SCHWAB ON SEN

[Freak 100]

a natural footballer usually understands the physical nature of the game. At this stage, Watts has not shown his ability to lay big hip and shoulders, run back with the flight of the ball or lay big tackles. He also often gets found out by trying to do too much when he gets the ball..something that you can get away with in basketball. So whilst the rest of his game seems natural, he seems to still be getting used to the physical aspect. Naitanui is so much more aggressive at the man and ball than Watts is...thats something that can't be denied.

[e25 5]

a natural footballer usually understands the physical nature of the game. At this stage, Watts has not shown his ability to lay big hip and shoulders, run back with the flight of the ball or lay big tackles. He also often gets found out by trying to do too much when he gets the ball..something that you can get away with in basketball. So whilst the rest of his game seems natural, he seems to still be getting used to the physical aspect. Naitanui is so much more aggressive at the man and ball than Watts is...thats something that can't be denied.

... out of necessity cos he's always chasing tails..?

sorry, couldn't resist

[Yencks 8]

also watts has basically stated that he wants to play for melbourne

natanui came out and said that hes glad both west coast and freo were bad this year, so he was likely to stay home

[dazzledavey36 49,550]

a natural footballer usually understands the physical nature of the game. At this stage, Watts has not shown his ability to lay big hip and shoulders, run back with the flight of the ball or lay big tackles. He also often gets found out by trying to do too much when he gets the ball..something that you can get away with in basketball. So whilst the rest of his game seems natural, he seems to still be getting used to the physical aspect. Naitanui is so much more aggressive at the man and ball than Watts is...thats something that can't be denied.

so your saying that becoz he is tougher then watts we shudn't pick him up?

well thats great! looks like im locked in for pick number 1

[Hannabal 4]

a natural footballer usually understands the physical nature of the game. At this stage, Watts has not shown his ability to lay big hip and shoulders, run back with the flight of the ball or lay big tackles. He also often gets found out by trying to do too much when he gets the ball..something that you can get away with in basketball. So whilst the rest of his game seems natural, he seems to still be getting used to the physical aspect. Naitanui is so much more aggressive at the man and ball than Watts is...thats something that can't be denied.

And you admit to seeing him only twice. And I reckon that's an exaggeration.

He only took up footy seriously this year. Many say he was the best junior basketballer in the country, which is why his footy was limited - not to metion he's bottom age.

"Big tackles" - wow.

[LeBron James 41]

Speak for yourself. I'll be inconsolable.

x2

[ickey_11 145]

what does it matter who MFC pick,if they are any good in 2/3 years Carlton will offer him a $1million a year and a job for his gf/wife at Visy stacking boxes.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

a natural footballer usually understands the physical nature of the game. At this stage, Watts has not shown his ability to lay big hip and shoulders, run back with the flight of the ball or lay big tackles. He also often gets found out by trying to do too much when he gets the ball..something that you can get away with in basketball. So whilst the rest of his game seems natural, he seems to still be getting used to the physical aspect. Naitanui is so much more aggressive at the man and ball than Watts is...thats something that can't be denied.

Ok... So you're saying NicNat is harder at it than Watts? Well I would say that while yes, he is hard at it, he HAS to be. If you take away his physicality, he has a high leap.... and that's about it. Perhaps a bit of pace too... Watts has a sticky pair of hands, pace on the lead, a leap of his own, likes the pack marks more, has a booming kick that's fluid in motion, turns on a dime, gets out of trouble well... and while he doesn't excel at the in and under he's FAR from soft, going on the footage we've seen.

If we're going to split hairs, I'd say Vickery shows more at the hard ball than either of these guys, is a ruckman, and can play... So why aren't we talking about him? When you do your sums, it's just a matter of preference in the end.

Personally I'd take Watts' class and all-round excellence in all the main areas over NicNat's leap and perceived hardness. We are in dire need of something resembling a safe bet, which is why I go for Watts, then Rich, then NicNat... But that's just me.

[Freak 100]

pace is okay? naitanui's pace is awesome. fastest ruckman ever recorded. you cant say naitanui would be bad if he didnt have his physicality, his leap or his great speed..because he does have all of those attributes. you dont hear me saying watts would be bad if he wasnt quick, couldnt mark and couldnt kick straight. what a silly argument u just made. are u on the 'ignore list'?

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,491]

If we're going for a 'safe bet' why wouldn't we select Daniel Rich? I've heard he's the most talented player in this year's draft.

Rich for me.

[Demons 32 235]

If we're going for a 'safe bet' why wouldn't we select Daniel Rich? I've heard he's the most talented player in this year's draft.

Rich for me.

The most talented player is Yarran, easily.

[w00dy 146]

sorry Freak, but you seem to have no idea whatsoever on a couple of things...

Watts is by no means a natural footballer either, he is a basketball player first, football player second.

he is not a basketballer first, footballer second... he was an elite basketballer but chose to pursue a football career... just because he was good at basketball doesn't mean he is not a a natural footballer, the two are not mutually exclusive...

the videos i've seen of Jack on youtube show he is very much a natural footballer... he knows how to read the flight of the ball, plucking marks from packs 3 or 4 deep... he is clearly a natural forward who knows how to win the ball... watch these two videos and tell me Jack Watts is not a natural forward in aussie rules football...

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wjuXc1SM-l8

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=nGzqCIRgJLw

a natural footballer usually understands the physical nature of the game. At this stage, Watts has not shown his ability to lay big hip and shoulders, run back with the flight of the ball or lay big tackles.

I completely disagree... I find more often that the more physical players, especially early on in their careers, are those who naturally have trouble winning the ball... they don't lead or present to the right places to get the ball, so they compensate for this by bringing a greater physical side to their game... I've got no doubt this is the case with Nick... He struggles to win the football the way a Dean Cox or Jeff White does, so he just chases it, and with his great speed he makes an impact this way... But he's going to need more strings to his bow at AFL level.

Further on in their careers players tend to develop the weaknesses in their game... Whether it be the physical side to their game, or their ability to find the footy, or their skills, whatever it may be... However it's much easier for a player to become more physical than it is to learn how to find the footy... Remember when Neita started becoming a lot more physical with his hit on Luke McCabe in '02. He increased the physical side of his game without much problem at all. On the other hand, look at John Meesen, still hasn't learned how to find the footy, after 3 or 4 years in the AFL system?

I have no doubt as he gets bigger and stronger, Jack will become a more physical and couragous footballer... However I have some doubt whether Natanui's football smarts will improve as much as they need to for him to realise his potential...

[w00dy 146]

oh, and after watching that first video tell me Jack Watts doesn't have a physical side to his game... watch from 1m 25 to 1m 46...

[Bails 0]

thanks for that VANLO

spot on.....

i think people (including the MFC by reports) mght be blinded by Natanui's appearance, leap, etc etc.....

he aint a footballer hes an athlete.. a very bloody good one admittedly!!

but we need a forward.... a fast strong marking leading forward that can kick goals!!!

we actually dont have one on the list.... Newton aka fluffy fingers is no good and robbo is old!!!

PJ is a very capabale ruckman and i think if we can get maybe another ruckman in the draft this yr Jamar will do for a couple more seasons.....

The reports on watts are outstanding both as a player and more importantly as a human.......

[Axis of Bob 10,431]

I really like Jack Watts as a footballer. He's fast, clever, good size, great hands, good kick, great mover and brilliant decision maker.

But he is definitely not a physical player. And it is definitely a concern, especially as a key forward that is expected to do the hard things such as crash packs and throw their body around. If he was of average toughness then he'd be number 1 pick in a flash, IMO. Will he improve as he gets bigger, or will he wilt when the opposition bodies get bigger? It's a tough question.

It's dangerous to base all of your judgement of these players on a few minute long youtube clips, although they do give people a taste of their style of football.

Now which of the 3 candidates can the Wizard of Oz fix:

The Lion, looking for courage,

The Scarecrow, looking for a brain, or

The Tinman, who is looking for a heart?

[e25 5]

I really like Jack Watts as a footballer. He's fast, clever, good size, great hands, good kick, great mover and brilliant decision maker.

But he is definitely not a physical player. And it is definitely a concern, especially as a key forward that is expected to do the hard things such as crash packs and throw their body around. If he was of average toughness then he'd be number 1 pick in a flash, IMO. Will he improve as he gets bigger, or will he wilt when the opposition bodies get bigger? It's a tough question.

It's dangerous to base all of your judgement of these players on a few minute long youtube clips, although they do give people a taste of their style of football.

Now which of the 3 candidates can the Wizard of Oz fix:

The Lion, looking for courage,

The Scarecrow, looking for a brain, or

The Tinman, who is looking for a heart?

That's a big call to make. From what I've seen he doesn't exactly shy away from contact.

[w00dy 146]

But he is definitely not a physical player. And it is definitely a concern, especially as a key forward that is expected to do the hard things such as crash packs and throw their body around.

as I said I feel this is a much easier aspect of the game to develop for a young player... the way he attacked one of those balls in those videos shows that he's not scared and that there is something to work with there... he's a lot less risky than Naitanui that's for sure...

for mine he has a lot of nick riewoldt about him... if he can become as couragous as Riewoldt, then we have a real player on our hands...

Now which of the 3 candidates can the Wizard of Oz fix:

The Lion, looking for courage,

The Scarecrow, looking for a brain, or

The Tinman, who is looking for a heart?

the Lion is the most likely to come off for me, not sure if the scarecrow will learn as much as he needs to...

[Hannabal 4]

But he is definitely not a physical player. And it is definitely a concern, especially as a key forward that is expected to do the hard things such as crash packs and throw their body around.

He's bottom age and only decided to play football over basketball 6 months ago. I've watched him 3 times live and I don't like soft players and his physicality wasn't a concern to me. There's a reason that so few KPP's go pick #1 and that's because they rarely dominate underage football due to their less than mature bodies. Even Carey and Longmire were traded by Sydney when they were promising juniors because no one expected the careers that followed. Riewoldt is the only KPP junior I can remember going #1.

Noel Blundell ran psycho motor testing at DC. They've done it differently since 2007 where they now pit a player against another player. Eventually it comes down to 2 players and a winner. There are numerous things that this test measures, but according to Blundell, one is definately their competitive urges. Whilst this test received less publicity, I was interested to know that Watts won this event. An important box that was partly ticked for me. Best player in the Carnival also was important. David Dickson talks of his concern at having Private School kids play in the Vic Metro team in Emma Quayles draft book. He says it's a real worry because the programmes they come from in the school system are very different. From a team structure and coaching expectation these kids are not at the level of the TAC kids. He finds it difficult to integrate them in a short period of time. So Watts winning the Larke Medal was even more impressive considering his football background.

I don't expect Watts to be a player in the J. Brown mould. I don't expect him to throw bodies around. Much like James Hird, he doesn't need to. In fact, I reckon he's too smart for that. But I also have no concerns about his courage or ability to put his body on the line and have seen him do so in the games I've watched. Taking a pack mark 4 deep when players are backing into you at CHF at a critical time in a match being a case in point. But I remember other examples of strong body contests at Casey.

Barry Richardson is quoted in the current Inside Football as saying that Watts is the best junior he's seen. He's been watching/playing football for 45 years and coached elite junior teams. I doubt he would have made such a statement if he thought Watts was soft. In fact, it's an unbelievable wrap.

I know that you consider your last reference very clever, especially as you've used it twice, but frankly, I find it snide in the extreme. But it's easy for amateur observers to pigeon hole players from limited knowledge. We all do it.

[Bails 0]

Watts a sandy boy

Oswald a Sandy Man

Oswald strangely decided to quit his post of two weeks as development coach for MFC

Something fishy is going on?

Perhaps Oswald disagreed with MFC on draft selcetions?? in particular number 1

[Stigga 25]

Hawthorn are on record stating that they do not select players that cannot kick.

We need to follow that path.

[e25 5]

Watts a sandy boy

Oswald a Sandy Man

Oswald strangely decided to quit his post of two weeks as development coach for MFC

Something fishy is going on?

Perhaps Oswald disagreed with MFC on draft selcetions?? in particular number 1

You're clutching at straws here, aren't you?

What makes you think a newly elected Personal Development Coach would have any say in recruitment?

Especially since he hasn't been in a position to scout players around the nation to properly gauge Watts' talent compared to the rest.

[Bails 0]

SHAFTY i think you will find that he has a good grasp on the talent coming through champion....... more than most i would suggest!!!!

and i do think he would be sitting in on meetings to discuss draft choices..... yes!!!

and i do think that perhaps that he didnt see eye to eye with the current MFC recruitin/football dept.... hence him leaving after two weeks.......

and i do know for a fact that he is a massive watts fan!!!

[LeBron James 41]

IMO the tough players are really the ones who dominate under 18 level. For Jack Watts to still be skinny like he is and of less then average toughness i just think it makes him look better.

Look at Tom Hawkins, completely dominated being already over 100 kilos at U18 level. Won the Larke Medal (like Watts).

When Watts puts on muscle he will become tougher really, simple as that.

[e25 5]

Hawthorn are on record stating that they do not select players that cannot kick.

We need to follow that path.

I'm not trying to pick holes in his game... but can Naitanui kick? I've no idea what sort of skills he has or his ability to hit a target, cos all i hear / see involves his ridiculous athleticism.

[e25 5]

SHAFTY i think you will find that he has a good grasp on the talent coming through champion....... more than most i would suggest!!!!

and i do think he would be sitting in on meetings to discuss draft choices..... yes!!!

and i do think that perhaps that he didnt see eye to eye with the current MFC recruitin/football dept.... hence him leaving after two weeks.......

and i do know for a fact that he is a massive watts fan!!!

I believe you in saying that he is a massive Watts fan if he has worked with him...

But seriously, if you're right & he takes a prima donna stance by resigning because it doesn't look like we'll draft his favourite player, then we are A LOT better off without him.

We want a coach for this role that will develop WHOMEVER we choose to play for this club, not someone who thinks they should be making the decisions.

FWIW i think you're completely wrong on this one.

There could be any number of reasons for him changing his mind, & i think personally that he was overwhelmed by what the position entailed, judging by how 'starstruck' he was at first.

Always a bad sign.