim. final Geel by 55 pts.....Hawkins did not play

In fact began his afl career in 2007.....in his second game he kicked 4 goals against us in a 52 point win

[Bossdog 2,002]

So it has taken 5 years to forfill his potential......

[Dee Fan 3,247]

2005...April Melb by 48pts.....Hawkins did not play

Sept 2005......Elim. final Geel by 55 pts.....Hawkins did not play

In fact began his afl career in 2007.....in his second game he kicked 4 goals against us in a 52 point win

Sorry got the game wrong it was his second game not his first not a bad effort for a second game.

[Bossdog 2,002]

Sorry got the game wrong it was his second game not his first not a bad effort for a second game.

Cuthbertson says Hi....

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Cuthbertson says Hi....

He really kicked on didn't he; helped us to a win a flag.

[satyricon 267]

And so RR cannot resist, hence my opening comment, for everybody's info. also had a good chat with Lucas Cook himself, you have to remember he is tall so the weight is spread around, they are trying to get him to the early 90kg in the next few months, at the moment he is around 86, 87....so he is not 70kg to begin with.....

Edited August 7, 2012 by satyricon

[Bossdog 2,002]

Not trying to argue.....Just think the kid has a lot of talent ...That's all......I know he is skinny and I think that the FD is doing the right thing by not putting him in the side until he's ready......

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Not trying to argue.....Just think the kid has a lot of talent ...That's all......I know he is skinny and I think that the FD is doing the right thing by not putting him in the side until he's ready......

Nor am I it's just that I'm not convinced he has the toughness to play at the highest level.

[Disco Demons 92]

hawkins was considered overweight and unfit when he started at the cats. for a few years too.

Edited August 7, 2012 by disco_demon

[satyricon 267]

I suggest you read the review of the Casey game

Lucas Cook: Kicks 7, Handballs 2, Disposals 9, Marks 2, Tackles 3, Goals 2

Played on a physical opponent in Nick Duigan and whilst he was kept quiet for most of the day, Cooky stuck to the task and kicked two goals

Duigan was flying a month or so back, just had a dip in form so finds himself back in the VFL so Cook's opponent was not some young skinny kid. Kicked two goals so as a forward job done, it probably allowed Leroy Williams a bit more freedom with a lesser opponent