a club that was "about anything but football"

[Ouch! 2,034]

From The 'Age'

MICK Malthouse says Melbourne coach Mark Neeld has walked into a club that was previously ''about anything but football'' and thinks his former assistant is ''starting from scratch''.

Read more:

http://www.theage.co...l#ixzz1s9sXOH2M

That hurts to hear such an assessment, and whilst it might be no more useful than Leigh Matthews critiques of Jack Watts, it begs the question how on earth has this club just 'wallowed' around for the last... 4-5 years as it has. It's also a massive backflip from the comments that Malthouse made a couple of years ago where he said that Melbourne had the most exciting list in the competition, and this was a view shared by several people.

So, starting from scratch means what? starting from scratch with rebuilding a list? rebuilding the football department? rebuilding the confidence of the players that are in fact worth keeping? rebuilding the knowledge that these players have to play the game?

Thoughts anyone?

Edited April 16, 2012 by Oucher

[Sir Why You Little 34,557]

The club sold a false dawn 4-5 years ago, which is so sad, and makes me angry. As i said in another thread, if Neeld is making references to the supporter base during the press conference he has a fair idea how far back we are coming from.

I agree with Malthouse, he wants his deputy to succeed, they have obviously been in contact regularly.

They are comparing work places.

The MFC's was a shambles in comparison.

Too many years in the wilderness can do that.

[rjay 23,922]

From The 'Age'

MICK Malthouse says Melbourne coach Mark Neeld has walked into a club that was previously ''about anything but football'' and thinks his former assistant is ''starting from scratch''.

Read more:

http://www.theage.co...l#ixzz1s9sXOH2M

That hurts to hear such an assessment, and whilst it might be no more useful than Leigh Matthews critiques of Jack Watts, it begs the question how on earth has this club just 'wallowed' around for the last... 4-5 years as it has. It's also a massive backflip from the comments that Malthouse made a couple of years ago where he said that Melbourne had the most exciting list in the competition, and this was a view shared by several people.

So, starting from scratch means what? starting from scratch with rebuilding a list? rebuilding the football department? rebuilding the confidence of the players that are in fact worth keeping? rebuilding the knowledge that these players have to play the game?

Thoughts anyone?

The only constant is the administration, so it needs to be looked at very seriously. Questions about season 2011 were shut down at the AGM and in hindsight that was a mistake, by not addressing these issues, what ever they were we are in danger of repeating them.

[Sir Why You Little 34,557]

The only constant is the administration, so it needs to be looked at very seriously. Questions about season 2011 were shut down at the AGM and in hindsight that was a mistake, by not addressing these issues, what ever they were we are in danger of repeating them.

Yes or even making these issues worse. The broom still has more work.

[dee-luded 2,958]

From The 'Age'

MICK Malthouse says Melbourne coach Mark Neeld has walked into a club that was previously ''about anything but football'' and thinks his former assistant is ''starting from scratch''.

Read more:

http://www.theage.co...l#ixzz1s9sXOH2M

That hurts to hear such an assessment, and whilst it might be no more useful than Leigh Matthews critiques of Jack Watts, it begs the question how on earth has this club just 'wallowed' around for the last... 4-5 years as it has. It's also a massive backflip from the comments that Malthouse made a couple of years ago where he said that Melbourne had the most exciting list in the competition, and this was a view shared by several people.

So, starting from scratch means what? starting from scratch with rebuilding a list? rebuilding the football department? rebuilding the confidence of the players that are in fact worth keeping? rebuilding the knowledge that these players have to play the game?

Thoughts anyone?

He's not talking about the List.

He's talking about the culture, On & Off the Field.

The culture may be one of a self defeatist nature, and of self preservation, that has gone back generations. A self perpetuating culture, kept going by past era's.

[dee-luded 2,958]

The club sold a false dawn 4-5 years ago, which is so sad, and makes me angry. As i said in another thread, if Neeld is making references to the supporter base during the press conference he has a fair idea how far back we are coming from.

I agree with Malthouse, he wants his deputy to succeed, they have obviously been in contact regularly.

They are comparing work places.

The MFC's was a shambles in comparison.

Too many years in the wilderness can do that.

This is the Northern Stand culture I've been talking about WYL.

[Sir Why You Little 34,557]

This is the Northern Stand culture I've been talking about WYL.

Yes. I thought they had been weeded out when Jimmy stepped up. Looks like i was wrong.

IMick Malthouse wants this club to prosper. What he said is actually positive, as long as it is acted upon.

[The Chazz 4,077]

The club sold a false dawn 4-5 years ago, which is so sad, and makes me angry. As i said in another thread, if Neeld is making references to the supporter base during the press conference he has a fair idea how far back we are coming from.

I agree with Malthouse, he wants his deputy to succeed, they have obviously been in contact regularly.

They are comparing work places.

The MFC's was a shambles in comparison.

Too many years in the wilderness can do that.

It's a major concern WYL, and I admire that you continually put your hand in your pocket above and beyond what you, or any other supporter of this club should have needed to.

The concern for me is Neeld. Is he the right man to bring this team from wherever we currently are, to get us in to the Top 4, and ultimately, winning premierships? I don't know, he may be, he may not. A lot here have confidence in him, but there are so many aspects of this club where I have lost confidence, that Neeld, for me, is a risky investment.

From a heartbroken, zero confidence supporter like myself, I understand what he said in his presser the otehr day about the Melbourne supporters needing to stick together. I just can't buy it I'm sorry, not from a guy that hasn't had any experience in such a major task. This is very unfair of me I fully appreciate, but my feeling would be totally different if Malthouse was the one sitting up in the MFC polo fronting the media telling the supporters to hang in.

My fear/concern is that the job is too greater task for a first year coach, that even if we gave him 3-5 years to steer us in the right direction, that it is a strong possibility that from the commencement of the great rebuild (ie when Bailey took over), that around 9 or 10 years since then, we are still no better off. While it will no doubt sound negative, I'm just not willing to put myself in a position of false belief with this club at the moment. I'm sick of saying our premiership window will be open in 2 or 3 years time. I want some accountability, so put some due dates on it so we all know where we are heading. This famous Red & Blue Print has to have KPI's that need to be met in order for it to be effective, well, I wan't to be assured that the areas that aren't being met, because let's face it, there HAS to be areas, that those responsible are accountable for their actions, regardless of what level they are at.

I will continue to support the Melbourne Football Club. I invest a lot emotionally in this club (probably too much in the truth be known). I just have great concerns where we are heading, and who is driving us. If you call me "the sky is falling" person, well, sobeit, it's just where I stand at the present.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Yes. I thought they had been weeded out when Jimmy stepped up. Looks like i was wrong.

IMick Malthouse wants this club to prosper. What he said is actually positive, as long as it is acted upon.

Wyl, what do you mean, 'weeded out'? We are all part of the culture problem, it's the backslapping for doing Zilch.

It's the putting players ion a pedestal after doing bugger all.

Giving them great jobs or New cars. Elevating they're status before they've achieved anything.

We pamper them & rub shoulders making them hero's in their heads. like the Mortons, Bennells, Sylvias, etc..

It's our club that is shooting itself in the bloody foot. & we have been for a long long time.

But how do you tell someone, how wrong they've been doing the same thing, for over 40 years?

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Yes. I thought they had been weeded out when Jimmy stepped up. Looks like i was wrong.

IMick Malthouse wants this club to prosper. What he said is actually positive, as long as it is acted upon.

This is the culture that the new broom brought in 2008. Stynes/McLardy must share the responsibility for where we are at the moment. I am glad you realise it.

I could not disagree more about Malthouse's intentions. As MM has shown repeatedly he acts for MM.

His soundbites in the press dont provide blueprint for any progress.

His comments were made to protect a mate....Neeld.

And Neeld knows he will be held duly responsible. The players have in general been poor. But he does not escape the blowtorch for the fact that we look as though we have gone backwards.

[Sir Why You Little 34,557]

This is the culture that the new broom brought in 2008. Stynes/McLardy must share the responsibility for where we are at the moment. I am glad you realise it.

I could not disagree more about Malthouse's intentions. As MM has shown repeatedly he acts for MM.

His soundbites in the press dont provide blueprint for any progress.

His comments were made to protect a mate....Neeld.

And Neeld knows he will be held duly responsible. The players have in general been poor. But he does not escape the blowtorch for the fact that we look as though we have gone backwards.

Where did i say Neeld will escape a blow torch??

But who inside the MFC has the credentials to hold that same Blowtorch?? That is the crux of our problem.

There is no one in this club who has been involved with success. People actually leave to find it.

Concerning MM i think he would love to see Mark Neeld win a flag against the enemy.

[Sir Why You Little 34,557]

Wyl, what do you mean, 'weeded out'? We are all part of the culture problem, it's the backslapping for doing Zilch.

It's the putting players ion a pedestal after doing bugger all.

Giving them great jobs or New cars. Elevating they're status before they've achieved anything.

We pamper them & rub shoulders making them hero's in their heads. like the Mortons, Bennells, Sylvias, etc..

It's our club that is shooting itself in the bloody foot. & we have been for a long long time.

But how do you tell someone, how wrong they've been doing the same thing, for over 40 years?

You get the right people. Orherwise the club will die. The AFL has gone up some serious gears lately. If this club continues to over hype ourselves we will not be an AFL team into the future.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

But who inside the MFC has the credentials to hold that same Blowtorch?? That is the crux of our problem.

The current Board can and should do that. But over the past few years they have managed the FD poorly.

MMs effort is certainly trying to shield Neeld from the torch. MM would like whats good for MM.

[dee-luded 2,958]

You get the right people. Orherwise the club will die. The AFL has gone up some serious gears lately. If this club continues to over hype ourselves we will not be an AFL team into the future.

At least we're bringing successfull people in from the Outside, who are NOT Blinded by the way they've always perceived things to be. They're reality (old insiders) is the blindness itself... & the curse.

[dee-luded 2,958]

You get the right people. Orherwise the club will die. The AFL has gone up some serious gears lately. If this club continues to over hype ourselves we will not be an AFL team into the future.

I would do anything to get Cook to Melbourne.

His Insights & Experiences from a similar situation with the Cats, would be an incredible help to us. The Catters went thru similar type situations.

[rjay 23,922]

I would do anything to get Cook to Melbourne.

His Insights & Experiences from a similar situation with the Cats, would be an incredible help to us. The Catters went thru similar type situations.

I'm 100% with you there. Need to do a Carlton getting Swan from Collingwood.

[diesel 420]

I hope this doesn't deteriorate into yet another discussion about the list or the coach.

This is big picture. I don't read MM's comments as designed specifically to protect Neeld. I think the issues at the heart of MM's comments are probably tied into the fact that Melbourne had an under resourced FD which was in part (maybe even list management & game style) being managed at some level from the front office when the job of the front office should just really be to put everything in place and then be hands off except for 6 monthly or annual reviews of the people doing the jobs there.

I reckon if you asked MM what a football club is this is what he'd tell you. His comments I think are a point he's making directed at McGuire that you don't MEDDLE in the operation of a clubs FD as Ed did in getting his mate the coaching job there.

[dee-luded 2,958]

I'm 100% with you there. Need to do a Carlton getting Swan from Collingwood.

Our problems go back to the '60's.

We seem to brush off Ideas when they're raised about success, by saying we made the grand final in 2000, or we made it in 1988, or we went close in 199?....

The truth is we didn't SUCCEED. And were weren't consistent. The reason we didn't succeed? After all the hard work we let it slip away again?

It's the Club attitude/culture. It's not as obvious as the nose on your face, or we would have spotted it & fixed it with a plastic surgeon, wouldn't we?

NO, it's a subtle & subsurface one that appears benign but just undermines us gently year after year.

[frankie_d 1,407]

This is the Northern Stand culture I've been talking about WYL.

Interesting point, dee-luded.

By the Northern Stand do you mean the MCC Members' Stand?

I think I agree with you - the period of great success was when we had Jim Cardwell (hard-nosed tough administrator) and enough resources in Collins St to dominate an essentially amateur game.

Since then, the nouveau riche have risen to ascendancy, the game has become professional, and we look lovely in our blazers. When we get in a coach who couldn't care about the blazers (Northey, Daniher) we do well, but then we revert to type.

Stick with this (Neeld) guy - he's the MFC's hope.

*edit for Neeld

Edited April 16, 2012 by frankie_d

[Dr. Gonzo 22,485]

By the Northern Stand do you mean the MCC Members' Stand?

I think I agree with you - the period of great success was when we had Jim Cardwell (hard-nosed tough administrator) and enough resources in Collins St to dominate an essentially amateur game.

Along with Smith & Barassi, a triumverate of decidely "un-Melbourne like" personalities to counter the cucumber sandwiches and glass of wine types in the long room

[Guest José Mourinho]

My understanding is that the football club has been too under-resourced until this year, and the players were left to their own devices to too much of an extent.

The majority of the group being so young, they didn't have te experience of knowing how a professional footballer should behave, and the focus has wandered.

It sounds like babysitting, but these kids seriously needed supervision and a greater constant presence to demand their focus on football and the little things,

To enforce a professional routine so that it becomes habit.

We have had a lot of players who have acted like footy is their part time job, not their life.

This has greatly impacted development. Before you criticise Cale Morton, consider the environment he has been in, and consider why he has failed to develop?

He started well, but he hasn't really progressed beyond what he was when entering the club. He's possibly even regressed.

The adjustments are being made, and they will take time, and they will make a serious difference.

Give players like him and Bennell, etc some time in this enhanced environment before putting them in the recycling.

Edited April 16, 2012 by José Mourinho

[Sir Why You Little 34,557]

Our problems go back to the '60's.

We seem to brush off Ideas when they're raised about success, by saying we made the grand final in 2000, or we made it in 1988, or we went close in 199?....

The truth is we didn't SUCCEED. And were weren't consistent. The reason we didn't succeed? After all the hard work we let it slip away again?

It's the Club attitude/culture. It's not as obvious as the nose on your face, or we would have spotted it & fixed it with a plastic surgeon, wouldn't we?

NO, it's a subtle & subsurface one that appears benign but just undermines us gently year after year.

Yes i do not consider any of our finals campaigns a success. We got beaten.

Particularly 2000. I hate thinking about 2000. We were absolutely pulverized by Essendon, & they knew it before the game even started. Same as Hawthorn. This club is just happy to compete thus far. That was the essence of what Malthouse Neeld & probably Leigh Brown are alluding to.

[Guest Dr Who]

The truth hurts - deal with this as you must - This is very, very much big picture. This is not about "chopping" peoples heads off, this is all about finally making the changes to move forward ALL together.

Change or Die

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

This is the Northern Stand culture I've been talking about WYL.

Our problems go back to the '60's.

By the Northern Stand do you mean the MCC Members' Stand?

I think I agree with you - the period of great success was when we had Jim Cardwell (hard-nosed tough administrator) and enough resources in Collins St to dominate an essentially amateur game.

The MFC has been independent of the MCC for 30 years. The MCC now provide funding to the MFC and supports membership drives amongst its MCC members.None of the current MFC Board originate from the 60s aside from one or two having been born then. There livelihoods have originate in the era of the nouveau riche

The MCC has no position on the MFC Board and has no ownership or oversight of the MFC, yet it is being blamed for the problems.

FMD. Mindlessly harping back to the 60s is monkey a few people need to get off their backs if any headway is going to be made.

Since then, the nouveau riche have risen to ascendancy, the game has become professional, and we look lovely in our blazers. When we get in a coach who couldn't care about the blazers (Northey, Daniher) we do well, but then we revert to type.

And Bailey was big into blazers??? I dont think he was hyped at all.

[jumbo returns 6,488]

Would it be a good thing or a bad thing if Malthouse becomes more involved with this club??

Thoughts??