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A few short notes from training: The boys had an extended warm-up for about an hour, consisting of laps and shuttle runs. They then moved into two exercises, with players moving quickly from one to the next. The drill was getting players to move the ball quickly in heavy traffic and not overuse it, but rather find the right option. This meant many players didn't get a touch for a while until they presented in the right spot and on the move. Neil Craig was essentially running these two drills. The full-ground session was essentially a game simulation, or a semi intra-club. The most interesting points were: * Dawes was plucking everything; * Viney was streaming across half-back picking up plenty of touches; * Toumpas got plenty of it in the middle and spent a notable amount of time talking to Rodan throughout the training; * Leigh Brown spent time with Tapscott and Tappy spent his entire time with the forward group; * Barry twice streamed down the wing, bouncing it several times. He seemed to blow up a little each time (as you would); * Sylvia looked leaner to me this year, and less top-heavy; * Watts seemed to roam from centre half-back to centre half-forward without going into the 50s. I know it's said every year, but he looked broader than he's been; * Davey looks like Ben Harper at the moment, and had it on a string playing entirely forward. Basically, they look great when there's no opposition! Let's hope they still look great once they throw a few opposition players into the mix.

Hi All. Sorry I haven't been around much in the last few months - busy with work and buying a house and moving etc. still in Darwin. I hope everyone had a good Xmas and New Year's and killed enough brain cells to forget the Demons of Old!!! Last year there were a few topics and issues brought up and questions raised about the club so I thought of no better way than for me to ask those questions to the club and give the feedback right here on Demonland. Answers are from Board members high up over dinner with a notepad! I hope I've asked the questions correctly. The questions in bold, response below, I tried to jot down every word so see how it goes. How long do the Dees intend on playing up here in Darwin? We are committed to playing for the next 2 years (2013 and 2014) under the current AFL NT government agreement. We hope to position ourselves as part of the new agreement in 2015 to ensure that we play two games per year in Darwin each year. How many Darwin/NT members do we have at the club in 2012? We had 160 members in NT in 2012, a number that we are hoping will grow. Is the club actively looking at building a strong membership here? We believe that the Territorians are very footy literate. They love their AFL and we need them to love the first AFL club. So we will be trying to build membership but understand that many NT residents already have teams. We hope that if we are up there enough they will come to see us as their local AFL club. Why hasn't the club made more of an effort to contact members whilst the Dees are up here? A few phone calls around could have had a lot of support for them at training, the closed sessions are a bit disappointing too, especially at late notice. Not all people have access to twitter & the website. We understand that it can be hard if you are not plugged into social media for the late changes. Some of the changes occurred due to ground availability and the timing of the NT season I think only the last training session at the Army Barracks was closed otherwise, the others were open. When we play in July, there will be a civic reception where all MFC members are invited (via email). Will the club look at chartering a plane from Melbourne for supporters for our home games and offer cheaper packages? Probably not, but we work with Travelworld in Melbourne to do specific packages for the game and we advertise these on our website. We also are working with NT Tourism on some exciting ideas for 2013 and beyond. Is the club looking at major sponsorship up here? Yes, we have had some serious conversations with a number of potential sponsors. Also, in response to the US Marines we had 220 of them come to last years game and expect more at our Round 17 game against Brisbane in July. We also have aligned our new cheer squad as the Demon Army and hope they will be part of it. Also on Darwin, I would like to bring up about the day in which we play our games up here. Normally, always on a Saturday night which is usually a good idea. Last year I think the crowd was 6700 roughly. I truly believe we would have had a better crowd had the game been on a Friday night. My reasons being its right in the middle of the Darwin spring racing carnival which is a very popular event up here, there would have been quite a few people who wouldn't have made an effort after a big day at the races. Also fishing and camping is an extremely popular past time up here with the majority of people doing it at this time of year due to the cooler weather, most people like myself would leave to go fishing/camping early Saturday morning, but if the game was on a Friday night I'm sure a lot of these people would turn up also. Id like to hear some feedback on this, maybe we could change it? (My Question) We are also aware of the issues of the timing and how busy Darwin is during the Dry as is AFLNT and the government. The fixture is the domain of the AFL but we would like to have it during NT school term Friday nights might be hard but we will take on board your insights when we put forward our requests to the AFL. My next question is about a Dees social club/bar: Is the club active about trying to find/buy/build one close to the MCG as we desperately need somewhere to go and even the players to come to which is close to our home ground. Preferably not Docklands as its too far away. We have 2 clubs Leighoak and Bentleigh Club and as far as I know we are not seeking any further pubs / clubs. We also have social areas for different types of members within the ground on a match day and have held some functions at AAMI Park after matches. But no, we arent looking at establishing anymore. There used to be a bar next to the Hilton is that still an option? Or near the Tigers' clubrooms? That has been sold. Membership: How many supporters do you estimate weve got out there as a whole? Approximately 157,000 - 160,000 What other areas are the club actively trying to grow and seek members? City of Casey, Australia's second largest growth corridor which has twice the population of NT . Also looking at migrant communities, who are new to Australia and new to football. How much of a crowd does it take to make a profit or break even when we hire the MCG Someone has told me about 30,000 - 35,000? It really depends on the mix of members but it can be anywhere between 27,000 and 30,000. Will there be opportunities to meet the players and go into the change rooms and after match functions next year? We always hold open training sessions prior to our game in Darwin and also the government reception is generally open to members as well- these are the best opportunities to meet players when were up there for the game. Anyway all the best guys/girls. Have a nice day, not long until the footy starts! Cheers, HG.

Enjoy. 01/02/2013 Linton Street Moorabbin : http://six6six.smugmug.com/Sports/MFC-Training-1-02-2013/27813243_jFbL9F#!i=2346768420&k=dFsLz3d&lb=1&s=A 28/01/2013 Goschs Paddock : http://six6six.smugmug.com/Sports/MFC-Training-2013-01-28/27800770_DqggvC#!i=2344500953&k=4dF2pVS&lb=1&s=A

Love how so many 'Landers bag out Caro and Pierik for unfounded rumours and lack of facts yet they apparently all know Jordan Gysberts training habbits.

Amazing conflating of the question 'Did we tank' with 'Was Caro's reporting fair'. You seem so keen to paint yourself as oppressed by the majority here that you will tack the 'lack of tolerance' line onto a minor disagreement that popped up. Many here, probably the majority of whom you complain, believe we tanked but don't deserve any special punishment and think Caro's reporting was the pits. Many others say we didn't tank because tanking is not properly defined, and think Caro's reporting was the pits. And other variants. A small number think we tanked and deserve punishment regardless of what other clubs may have done or what Caro writes. Some think Caro is generally a good reporter but her putting the boot into the MFC (and no other club) was disgraceful. Some think she is a crap reporter and her putting the boot into the MFC (and no other club) was disgraceful. A small number think she is great and MFC deserves all we get from her. And other variants. I see a divergence of views on this forum. Just because most posters take a certain position on something doesn't make it 'groupthink'. It could just happen to be the majority view. And that may even be correct on occasion. (And the abuse the minority sometimes unfortunately suffer from some in the majority is no worse than the abuse some in the minority throw at others.)

I have been to Darwin a few times mostly in the June - August period. weather is similar to Bali most of the year. But in those winter ( dry ) months it is great. 18-19 min. to 28 - 30 Max. and no humidity just great in my opinion. Darwin is good for 3 - 4 days as a tourist and further a field to Litchfield and Kakadu are very good National parks. Easy to spend a week up there. If you book ahead you can get lower airfares. The thing that astounds me is that one of our major sponsors is Webjet Why on earth is there not Charter / special deals organised by the Club to visit. 500 members from Vic up there for the game would surely be a big boost to the team. So far the MFC have been IMO total failures in this area. I am happy to keep playing in the NT, $700 000 a game is just what we need. But come on MFC / Webjet lift your game

If Pedersen turned out to be a great recruit I'm sure that pill wouldn't be that bitter after all.Here's hoping.

I liked your post 'dc' but reckon that 10 per quarter is a bit low. 15-20 would be more to my liking. If they're using 20 as a benchmark in the NAB Cup then that's probably a pointer to what could happen in the future. You're spot on with the congestion argument. Without the unlimited interchanges that we currently have, I can't see how that congestion could happen as frequently. Most people you speak to hate seeing all the players in one quarter of the ground. We've already seen a rule change of 'sorts' with regards to rotations. The coaches have exploited a situation in order to keep their players fresh. The new 'rule of thumb' is at least 150 rotations per team, per game. (roughly) The extra interchange was originally designed to help a team square the balance with regards to injuries. 4 interchange was never designed so that teams could have in excess of 150 - 160 rotations. The demands of the modern game have in some ways 'forced' the coaches to have more rotations. 2 and 2 helps get more positional play. Do we really want to see KPF's run up and down the ground all day? How many times do we see teams get hold of the ball in the backline and then have literally nowhere to go with the ball (other than to hold it up until the forwards go rushing back) . The 'Press' and the 'Flood' would have to become less frequent if rotations were capped (at a workable level)

Maybe you could go out to western China for say 10 years or so - where we can't reach with the internet and social media and drum up membership in person.

I see the Gysberts trade as one of Neeld's Moneyball plays. We needed Pedersen. He was more important to our needs than Gysberts, and Neeld went for it. I expect Gysberts may ultimately prove to be a pretty good pick up for North. Similarly I have reasonably high hopes for Pedersen at the Dees.

Approximately 157,000 - 160,000 supporters makes us one of the least supported clubs in the competition. That is our main danger as I see it going forward. Initiatives like the work being done in Casey will help but, as Captain Obvious would say, what we really need is sustained success on the field.

The heading of the article is entirely misleading and the substance of the article was based on an interview on SEN that I heard. Harvey didn't say anything about Gysberts that he wouldn't have said about Eric Wallace. Having seen Gysberts train over the years, not to mention his physique, I'd hardly call him a quality trainer. And it was amusing to hear Harvey talk about how professional Jacobs was just after touching on Gysberts. No-one could look like and run like Gysberts and be a hard working "professional". Also, it's pretty obvious that Gysberts was one of the players that didn't "buy in". How many times have you heard Jones and Trengove talk about players not buying in over the preseason ? Neeld got rid of them. It would be hardly unlikely that a player that didn't buy in, a player that played one AFL game last year and 14 at VFL level actually trained to his potential. Or anywhere near it. I think I can. I think I can. I think I can. I know I can.

Thanks for the training reports guys. Great read

The boys are flying.

Moloney- long servant who lost his way. Cracked the sads when dropped from the leadership group and went from leader on the field to finger pointer. Neeld gave him ample opportunity to prove himself and crack back into the team, and seeing as he couldn't with our "third world midfield" Moloney proved himself to be a spent force. Conclusion traded. Training habits don't come into it. Martin- tried in numerous positions around the field yet struggled to find a niche. Had one good season when Jamar went down but unless dominating ruck he ran around like a headless chook. Clearly added nothing to the team on game day. Traded. Training habits don't come into it. Gysberts- played 20 something games in two seasons. Had 2 stellar first hit outs where named best on ground in debut against the force which is Geelong. Massive potential as an extractor and possession accumulator in a team that was SCREAMING out for midfield talent. One must deduce from that that there was a problem with his attitude. Therefore poor trainer. You get traded from a club for a myriad of reasons. Moloney and Martin were traded because they didn't fit into the team. There was room for a player of Gysberts ilk yet he was traded. What do you make of that Stuie? And don't tell me we traded out a potential 200 gamer midfield gem for a VFL hardened ruck CHF linkman because Neeld values consistent B graders over potential A graders. Must be application. But please tell me how Gysberts was a hard trainer because you knew him.

I could handle Martin, Rivers, Petterd, Bennell and even Moloney and Morton excelling at their respective clubs. But Gysberts turning into a gun at North would be a hard pill to swallow. It would [censored] me off immensely, actually.

Nobody is denying what happened In 2008-09 Baghdad. Just the way Wilson wrote about it. Big difference.

i think you are right on the money here Macca.

Don't worry Demonfan26, if it goes to litigation The Fink will ensure that Tezza Wallace, Libba - the whole roll-call of anyone and everyone who's ever ben remotely connected to 'tanking' - are dragged into proceedings by any means necessary. It will get ugly.

etihad stadium has fast tracked the 2 tiered ladder we are now staring at as a reality. Of the bottom clubs i believe the MFC has the only chance of rising because our home is the MCG. If we had been shunted by Jackson & co around 2000 to Colonial Stadium the MFC would be dead by now. Nought and Footscray are walking corpses at this stage.

Well, he was trusted enough to be put in charge when the Bloated One went to London... I don't think he has been put aside specifically because of the inquiry - but to start an investigation with only one palatable conclusion (due to our licences being under threat), after the head of the AFL has consistently waved away any concern with tanking didn't do him any favours and probably expedited the move to Lil Gil as the heir apparent.

I agree. A training report shouldn't be derailed. Once it was though...

Hope the same applies on match days as well.

The other thing I found interesting (and personally I think it differs somewhat to last year) is that the players seemed to know the drills so well, despite there being some pretty confusing drills with bibs going everywhere, players swapping on and off the ground so quickly etc. You got a real feeling that they understood what looked from the outside to be pretty 'busy' drills. The boys were there in the St Kilda rooms 2 hours before they were on the ground, so I dare say the off-field instructions would be sinking in.

Well I would be the happiest bloke around if Davey can get it back together. In fact it would be a comeback of almost Lazarus proportions because his form AND attitude over the past two have stunk. Yes he has had some minor injuries but he has thrown in the towel on too many occasions mid-game. If he does I will take my hat off to him as it appears he has upped his workrate bigtime at training

OMG get a room you two, lol So I'm guessing that's a No on a Training Report, Anyone...Anyone...Anyone.

Anyways, mods do your thing, this is meant to be a training thread... Let's just leave it at these points: 1) Sloonie thinks Dom Barry is no good 2) Sloonie knows all the inner workings and feelings of all current and former MFC players 3) Sloonie thinks Dustin Fletcher is only any good because he has a long reach

Welcome to Demonland haha.... We're already off on about the 3rd tangent...

A training report thread without a training report?

I have no idea what point you are trying to make. Our gripe with Caro and Pierik is the way they go about denigrating the club. Where as Gysberts training the house down or not is inconsequential. Fact is he didn't do it with us, and the last thing I care about is how he is training with the enemy. Can we trade you to North? I think it will be a good fit- nobody cares about them either. Ignore me already.

Please get some perspective.'Landers make no apologies for being one-eyed and self serving and contribute in our spare time to vent. Reporters however are paid professionals who once upon a time claimed, amongst other things, high factual integrity, balance, fairness and accuracy as key principles of their work. Sports reporters may need to be more in the business of rumor mongering for their own self perpetuation but this is exactly what many of us find so distateful given the potential damaging consequences on groups and individuals.

Couldn't care less about Jordan Gysberts. Couldn't be arsed pulling his finger out for us, why should I wish him well for someone else. North at that. We spent a first round pick on him and got diddly squat in return- now he's "training the house down," I take this as an insult. Why couldn't he do it with us? Good riddance.

I cant follow the logic - Caro and others have been out there on this subject in a very inflammatory way. You claim that they may know better than we who just read the papers. But what Caro and the like have published ( albeit full of inaccuracies) to date doesnt add up to a hill of beans. Unless the likes of Caro are holding back on information which makes no sense to me as she has been willing to publish stuff that isnt factual, then it is fair for us to make the judgement on what she has published that club hasnt broken rules or accepted practices as they stand.

A player to test positive for tanking

Actually Baghdad - that's not what I'm saying. Simplistic, albeit distorted, analysis from you once again. I can see it's a convenient approach for you to take, but it's not one founded in a sound methodology. Lazy stuff. In fairness, I accidentally deleted two paragraphs from my original post, which I've since reinserted. But I'll spell it out simply once again. You cannot simply compare the results from 2011 and 2012 because it's not comparing 'like with like'. 2011 was a 'finals' year. 2012 was a 'completely rebuild and wholly transform the entire football department/player group' year. The evidence reflects this. 1. 2011 - (Bailey's fourth year with Bailey's list) objectively speaking, a woeful year, which included some of the worst losses I've ever observed. Despite some big wins against flaky interstate teams, we got absolutely hammered by most decent sides, including suffering the worst loss of any AFL club in almost 30 years. At the commencement of the season, this was a 'finals' year - it was Bailey's fourth year at the helm, it was his list and the blue print was now for finals. We came 13th out of 17 teams. 2. 2012 - (Neeld's first year with Bailey's list) Neeld came into a very weak club which, through no fault of his own, was getting hammered from literally every angle: the 'lack of process' of his appointment was ridiculed, Jim Stynes passed away, he was accused of racism, senior players went feral, the 'tanking' debate (a remnant of the Bailey years, not his) was enlivened etc. He also inherited a bag of rotten fruit to deal with in terms of the list: it was not balanced, it lacked the requisite professionalism and fitness, there was a leadership vacuum, it lacked hardness, and the game plan was, in his view, all wrong - in short, it could not be relied upon to consistently win big games. None of this was his doing. Yet, he stated - I will change all of this - fundamentally, but it will take time. He then sought to turn everything on its head. Notwithstanding this, you seek to compare the results from 2011 against 2012. On any construction, that's completely ridiculous and as unsustainable as Bailey's game plan. 3. 2013 - (Neeld's first year with kind of Neeld's list) The season hasn't yet commenced, but Neeld has been ruthless with the structure of the list, the discipline and approach required of the players, the training regime, the leadership group, the culture of the group. This is obvious and it cannot be seriously contended otherwise. Whether it will work, who knows. But, the signs at this point are far more promising than previously - not necessarily for terrific results in 2013, but for improved performances in 2013 (relative to 2011), followed hopefully by improved ladder positions in 2014 and beyond. Why? Because Neeld has focussed on the underlying fundamentals. So, will I be saying Neeld is a success this year if we consistently get belted by only 12 goals each week, rather than 30 goals as you say? Well, no. It's you that wants to take the '186 benchmark' to a wholly ridiculous end, such is your way. I merely reference the 186 point loss on 30 July 2011 as indicia of a list/player group that was clearly in a hopeless state and, at that point in time, I literally could not see ANY light at the end of the tunnel. As at 1 Feb 2013, I no longer have that feeling - perhaps I'm deluded - but I suspect not. And I blame Neeld for making the much needed changes to get this list into a more decent state. I don't mind if you disagree with this. In fact, I don't really give a stuff if you do. BUT I do mind if you misrepresent my position through, for instance, the inane act of pulling definitions of words off the internet and posting it as some kind of argument in response.

Now come on angry, don't be silly, Sloonie gets personal email updates from Mark Neeld about every players training standards and attitude so she would know better than the rest of us.

Hahahaha.... you're wrecking your own points Sloonie.... So obviously you HAVEN'T seen Dom train, and therefore have no idea (as usual) what you're talking about. Dom Barry will play games for us this year. You're changing your criteria now Sloonie, you just said Dom was too skinny for AFL. As for the third point, you clearly didn't understand it to being with.... Struggletown aren't you?

So what you're telling me is you don't have your copy of the email Mark Neeld sent you about Gysberts' attitude and training habits? But then how could you possibly know about..... Ohhhh wait, I get it, you don't. Nice article though Caro Jnr.

1) Have you even bothered to watch him at training? He'll play games this year. 2) Dustin Fletcher has had a good career for a skinny bloke 3) So you think we should only draft players over 22? You know, so they have the body to become a regular?

Comprehension isn't your strong point is it Sloonie... YOU brought up about not trading someone who "had a dip at training", so I gave you two examples of players who trained hard and were still traded. You then backed up my point in your post without even realizing it. You try and say it's "quite obvious" what Neeld is on about yet you don't seem to understand what that is... He's ditching the old "talent first" philosophy and getting players for specific roles, this means that even a player doing nothing wrong as such might be traded for the good of team balance. And as for your conclusion of "obviously something was wrong with his application", again I ask you to provide facts instead of rumour, as I told you I know directly from him he was working very hard.

Why would you think Barry is a gamble? I certainly don't.

Moloney was a hard trainer, Martin too.... It's not ALL about training, some of it is about Neeld wanting specific types for specific roles. But if you have your email from Mark there about how Gysberts trains then feel free to forward it to me.....

I liked Gysberts, know him through a mutual friend and knew he was working hard and had a MASSIVE amount of talent... But my impression with the Gys/Pedo trade was that it was a very "Neeld" type decision, ie- trade a guy away who is a gamble, might be a superstar might not make it, for a guy who won't be a superstar, but will be a consistent, solid contributor. At the stage we're at now and with what we're trying to do i think it was a smart move albeit a calculated risk.

Just like to know where you got your "facts" about how Gysberts "couldn't be arsed pulling his finger out for us"?

It's called debate, Bob. I love the way you try to foreclose on debate with this 'groupthink' category, making anyone who might want to quibble with Maurie hesitate or not bother lest they be counted part of some gang. And this isn't the first time you've done so, even if it was by some other name. If half a dozen or so people politely arguing with Maurie constitutes 'groupthink' I suspect I'd prefer that to your particular demagoguery, which makes of you a perpetual majority of one.

See this is the shame - you are either unaware of what she initially claimed or you don't realise how much she got wrong. She said that CC 'threatened' staff at a "code named"(1) meeting 'specifically called to discuss tanking the season' (2). (1) Caroline didn't know, nor care to inquire that the 'code name' was actually the nickname given to the shed at the old juntion that housed the meeting - not the meeting itself. (2) Caroline didn't know, or care to inquire that the 'specific tanking meeting' was a regular Match Committee meeting. These myths are out in the ether now and I can tell you they are wrong and that Caroline will never be right about these 'facts'. I guess it doesn't matter when the footy world (and some Dees fans evidently) think they are truth.

Was James O'Dea in the vicinity?

Never heard of it.

I refer you to the Wake in Fright thread, you could do a lot worse than get along to see this great film. Also I would recommend Not Quite Hollywood as a great introduction to the Australian Film industry. I realise that I am starting to sound like a Aussie Film zealot but they are great films in their own right.