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PREGAME: Rd 21 vs Western Bulldogs

Demonland
Demonland
in Melbourne Demons

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2 hours ago, No10 said:

So I don’t love the idea of no Windsor but I trust Hunter can deliver enough

Right at the moment I wouldn't trust Hunter to deliver a newspaper.

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    We are going to get hammered. Doggies are looking ominous at the moment.

     
    44 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

     

    It's not a negative if the club misses out this year. I see huge positives in it if anything. 

    It certainly won't be the end of the world to miss out on finals, nor will it stop us from competing next year, but what would be a massive negative is for the club to simply give up trying to make finals, while it is still mathematically possible.

    That is not how you build a winning culture. Not to mention that making finals is also of massive importance to the club's revenue and commercial viability. 

    We are no longer in our tanking area, and I trust JT to be able to get us a good player whether he has pick 7 or 10 or 12. 

    There is no doubt that we 'lucked' out in 2019 by bottoming out due to injuries and were able to get LJ, Kosi and Rivers, but we tried really hard to make finals in 2020 and just missed out. We didn't go on to win in 2021 because we decided to stop trying in 2020. We were a whisker away from making the 8, and we are now as well. 

    In a competition where I couldn't tell you who wins the flag this year, there is still everything to play for and we have to keep trying to win every game. 

     

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    6 minutes ago, Demonland said:

     

    I swear Tom Morris lives rent free in hospital dumpsters. 

    Is it really necessary for you to disclose personal medical information Tom? Like are we all better off for knowing why Goody was in hospital? 

    I hate that man.

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    The Dogs are in great form but quite a few clubs have had big let downs after a 5-day break. Hopefully Gawn is fit enough to play.

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    IN: Non-Tall Sub
    OUT: Tall Sub

    7 minutes ago, Little Richard said:

    We are going to get hammered. Doggies are looking ominous at the moment.

    Dogs are flying, no denying that.

    Everyone was saying this against the Lions a few weeks ago and we should have won that one. Personally I feel we are at our most dangerous when everyone writes us off, including our own. 
     

    Edited by Dee Zephyr

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    19 minutes ago, Clintosaurus said:

    Finals always better than no finals. There are commercial benefits that have to be considered. A loss this week makes it basically mathematical given the percentage difference but I want us going full pelt until Round 24. If we finish 13th then so be it.

    Excellent point.  Lets not forget the pall that the tanking era left our club under in regards to culture and performance.  We have to play every game to win.

    This season has been very tough for us from the start.  We lost Smith, then Clarrie went off the rails, then we lost Brayshaw.  All 3 would have been in the starting 18 this year.  Why we lost two of them is probably up for discussion. 

    Where in the world is Charlie Spargo?

    We've had a really tough draw; lots of travel and 5 day breaks.

    Petty had an interrupted pre season while Lever, Salem and Bowey have been injured and down on form (not so much Lever).

    To Goody's credit, he bit the bullet after "The Malice in The Alice" and played the kids.  Lots of positives coming from AMW, Disco, Kolt & Windsor (who was already in).  McVee, JVR (especially) & Chandler also looking good.

    Pup and Jeffo are two for the future, as are Sestan and Verrell.

    Rivers has been awesome to watch in the middle and Nibbler has really stepped up this year too.

    We've had the normal older and mid-tier players (Sparrow, Tommo, B Brown, Hunter, Billings etc) fall away or not be good enough. Milkshakes output has dropped, but thats to be expected.  Fritta has been very disappointing despite kicking over 35 goals.

    It seems like Woey or Laurie aren't up to AFL level either, which is a shame but Im happy to be proven wrong.

    Jeez, I really went sideways here.  In all, Id like to see:

    IN (any of): Sparrow (if he's learned his lesson), Disco (starting), Howes, Hore

    OUT: Woey (to Sub), Laurie, Billings, Bowey

    For those wanting Kolt in, he may still be out with concussion protocols.

    Jeffo, Pup, Sestan and Verrell all aren't ready.

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    13 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

    It certainly won't be the end of the world to miss out on finals, nor will it stop us from competing next year, but what would be a massive negative is for the club to simply give up trying to make finals, while it is still mathematically possible.

    That is not how you build a winning culture. Not to mention that making finals is also of massive importance to the club's revenue and commercial viability. 

    We are no longer in our tanking area, and I trust JT to be able to get us a good player whether he has pick 7 or 10 or 12. 

    There is no doubt that we 'lucked' out in 2019 by bottoming out due to injuries and were able to get LJ, Kosi and Rivers, but we tried really hard to make finals in 2020 and just missed out. We didn't go on to win in 2021 because we decided to stop trying in 2020. We were a whisker away from making the 8, and we are now as well. 

    In a competition where I couldn't tell you who wins the flag this year, there is still everything to play for and we have to keep trying to win every game. 

     

    The club certainly won't give up and their mindset will be different to us supporters.

    But unfortunately the reality and realistic point of view is that we pretty much have to win all 4 games with a higher percentage. I can't see that happening.

    On form alone we are no way near a top 8 side. It's hard to go past Hawthorn and the doggies.

    I am satisfied where we now sit. With all the issues the club has faced this year it was always going to be a grind. This isn't about accepting a loser type mentality but more so I think it really has taken a toll and with the last few years the way it'd panned out I think a good reset is needed within the club.

    • Like 6

    Dog's are in great form but we've been living in their heads since 2021. Last 2 times we've faced them we've smashed them to bits. Reckon it'll be a close game that could go either way. 

    Out: Billings, Bowey 
    In: Sparrow, Hore 

    1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

    Nathan Jones in a Shane Crawford podcast openly stated that missing out in 2020 finals series was what set up the 2021 premiership. 

    Whilst the club just missed out, he explained that that they knew that they had the list and belief capable of contending the following year. There was good exposure of games into first year kids in Rivers, Pickett and Jackson which also helped 

    Jones also stated tha missing out on the finals forced the club into refining a few little things here and there, and then set themselves up for a huge pre season

    It's not a negative if the club misses out this year. I see huge positives in it if anything. 

    Perhaps missing out again on finals will augment some real change, to assist a set-up for finals to come. Your comment inspires some positivism, after all. 

    18 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

    The club certainly won't give up and their mindset will be different to us supporters.

    But unfortunately the reality and realistic point of view is that we pretty much have to win all 4 games with a higher percentage. I can't see that happening.

    On form alone we are no way near a top 8 side. It's hard to go past Hawthorn and the doggies.

    I am satisfied where we now sit. With all the issues the club has faced this year it was always going to be a grind. This isn't about accepting a loser type mentality but more so I think it really has taken a toll and with the last few years the way it'd panned out I think a good reset is needed within the club.

    3 wins will probably get us there. But I think this week is must win.

    9 minutes ago, Smokey said:

    Dog's are in great form but we've been living in their heads since 2021. Last 2 times we've faced them we've smashed them to bits. Reckon it'll be a close game that could go either way. 

    Out: Billings, Bowey 
    In: Sparrow, Hore 

    Not sure we can do without Bowie, perhaps we should just hope for an increase in his form and better team support. At present, he is called upon to out-mark, out-tackle and out-reach many opposition talls and rather talls, which is too much for anyone to expect without that 'defensive support' that is definitely required. Hibberd, Rivers and Sparrow - for one reason or the other - are no longer there. Certainly, their backline assistance and that of Salem are somewhat missed. 

     

    20 hours ago, old55 said:

    We need to give Laurie, Woey and AMW some continuity in the seniors.

    Hunter for Billings - neither are the future but we're playing enough youth.

    Petty played well again, he's had a good month. TMac has had a very good season and Hogan is a very good player but I wouldn't be surprised if Tom's last quarter horrors tipped him over the edge to retirement. One of Petty and Disco will play back next year and one will play forward until Jefferson hopefully establishes himself and they can both play back when May retires.

    Laurie yes, Woey maybe, AMW gosh no. If he is to stay in the side they should chuck him forward, he’s a mile off down back. 

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    3 hours ago, rjay said:

    I've believed for most of this season that we need to reset the list.

    The talk of making finals this year, it's not happening. Any chance went out the window with Trac's injury & probably earlier with Gus' s retirement.

    Reset with a decent draft hand, good trade period & go again in 2025.

     

    ...If only... radical and minor shifts, changes and methods overdue.

    7 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

    he’s a mile off down back. 

    True, yet AMW has the pace, strength, attitude and gumption to work the forward line opportunities. Better than Spargs, for example. 

    1 hour ago, Jaded No More said:

    I swear Tom Morris lives rent free in hospital dumpsters. 

    Is it really necessary for you to disclose personal medical information Tom? Like are we all better off for knowing why Goody was in hospital? 

    I hate that man.

    I had this infection in my leg it’s not great as it spread & was out of action for 4-6 weeks

    • Haha 1
    20 hours ago, old55 said:

    We need to give Laurie, Woey and AMW some continuity in the seniors.

    Hunter for Billings - neither are the future but we're playing enough youth.

    Petty played well again, he's had a good month. TMac has had a very good season and Hogan is a very good player but I wouldn't be surprised if Tom's last quarter horrors tipped him over the edge to retirement. One of Petty and Disco will play back next year and one will play forward until Jefferson hopefully establishes himself and they can both play back when May retires.

    This is it. Agreed.

    I hope he goes again, but I think Petty would be a great replacement.

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    15 hours ago, binman said:

    What is up with people's comprehension?

    You have managed to miscomprehend the same post twice.

    Repeat after me:

    Of course the odds are against. I wasn't arguing otherwise.

    A great man in a Galaxy far, far away once said - "Never tell me the odds"

     

    • Haha 1

    4 hours ago, monoccular said:

    By giving Windsor a rest, with probably but not certainly only 4 games to go, do you mean not play him at all?  Why?    VFL is not a rest. 

    It might just be Windsor for Hunter. Seriously.

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    4 hours ago, middleagedemon said:

    Haha. Jeez Louise, from the poster who consistently talks down those who 'play the man'. 

    I would have thought demonland's favourite son might be better than that!

    As far as this season goes and the weekly commentary you provide on the state of our side, list, game-plan etc, it's fair to say that you're happy to move the goal posts depending on the result! Which of course keeps most happy on this site, as nobody wants to believe in a cup half empty. 

    But if I may, whilst I agree Goody and co may want to fight nail and tooth to make the 8, I'm not sure the positives outweigh the negatives given the importance of bringing in quality high-end picks especially before the Tassie draft concessions hit.

    Do people think we'd have won the 21 flag without the help of our bumper draft of Jackson, Pickett and Rivers? Do you? 

    The thing about being glass half full all the time is that you end up painting over cracks, constantly. And a big part of why your views are so popular around here is because they make like-minded supporters 'feel good'. 

    But hopefully reality has set in a bit and supporters can see with their own eyes that we do have fundemental flaws in our game plan, list, method and that coaches are open to criticism. And that losing in straight sets is not just down to inmacuracy on the night and/or injuries, umpires, blah blah blah. And that our team isn't actually as great as many think? And that Van Rooyen might not me 'the' best young key forward in the game. He might be a good one though? 

    Btw, do you still think we're "tracking exactly as we should be"? 

     

    There are those on here who do say some outlandishly negative [censored] on gameday threads etc, but those of us who have had strong views on club when we've dished up some absolute rubbish have been scoffed at from you and your merry brigade. But now, it looks like we were right all along. 

    These cracks keep getting bigger, but your goal posts keep moving. Which is interesting. 

    For the sake of longevity at the top whilst we have Gawn, May, Lever, Viney for the next couple of years, I think it'd bode well for us to finish outside the 8 this year to have another big crack at the draft and whilst making sure we absolutely nail FA/trade period and bring some a couple of fresh and highly respected assistant coaches to challenge this group that at times look completely uninspired and uninterested in following Godwin's message. 

    You do realise this is the tanking philosophy, right?

    I think we can go hardcore and still not make it. 

    And if we do make it, our kids get finals exposure and we get a chance to win a final.

    • Like 1
    3 hours ago, rjay said:

    I've believed for most of this season that we need to reset the list.

    The talk of making finals this year, it's not happening. Any chance went out the window with Trac's injury & probably earlier with Gus' s retirement.

    Reset with a decent draft hand, good trade period & go again in 2025.

     

    This is a different point to what the club should do though. The FD should keep fighting. 

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    2 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

    Really?

    Ask Richmond how they did it at the end of 2016, or Collingwood after the 2021 season.

    Look out how we nailed the 2019 draft with Jackson, Pickett and Rivers and then Bowey and Ben Brown the following year.

    It really can change quick smart if you absolutely nail your off season season with trades and draft.

    I agree. I'd err towards us missing and re-setting, but I don't want the club to put the cue in the rack. 

    The only guy I'd consider playing from here is Jefferson. We've played enough kids.

    Sestan would be a liability at AFL level. He doesn't currently have the tank for 2 quarters let alone 4.

    • Like 2
    1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

    The club certainly won't give up and their mindset will be different to us supporters.

    But unfortunately the reality and realistic point of view is that we pretty much have to win all 4 games with a higher percentage. I can't see that happening.

    On form alone we are no way near a top 8 side. It's hard to go past Hawthorn and the doggies.

    I am satisfied where we now sit. With all the issues the club has faced this year it was always going to be a grind. This isn't about accepting a loser type mentality but more so I think it really has taken a toll and with the last few years the way it'd panned out I think a good reset is needed within the club.

    I can't argue with that


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