Trade and Free Agency rumours

[Adam The God 30,421]

3 minutes ago, Lord Travis said:

A 26 year old 190cm battler on the fringe at a bottom club with 33 goals total from 36 matches at AFL level. He’s basically a Weid downgrade, but smaller. If we’re chasing him and expecting him to play a meaningful role while clubs like Geelong and Tigers are adding gun talent best and fairest winner level players, then we’re stuffed.

How do you know where we intend to play him? Who says we're looking at him as a KPP? Why not a winger? See Blicavs...

[Pennant St Dee 13,305]

24 minutes ago, demoniac said:

We don't have many quick ball carriers which is one of the reasons for our slow ball movement out of defence. Aside from Hunt who else has the speed to run and carry out of defence. Hunt does have his weaknesses but that speed is an asset we don't have much of in our defence,

Bedford would be a loss for same reason. He has speed and good footwork which can get him out of trouble and into space.

If they're both going then we need to be bringing in some speed in draft/trade or fa.

It’s no good when you make poor decisions and kick it to contests the majority of the time. 
 

The ball will move quicker than any player ever will,  so give me a good decision maker with good disposal over Hunt off half back any day.

Pendles and Daicos set up so much transition from the back half for Collingwood this season with their disposal and ability to consistently hit targets changing up the angles and opening up the ground.

Bailey Williams and Daniel also do it for the Dogs. A fit Salem and Bowey will be better IMO for our transition and improved ball movement from our back half

[george_on_the_outer 7,708]

6 minutes ago, Pennant St Dee said:

It’s no good when you make poor decisions and kick it to contests the majority of the time. 
The ball will move quicker than any player ever will,  so give me a good decision maker with good disposal over Hunt off half back any day.

 

...and wouldn't you hate being a forward .....is he going to kick it?  Short or Long?  Is he going to keep running? Will I run forward or retreat?  Do I lead now or wait until he stops running?

The fans love the look, but it does nothing for the team.

[mo64 5,881]

Just now, george_on_the_outer said:

...and wouldn't you hate being a forward .....is he going to kick it?  Short or Long?  Is he going to keep running? Will I run forward or retreat?  Do I lead now or wait until he stops running?

The fans love the look, but it does nothing for the team.

Our forwards don't have to worry about leading patterns. Just plonk yourself in the left forward pocket and you'll find it.

And how often do you see our backs trying to dissect the opposition with precision passing? Long up the line is our MO. A running defender can breakup defensive zones.

And yes the fans loved seeing Hunt change the game against Carlton with his run and dare, when the game looked lost. 

[DeeSpencer 26,083]

5 minutes ago, A F said:

How do you know where we intend to play him? Who says we're looking at him as a KPP? Why not a winger? See Blicavs...

Corbett’s never looked remotely like a winger to me, that could last about as long as Tomlinson’s mfc wing career. But the point probably stands - you’re then adding a career VFL player to a new position, that’s even less exciting.

I’m not expecting miracles, I’m ok with Grundy, a back up forward like Corbett and then a couple of possible pieces to the puzzle.
 

Use the draft to add top 15 players, find a few more guys to fill out the 22-30 spots on the list, rely on our current role players to do the job of 15-22 as they did when winning a flag. That’s better than paying overs for the 16th best player who now costs money we don’t have.

[DeeSpencer 26,083]

46 minutes ago, demoniac said:

We don't have many quick ball carriers which is one of the reasons for our slow ball movement out of defence. Aside from Hunt who else has the speed to run and carry out of defence. Hunt does have his weaknesses but that speed is an asset we don't have much of in our defence,

Salem, Bowey, May, Rivers and even Petty can all run and kick the ball, the biggest issue is coaching and fitness refusing to let them put the ball through the hands to the fat side then kick to space.

A defender will win the ball back and either kick or handball back in to the dead pocket, to someone who then bombs it down the line. Smarter, more cohesive footballers will chain handballs across the backline that allow for kicks or corridor run. Without getting those disposals that bring you to the fat side to begin with you’ll never get effective run and carry.

We’ll miss Hunt defensively and we’ll miss his rebound from early 2021 when he took off and would combine with Langdon by hand on the wing. We won’t miss him kicking it. 2021 and this year was his best footy in years because he stopped kicking it!

[Demonland 73,163]

 

[Kick_It_To_Pickett 3,293]

2 hours ago, demoniac said:

Van Rooyen, Howes, Turner....

Absolutely not enough. We need pacey ball users. The players we are likely to lose need replacing with more quality, otherwise this list will completely plateau. We did not better the list last year, we need to this year. Grundy alone does not address one single issue we had this year. 

Edited September 29, 2022 by Kick_It_To_Pickett

[Kick_It_To_Pickett 3,293]

1 hour ago, A F said:

It's not like for like though, is it?

When we won our premiership, we were aiming to be the first premiership team to ever play another game together. It'd never happened before, such was the age profile of our list.

Oliver and Petracca not yet at their physical peaks, Lever, Kozzy and Jackson at the time etc.

Compare this with Geelong and they face the very real possibility of falling off a cliff next year due to their age profile.

They need to replenish their list. We didn't. We were undone by injury to our best players. Had Geelong suffered a similar fate, they don't win the flag. As simple as that.

And it is precisely this attitude that will see us plateau ….

our list is overrated. Outside the top end, the bottom 6 are not great. You win premierships by improving your bottom 6.

I hope to hell we are taking that attitude and not the one you’ve expressed

[Palace Dees 2,340]

5 minutes ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

Absolutely not enough. We need paced my ball users. The players we are likely to lose need replacing with more quality, otherwise this list will completely plateau. We did not better the list last year, we need to this year. Grundy alone does not address one single issue we had this year. 

That's why we are recruiting him for next year, when we will have 2 less rucks on our books.

[Kick_It_To_Pickett 3,293]

Just now, Palace Dees said:

That's why we are recruiting him for next year, when we will have 2 less rucks on our books.

I dunno if you are being a smart [censored] or seriously don’t get the the statement I made. So, I’ll spell it out…

 

our issues were forward connection and lack of pace. We lack a smart and skilled ball user and have no rebounding pace. Grundy, is not solving either issues next year. He simply replaces Jackson. He does NOT improve the list one iota 

[Adam The God 30,421]

26 minutes ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

And it is precisely this attitude that will see us plateau ….

our list is overrated. Outside the top end, the bottom 6 are not great. You win premierships by improving your bottom 6.

I hope to hell we are taking that attitude and not the one you’ve expressed

Where did I say we shouldn't replenish the list?

I was referring to the idea that Geelong have all these top picks and new players coming to them (supposedly) and was making the obvious argument that it's not a fair comparison - their core will all have retired over the next 3 years.

Likewise, I hope we're not taking your panic stations attitude either.

The idea that the bottom 6 win premierships is nonsense. Look at Richmond. Their top players won it for them, specifically Martin. The rest are role players in a system. It's not 1996 anymore. System always wins out.

Edited September 29, 2022 by A F

[Palace Dees 2,340]

7 minutes ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

I dunno if you are being a smart [censored] or seriously don’t get the the statement I made. So, I’ll spell it out…

 

our issues were forward connection and lack of pace. We lack a smart and skilled ball user and have no rebounding pace. Grundy, is not solving either issues next year. He simply replaces Jackson. He does NOT improve the list one iota 

Take a deep breath young fella, you seem a little on edge today.  I will concede I missed the 'alone' in your initial comments which strengthens your argument and sure, I agree, we need to look at the list holistically. But Grundy does improve the list being a superior player to Jackson (at this stage) and every other ruckman bar Max IMO. 

[Kick_It_To_Pickett 3,293]

5 minutes ago, Palace Dees said:

Take a deep breath young fella, you seem a little on edge today.  I will concede I missed the 'alone' in your initial comments which strengthens your argument and sure, I agree, we need to look at the list holistically. But Grundy does improve the list being a superior player to Jackson (at this stage) and every other ruckman bar Max IMO. 

Patronising reply ? Young fella? I’m probably older than you. Read comments in full before responding with junk replies and remember yours is just an opinion, like everyone else around here. Mine is Grundy doesn’t solve the forwardline issue, nor the lack of speedy ball movement. End. 

[Palace Dees 2,340]

Just now, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

Patronising reply ? Young fella? I’m probably older than you. Read comments in full before responding with junk replies and remember yours is just an opinion, like everyone else around here. Mine is Grundy doesn’t solve the forwardline issue, nor the lack of speedy ball movement. End. 

If you were older than me you'd be dead - but agree, END 

[Deecisive 1,709]

I agree grundy does improve our list with Jackson going. The main issue i have at the moment is that i am not seeing any other conversations or rumors about melbourne chasing any other players, with a league of 17 other teams of maybe 40 players each we only have one target? really. you would think that someone would be hearing and talking if we were talking or interested in other players, maybe they only have eyes for the draft. but so far not impressed, other clubs are going out there making bids, and all i see is we are losing our players to them. What are we getting back in return, daft picks in the 30-60 range?

[Kick_It_To_Pickett 3,293]

9 minutes ago, A F said:

Where did I say we shouldn't replenish the list?

I was referring to the idea that Geelong have all these top picks and new players coming to them (supposedly) and was making the obvious argument that it's not a fair comparison - their core will all have retired over the next 3 years.

Likewise, I hope we're not taking your panic stations attitude either.

The idea that the bottom 6 win premierships is nonsense. Look at Richmond. Their top players won it for them, specifically Martin. The rest are role players in a system. It's not 1996 anymore. System always wins out.

I agree tht system wins out, but you must be mad to deny that there was a drop off from ANB, Spargo, Rivers, Sparrow, Jordon…which clearly impacted our ability to win..

[whatwhat say what 22,949]

57 minutes ago, Demonland said:

 

Bowes and pick 7 to the bears, pick 7 to the dogs for Dunkley?

[Gawndy the Great 9,011]

16 hours ago, Matt said:

I’m hoping it’s something like:

- Freo: 13 & one of North’s very early 2nds they get from the Logue trade

for:

- Port’s pick 8

then Freo add their future 1st, and that’s the deal.

For LJ, we get 8, and a future 1st, in a good draft

Hmmm. Freo will finish top 8 again so it’ll be a late first rounder you’d think. It feels the point value is still unders. 

[Redleg 41,479]

24 minutes ago, Deecisive said:

I agree grundy does improve our list with Jackson going. The main issue i have at the moment is that i am not seeing any other conversations or rumors about melbourne chasing any other players, with a league of 17 other teams of maybe 40 players each we only have one target? really. you would think that someone would be hearing and talking if we were talking or interested in other players, maybe they only have eyes for the draft. but so far not impressed, other clubs are going out there making bids, and all i see is we are losing our players to them. What are we getting back in return, daft picks in the 30-60 range?

Unless we are very professional and don't leak.

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

16 minutes ago, whatwhat say what said:

Bowes and pick 7 to the bears, pick 7 to the dogs for Dunkley?

Pick 7 for Lobb and change.

Pick 7 to dees with Freo 1st for Jackson.

Funny how it all works out.

 

If it pans out like that I'd say the deals were  done a while ago.

 

Edited September 29, 2022 by Cheap Seats

[Adam The God 30,421]

40 minutes ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

I agree tht system wins out, but you must be mad to deny that there was a drop off from ANB, Spargo, Rivers, Sparrow, Jordon…which clearly impacted our ability to win..

That's a very hard thing to measure.

Great players always make role players look better. 

I thought it was our core that struggled and this then impacted on the effectiveness of role players.

Edited September 29, 2022 by A F

[mo64 5,881]

4 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Unless we are very professional and don't leak.

I don't think any clubs leak, but Player Agents have family, friends and contacts in the media. And divulging potential player movements prior to Trade Week doesn't haven't any impact on the end result.

I'm afraid that there will be no Big Fish landed. Maybe some guppies.

[waynewussell 6,242]

1 hour ago, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

our list is overrated

Our list includes 22 players that won the AFL Premiership one year ago and another 15 who won the VFL Premiership in 2022... Perhaps you continue to underrate them!

[Adam The God 30,421]

39 minutes ago, Deecisive said:

I agree grundy does improve our list with Jackson going. The main issue i have at the moment is that i am not seeing any other conversations or rumors about melbourne chasing any other players, with a league of 17 other teams of maybe 40 players each we only have one target? really. you would think that someone would be hearing and talking if we were talking or interested in other players, maybe they only have eyes for the draft. but so far not impressed, other clubs are going out there making bids, and all i see is we are losing our players to them. What are we getting back in return, daft picks in the 30-60 range?

Because we don't do a scatter gun approach.

We work quietly and professionally behind the scenes.

We have done this for quite a while now.

Just because we're not linked to players does not mean we're not having conversations and looking at ways to improve our list.