timD

Don't look at the list? Are you kidding? Seriously, you just must be. Midfielders are everywhere. It is just Melbourne who cannot get them. Finding three is like fishing at a trout farm. Try getting a forward line. Look at other teams - the bulldogs and sydney sold the farm to buy a forwardline. Neeld didn't. So he didn't get mids - he tried building a spine first. To suppose that he wasn't thinking mids is a damn big leap. We all give Roos the benefit of the that doubt that he is going to build a game plan gradually - I think neeld was building a list in the same way. Neeld got forwards when melbourne's currency was lowest and with no real reputation as a coach. Roos - giant rep, cannot land one big fish. So he got mids. Whoop de do. He's lost two structural pieces too. And overseen a team that could not get hogan fit after causing his injury aggravation. So Roos got three mids while losing two pieces of a spine and losing a third to chronic in jury at 19 years of age. I need a slow hand clap gif...

This happens all the time. The goddamn problem is episodic. It goes away. 20% of the time it goes away without treatment. While depression is a problem, let's not overstate it. It isn't schizophrenia FFS.

Don't look back Mitch. I got a whiff of badness when I heard about the retirement. I told myself to stop being such a cynic. Stop seeing odd things and instantly reading intent-to-deceive. Gotta listen to my gut more. We've been had. GNF was right about everything; just wrong about you. “It is curious that physical courage should be so common in the world and moral courage so rare.” Twain (so says the internet)

Neeld attracted a full forward and a centre-half forward. Roos got three unloved mids. Amid all the guff about "trading" and "knowing where the list was" blah blah blah we've done nothing. Lots of melbourne recruiting efforts have struggled to land big fish - neeld didn't. Roos has. And take one of vince or tyson off roos' list and my argument would be overwhelming.

I agree poita. Stinking off season. We still have a midfield that sucks and still lack disposal class off half back. Our ability to pick players and develop them is awful and we are relying on it improving... For all of Roos' charisma, Neeld had better success with trading. This club has a singular ability to be underwhelming.

Hey Ashe you've been missed. Most of the dislike about essendon is jealously. We've been so weak for so long and Essendon have been so good for so long (and bold, if not arrogant) that it naturally breeds envy. People cloak it in discussion about unbearable supporters, but really, it is just jealously, pure and simple. On the supplements thing, the bombers sought to gain an advantage by cheating. They looked for chemicals that had not been banned yet or were so experimental that benefits and risks were hard to ascertain. They did not care about consequences and actively attempted to play in the 'grey' zone...and if it was red, that was an "accident". There is nothing particularly unclear about it and the "complexity" is just pissing around about details. David Evans figured this out and tried to just tear the bandaid off before the damn thing had been stuck down. Hird offed him. Evans had the right strategy and would have seen everything cleaned up by now...and the pain would now have begun to fade. Now both clubs have a painful experience of character issues - at the top and poisoning everything downstream. PS Garlett is a steal.

...and that after 5 years on an AFL list, his running is still poor, he still burns teammates and has bad skills when at mod-high pace. But at least he rates himself.

There's no-one on this site that hasn't wished for that!

I agree, and all opinions are not created equal.

Depression and anxiety can and frequently do go hand in hand...but they don't always and personality x situation makes a huge difference in this.

I treat people with depression every day and have done so for a while now. I have heard in the media this idea that the only way to recover from depression is to leave the context in which it has arisen - to completely change one's environment. Let me guarantee everyone that this is obnoxiously stupid. If Mitch has been advised to do that - and his agent confirmed that he had - then he is being poorly treated to say the least. IF the advice is more nuanced, then I can understand it, to a point. What I would like to say is that much of the issue with depression is the internalised stuff - and changing environments may well do little to alter that. Depression is episodic. Most people recover. A significant proportion are vulnerable to relapse, but that can be managed too in many cases. Especially if you have the financial resources and supports that Mitch has. I've been curious from day one about this and nothing is reassuring me about this situation atm.

Jaded, I don't agree with this - you do choose your religion. You cannot choose race. Totally, fundamentally different. Religion is a belief - it is not genetic. And when you get into it, race isn't either but that is an argument for another day. The line on vilification is, with religion, murky IMO. I think Little Goffy got it right on this. Criticism is one thing; playing the prejudice game is another. It is simply an avoidable fact that people - religious people - have done and continue to do the most disgusting, appalling things imaginable inspired by faith. There are, of course, other motivators that are just part of human nature or cultural learning. However, religion has been a toxic influence around the world since verbal history began. You only have to look at Israel and Palestine to see the true horror of religious excuse making. When you think of the fear, death, murder, mayhem, torture, displacement, loss of identity, loss of future, loss of family....And you don't even need to 'pick a side'. Religion is a totally different beast to race. I cannot choose being caucasian (whatever that means). I chose to drop Catholicism. Having a go at someone because of a stereotype is demonstrating prejudice. No question. The problem arises where there is actual, reality-based evidence for elements of the stereotype. Then you demonstrate prejudice which, depending on the individual, may be accurate. The problem is it is generally not true - and all the other associated meaning aren't either - and labeling an entire group while being a [censored] about it is, in a a multi-culture, multi-race, multi-faith society, not on.

In a team game, where one individual annoys people, is precious, creates attention and derives dirty satisfaction from drama, I do not care a hoot what their footy skills are like. They create a management headache from day dot. We have neither the skill, team strength or culture to tolerate him. Goodness, we cannot even tolerate the solid under-performers we have, much less a big stage drama like Heretier. No.

The notion that the joke can be about paedophiles and that is ok is nothing short of bizarre. You can joke about something and, guess what, it does not make it ok or funny. Maybe you could joke about suicide. Or AIDS. Or Ebola. Or beheading. Just doesn't get funny. Put raping kids in the same basket. Not funny. Not 'lightened' by humor. And the perpetrators not further humiliated, either. Any attempt better be brilliant, because anything short of brilliant will just make it look like you are trivialising it...which is what the players ended up doing. Hey, perhaps if you forget there are people involved, then it makes it funny. Why don't you try that?

It is this sort of sentiment which convinces me that the human race is doomed. Effectively, the OP states "think less, think like me and she'll be right". If that isn't a recipe for an Andrew Bolt-like plunge into insufferable circular un-reasoning that leads only to death and fear, then I'll go 'he.

Bob, I think it is interesting that Roos speaks about agreeing with tanking but now seeing it as an error. I also think that he makes mistakes with his press conferences. My guess is that he is able to be folksy and effectively guarded when calm, but, it is harder when his emotions are 'up' - and after a game is one of those times. I think Neil Craig did that bit well last year. We stank on the w/e. We just stank. And I think everyone is sick of being inept. Of looking inept. God knows I am. And yet add two classy mids, one effective rebounding halfback and just one effective forward to this team and we could well be playing finals. And we don't kick low scores either. My one hope is that recruiting is actually better funded and has superior people in it with superior methods. Without that change, we are genuinely stuffed.

Finally, a real doctor! I've thought the same thing for many a year. Truth is, unless I see the class come in to the team, then I'll not believe we are capable of drafting or developing it. We have all the depth in the world and no damn class to put on top. You can talk of luck, but from my POV, you make your own luck. And we deserve to be here because of the sum total of decisions made at the club over a long time. IT is the thing that drives me to despair. We have done this to ourselves. So I'll wait to see the class we bring in. Traded or drafted. I'll see if we start to make our own luck. I wish I were hopeful. PS, I do find it interesting to see how well Bailey's record stacks up. Just makes me think, what might have happened if he had been as well-resourced as Neeld or Roos and not undermined from within...

At the MBC function last month, Jackson made the point that success will come, but it arrive after he has left the club and perhaps after Roos has too - certainly after he is no longer senior coach. That is how much needs to be done on just about every damn level. They are realistic about it - we are not. And why would we want to be - damned to several more seasons of utter tripe. Roos is right about the culture the playing group - they don't know how to win. They also have a class deficit which makes it all the harder to capitalise on effort when it is there. I can see why the club might want forwards too. One effective forward would change a lot about our results straight away.

I picked the lions with little doubt. We lack skill. We lack heart. We lack goalkickers. It is a combination that will see effort, when it exists, count for little. Nothing will change until the cattle changes. And that won't happen for a few years

He does not have to do anything of the sort. You determine how much confidence you have in him. He does not have to do a damn thing to inspire you. It is by his actions you shall know him...or that sort of thing. Example a = GNF. If he said we'll have a flag by 2015, I'd be placing bets now. He has earnt that by being consistent and getting hard-to-predict things right from a long way out. That is how you know what to believe.

Geelong beat us just by being in the right spots - by running into the right spots. We got killed because we had no idea where/how to run and could not organise clean disposal. It was not because of an inability to win our own footy.

I agree, but am mindful of Roos stating that the MFC must not rely on kids. I do wonder about whether Roos is happy to see kids develop the right way and not just use them for what they are immediately good at. Just a thought.

I think we don't want or need boyd...but we could help get a deal done and get what we need as part of the process. GWS and MFC have dealt well recently and it sets up potential to do the same again. As for the fuss about substantiating a rumor, we can all appreciate the need to keep identities confidential. Getting multiple independent sources (thanks BRFE) helps, and if we see evidence of movement with boyd, then we'll know a bit more about reliability of the OP. I remember rumors last year about Roos that sounded like madman's fantasy in early may...and look what happened.

IF frawley goes, it will expose our lack of back-up tall defenders terribly. I think we need to target someone from this group - maybe LRT from Sydney? Then use draft picks to get a couple of kids to develop at Casey. Leaves us top-end picks to use to draft one and trade for one mid. As LRT isn't getting much of a game, the prospect of just getting one should see him over the line. So then we throw bigbig money at a star or near-star mid to come across. Crazy money. That fixes the midfield, gets a tall back and then allows us to really concentrate on drafting and developing backmen - talls and running backs. I tink the forwardline will look after itself ATM.

How is it funny to suggest that players are going to struggle because of disturbed schoolgirls coming to training at a university during the day looking to have sexual relationships with them? It smears women generally ('types'), smears the players (that they'd be, as a group, out for illegal and amoral sex with a child), smears the Uni... The more subtle level is that the Uni is full of attractive girls that are going to be interested in rooting players and that the players are going to struggle with that. Logically, the players are in that environment, as much as it exists, already. We know that sexual universe for AFL players can be...different. training location really doesn't do much to influence that. So the premise that changing locations will somehow increase this is forehead-whacking daft. And it get's Kim's name wrong. So it is dumb, inaccurate and lacks humor. All in one or two sentences. H-H could not beat it.