Dean Bailey, I hope you're watching

[Guest Rojik of the Arctic]

This year my doubts are more in the foreground. I'm not convinced Bailey is a "good teacher" nor a good game-day tactician nor a good motivator.

I am yet to see evidence of this too. We look like we are going backwards. The team seems to play without heart and I can't figure out what our plan is apart from hoping other teams have a bad day.

I understand that some things are just out of his control but I haven't seen anything special from the stuff that is. I reckon he has eight weeks to show us something that we can believe in or it'll be tanks for the memories.

[old dee 22,850]

I am yet to see evidence of this too. We look like we are going backwards. The team seems to play without heart and I can't figure out what our plan is apart from hoping other teams have a bad day.

I understand that some things are just out of his control but I haven't seen anything special from the stuff that is. I reckon he has eight weeks to show us something that we can believe in or it'll be tanks for the memories.

When his contract was extended by 1 year I thought

Someone is not sure if he is the guy.

Nothing since then has convinced me he should go beyond 2011

He has had a terrible run with injuries this year but whatever the reason very few coaches get the nod to continue with his win / loss ratio

It is not going to improve in the next month.

[Geddy Lee 582]

I didn't go to the Adelaide game and nor have I seen the replay, but I was told that we didn't really press. Moloney had a day out with 19 clearances, we had over 80 tackles and the ball was in our 50 more than any game in the last few years. You say they pressed, but having not seen it first hand in any other match I struggle with the concept that they did it well in one game when they haven't looked like doing it in any other. And when Todd Viney says preseason that they haven't spent a whole lot of time on gameplan I'm inclined to disbelieve you and your assertion that we successfully implemented a press. Jamar and Moloney's effectiveness together with a good day all round may have confused you a little.

We pressed.

They broke through it twice in the first half, and zero times in the second half.

[Guest Rojik of the Arctic]

When his contract was extended by 1 year I thought

Someone is not sure if he is the guy.

Nothing since then has convinced me he should go beyond 2011

He has had a terrible run with injuries this year but whatever the reason very few coaches get the nod to continue with his win / loss ratio

It is not going to improve in the next month.

I didn't mind the extension as I'm pretty damn sure it was his payment for the dirty job he did to get us those draft picks, but it is becoming pretty clear that he and his assistants are just not quite up to it.

[Hannabal 4]

We scored 14 goals from Adelaide turnovers compared with their 1. We had 85 tackles to their 65.

Just in case you can't bring yourself to watch the Adelaide replay.

They may have pressed a bit. There had been saturation media coverage highlighting our lack of pressing, so it's not surprising if they had a team focus of pushing up and keeping the ball in our forward 50, but I wouldn't get too carried away by the Adelaide result, woud you ? Though I hear Brisbane really rate them.

I don't have the replay Chuckles, so I'll have to take your expert word on it.

Snigger.

Edited May 30, 2011 by Hannabal

[daisycutter 28,508]

DC you have just saved me writing 9 lines, covered it beautifully.

I am smiling "$64K question"

Obviously that wasn't referring to any potential salary outcome LOL.

[Axis of Bob 10,213]

I don't know, Hannabal. Should we?

I'd like to hear your opinion. Not your take on Paul Roos' opinion, or Mike Sheahan's, or Jon Ralph's, or your brother's ..... what do you think.

I must say though that I'm flattered that you would take my opinion on whether or not we pressed against Adelaide over the opinion of those from whom you were "told that we didn't really press". I'm chuffed that I've moved up your opinion ladder.

Maybe, some day, you'll tell someone lower on the ladder what our opinion is on the Adelaide game.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I didn't go to the Adelaide game and nor have I seen the replay, but I was told that we didn't really press. Moloney had a day out with 19 clearances, we had over 80 tackles and the ball was in our 50 more than any game in the last few years. You say they pressed, but having not seen it first hand in any other match I struggle with the concept that they did it well in one game when they haven't looked like doing it in any other. And when Todd Viney says preseason that they haven't spent a whole lot of time on gameplan I'm inclined to disbelieve you and your assertion that we successfully implemented a press. Jamar and Moloney's effectiveness together with a good day all round may have confused you a little.

One of the big advantages for Melbourne that day was that Adelaide only kicked five behinds, therefore Melbourne only had to kick out five times that day. This is an area that Melbourne really struggles with and has done for over a decade.

[Hannabal 4]

Maybe, some day, you'll tell someone lower on the ladder what our opinion is on the Adelaide game.

What ???

I have an open mind on whether we pressed a bit, a lot, or not at all. Geddy Lee said we did, so I took his view on face value. As I said, I haven't seen the game. It certainly wouldn't have surprised me if we didn't as there's been no evidence in any of the matches I've seen.

You're an excitable sorta fella.

[Axis of Bob 10,213]

Should we take note that we pressed against Adelaide? Or do we simply say that our pressing doesn't count because Adelaide didn't play very well?

Does this show that we are, in fact trying to press, but just aren't implementing it well under heavy pressure?

Is there a reason why we aren't implementing it very well under pressure? May this possibly relate to our ability to win the footy and get it inside our forward 50 in the first place?

[timD 994]

Bob, are you suggesting that if we win the midfield, we look good and have a 'game plan'?

Outrageous!

[Hannabal 4]

Should we take note that we pressed against Adelaide? Or do we simply say that our pressing doesn't count because Adelaide didn't play very well?

Does this show that we are, in fact trying to press, but just aren't implementing it well under heavy pressure?

Is there a reason why we aren't implementing it very well under pressure? May this possibly relate to our ability to win the footy and get it inside our forward 50 in the first place?

Todd Viney said in an article he penned preseason "if we were an older team and in the premiership window, greater time would be spent on tactics and game-plan". Given the scrutiny they've been under all year about their gameplan I've got no doubt that they're trying to implement a press, but it won't be done to great effect in 2011.

The press isn't a structure that is like a tap and just turned on at will without practice. West Coast have taken two years to get to the point where they're well drilled and organised in its implementation. Dean has been caught short over the preseason and is now playing catch-up. But it's difficult to do it well without having had meaningful process.

What do you like about Dean and his coaching ? Is it the team's hardness ? Him playing plenty of kids ? What in particular makes you believe that he deserves an extension beyond his 4 years ? What convinces you that he has the ability deliver a flag ? I'm all ears.

Btw, I'm sure you realise that most of us who have lost faith in Bailey have been very measured when discussing his performance over his first 3 years. Most have supported his direction. But there comes a time when if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it probably is ducked. I won't lose sleep over the MFC making a premature call on Bailey. I'm more interested in getting a proven coach to try and take this group to the next step. If that's unfair on Dean - diddums.

[wmth 69]

Bob, are you suggesting that if we win the midfield, we look good and have a 'game plan'?

Outrageous!

Spot on. We fall to pieces if we don't win the middle. As soon as we don't the forward line leaves their post and ends up at half back as we press ourselves in own back half.

May as well just start the forwards in the backline.

At one point I saw Evans beckoning (i think) Jurrah to come further up, while the crowd was begging him to stay home. Clearly coaches instructions.

The forwards are relinquishing their advantage as forwards and there is zero structure. If I was a defender, I know exactly where I would want Liam Jurrah.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

Amazing how saying we'd spend greater time on that facet of our game, suddenly means we don't spend any or enough time on it.

2 different things.

[beelzebub 22,225]

I didn't mind the extension as I'm pretty damn sure it was his payment for the dirty job he did to get us those draft picks, but it is becoming pretty clear that he and his assistants are just not quite up to it.

That one year extension may prove to be one of the smartest things this club has done. In terms of timing: We'll have rid ourselves of most of the known cloggers at seasons end. One way or another most will have another season under their belts. The club will be loking to revitalise the FD after a thorough review. Baileys tenure times out., many other Football luminaries come into play.

So at end of '11 we shuffle the deck, discard a few, buy a few, reload going into 12.

I think the club knows what its going to do .

[Hannabal 4]

Amazing how saying we'd spend greater time on that facet of our game, suddenly means we don't spend any or enough time on it.

2 different things.

Who said that no time had been spent on gameplan ? Didn't you read Viney's quote ? He said that if they were in a premiership window more time would be spent on it.

You only had to attend the first few games to see that we didn't press. This part of the game has seen Melbourne greatly exposed early in the season. And for this Bailey wears the blame. He takes credit when it's deservedly due and conversely he cops the heat when his lack of foresight has been exposed.

Btw. you're that E34 (?) fella, aren't ya ? You just started posting and suddenly, like him, you live on here. You've got his annoying style.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

You're clearly complaining that not enough time has been spent on tactics and gameplan, but do you not think that Viney / Bailey's reasoning is sound?

That we have so many kids, it is more important that right now we concentrate on their basic development?

There are only so many hours in a day.

Would you prefer we spend as much time on tactics and gameplan as a top 4 contender?

That time has to come from somewhere and I'm sure it would be detrimental to the PD of our kids, which is what is really important in the long term.

What you're really frustrated with is our abundance of youth & inexperience, but you don't seem to realise it.

NB. I've been called a lot of different things on this forum.

I can safely say none of them are correct.

Does putting a strange label on someone please you in some way?

[beelzebub 22,225]

There are only so many hours in a day.

Would you prefer we spend as much time on tactics and gameplan as a top 4 contender?

That time has to come from somewhere and I'm sure it would be detrimental to the PD of our kids, which is what is really important in the long term.

The only way you'l lbecome one...is to think and act like one. As with much in life it comes from comprehending where you are and planning to be where you want to be.

If we DONT think like a top4 we'll never become one.

[Hannabal 4]

You're clearly complaining that not enough time has been spent on tactics and gameplan, but do you not think that Viney / Bailey's reasoning is sound?

That we have so many kids, it is more important that right now we concentrate on their basic development?

There are only so many hours in a day.

Would you prefer we spend as much time on tactics and gameplan as a top 4 contender?

That time has to come from somewhere and I'm sure it would be detrimental to the PD of our kids, which is what is really important in the long term.

What you're really frustrated with is our abundance of youth & inexperience, but you don't seem to realise it.

NB. I've been called a lot of different things on this forum.

I can safely say none of them are correct.

Does putting a strange label on someone please you in some way?

They've made a mistake and it's a mistake that will probably cost Bailey his job. It's one thing to focus on player development, but no player's development is helped by the scrutiny the club is now under. Or perhaps you think that a club that's devoid of confidence actually helps the development of its young players ?

Everyone knows that we have a young group and have been cruelled by injuries, but it's not a crutch I'm prepared to give Bailey. We were poor before many of these injuries and we weren't prepared for the style of footy that was going to be played in 2011. There's plenty of fine balances in footy and Bailey has got this balance wrong. We have a run and spread gameplan that hasn't been focussed nearly enough on defence. Bailey carries the can for that.

So you're saying that your not that E34 fella, or whatever his number is ? Your nose is growing.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

Yeah, you've got me.

I'm "E34", "KS", "Yze Magic", the devil and Dean Bailey's secret gay lover.

Honestly the 2 of you are boring.

"Hannabal", you seem to revel in MFC's current struggles, and in my opinion you add nothing of value to any of the arguments.

You seem to like kicking people when they are down.

And I can't take your opinion seriously when you admit to ignoring the most pertinent facts - youth & injuries.

I'm now adding you to my "ignore user" list, so don't expect a reply in future.

Sorry Thomo, but you're joining him.

Back on topic please?

We were poor before the injuries, yes.

We were poor for the 3 preceding years and more.

Not sure what makes you think we should be performing a lot better - did someone wave their magic wand without telling me?

[jabberwocky 2,301]

Yeah, you've got me.

I'm "E34", "KS", "Yze Magic", the devil and Dean Bailey's secret gay lover.

I'll take 1 and 5 if no-one else has got them

E34.....hmmmm

[beelzebub 22,225]

lol..he cant see you Thomo...he's waved his magic wand.... well some kinda wand

[Guest Artie Bucco]

I haven't put Thomo on there yet, but I find it incredible to even be asked such a thing.

No, I categorically have never worked for the MFC, nor any other AFL club or the AFL itself.

Satisfied?

[Real Demon 232]

Todd Viney said in an article he penned preseason "if we were an older team and in the premiership window, greater time would be spent on tactics and game-plan". Given the scrutiny they've been under all year about their gameplan I've got no doubt that they're trying to implement a press, but it won't be done to great effect in 2011.

The press isn't a structure that is like a tap and just turned on at will without practice. West Coast have taken two years to get to the point where they're well drilled and organised in its implementation. Dean has been caught short over the preseason and is now playing catch-up. But it's difficult to do it well without having had meaningful process.

What do you like about Dean and his coaching ? Is it the team's hardness ? Him playing plenty of kids ? What in particular makes you believe that he deserves an extension beyond his 4 years ? What convinces you that he has the ability deliver a flag ? I'm all ears.

Btw, I'm sure you realise that most of us who have lost faith in Bailey have been very measured when discussing his performance over his first 3 years. Most have supported his direction. But there comes a time when if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it probably is ducked. I won't lose sleep over the MFC making a premature call on Bailey. I'm more interested in getting a proven coach to try and take this group to the next step. If that's unfair on Dean - diddums.

Beautifully said Hannabal, right on the money!

[Range Rover 1,935]

I haven't put Thomo on there yet, but I find it incredible to even be asked such a thing.

No, I categorically have never worked for the MFC, nor any other AFL club or the AFL itself.

Satisfied?

And can you please categorically deny that you are having or have had "inappropriate dealings" with Dean Bailey?