TEAMS: Rd 10 vs Adelaide

[binman 42,968]

13 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Having said that I don't get the mucking around with the regular structural changes fwd and now back with little attempt to settle a team and develop cohesion across each line and connection up and down the field. 

This is the number one issue i have with Goodwin's decision making this season. It  just beggars belief to be honest and is a big factor in me beginning to question if he is up to the job.

In any normal season the most successful teams are the ones who know their system inside out, every player knows their role, teammates trust each other to play their role, things look automatic etc etc. 

This is not a normal season. Call me crazy, but i would have thought in a season where so much is out of team's control and the routines elite athletes and teams swear by are all over the place that sticking to the systems and structures you have drilled into the team over years (and all preseason) would be even more important. It is the one thing they can actually have measure of control over.

Look at the tigers last night. Their system just ground down the lions. Relentless. Predictable. Machine like.

Goody has talked for three years about the Melbourne brand, that dees fans need know what to expect week in, week out. But we have no idea what to expect anymore because of his bizarre selections and chopping and changing structures. Just crazy.

You only need to look at our forward line. Start the season with two forwards, restart the season with one, swap back to two and when it appears that is working try three (in a big game against the top of the ladder team)!

And then one week later go back to two and tell a media conference that the one game three man forward line experiment is dead.

I mean seriously WTF?

[Cheesy D. Pun 1,765]

11 hours ago, In Harmes Way said:

I can’t see Weid and Jackson beating Talia and Doedee. I hope they effectively bring the ball to ground and ANB lays at least 20 tackles.

i can see why they dropped OMac after last week, but I thought he’d be a good matchup on Lynch.

i can’t see us kicking a bag, but we should win unconvincingly.

This is our biggest worry. Weid and Jacko have been good at bringing it to ground but we have selected a grand total of zero genuine small forwards. No pace, no pressure. 

While I think we'll find a way of winning this one, I'd expect them to find it pretty easy to waltz out of our forward line.

[Lucifers Hero 39,808]

Looking again at the teams I can't believe we dropped Hannan but kept Jones.  At least Hannan chases, tackles, looks for targets and has a few goal assists.  Haven't looked at stats, just trusting my eyes.

[jnrmac 20,065]

13 hours ago, Lord Nev said:

Hannan was great the couple of games before, crunching tackles, kicking goals, was looking a ripper, but his last 2 weeks have been quiet and he's provided little pressure. In saying that though, Melksham is not helping in that area either, he's looking a selfish player this year. Barely tackles, doesn't go when it's his turn, doesn't chase, seen him give up on a ton of contests, plus he just looks straight for goal whenever he gets it.

Probably fair enough Hannan gets dropped, but Melksham and Brayshaw have been just as bad or worse for longer. The inconsistency is staggering. This is an outward example of the rumours of cliques and favourites we hear IMO.

He must have pictures of Goody. I am a Melksham fan but this year he has been awful. Very selfish player and wouldn't chase to save his life.

[Pickett2Jackson 3,904]

57 minutes ago, Cheesy D. Pun said:

This is our biggest worry. Weid and Jacko have been good at bringing it to ground but we have selected a grand total of zero genuine small forwards. No pace, no pressure. 

While I think we'll find a way of winning this one, I'd expect them to find it pretty easy to waltz out of our forward line.

Bedford should have been selected with Kozzie out.  Hannan out too. Melksham in poor form.  We have no small forwards, just like the good old days.

[Adam The God 30,259]

1 hour ago, titan_uranus said:

My gripe with dropping OMac isn't that I think OMac played well. He didn't. 

It's about structure.

I think our best long-term plan is for OMac, or someone else who can play that role better than him, to be the "second" defender (May is the "first" defender, taking the opposition's best key forward, and Lever is "third", zoning off, intercepting, playing a little freer than the other two).

We've seen plenty of examples of asking Lever to be the "second" defender which haven't worked. We've also seen examples of asking Frost or Smith to be the "second" defender: because they're both unreliable teammates, that hasn't worked well either.

OMac has flaws, indeed some significant ones that IMO mean he can't be a long-term candidate for our best 22, but the structure with him in the side has had the best look to it. And our defence has been our best performing part of the ground for the past month with OMac in it.

So I'd prefer us to be playing to our preferred structure, even if we're unhappy with OMac, unless/until there is a proper OMac replacement to play in his stead. And that is not Tomlinson (nor is it TMac).

I basically said the same thing mate. I completely agree. I just dont think it'll hurt us against Adelaide. I think we'll back ourselves to win the contested footy and bring pressure forward of centre and play a tight zone. 

Edited August 5, 2020 by A F

[picket fence 17,169]

11 hours ago, A F said:

Whilst I think Oscar straightens us up at the back, he was almost as ordinary as his brother last week.

He's definitely a yo-yo player at the club. The coaching group clearly don't have complete confidence in him. They rightly traded out Frost, IMV, but the element of our defence that really struggled when we played top opposition in 2018 was Oscar. He hasn't been able to put together a decent stretch of consistent games in recent times, but I don't think we can say the coaches haven't backed him in for large portions of 2017 and 2018. In fact, he played 20 and 25 games respectively in those years.

I think ultimately our defence is best served with another tall, whether that be Oscar or someone else, but it certainly works best when we allow Lever to play third fiddle and May to play lockdown. I reckon Petty is the guy for it.

I wonder if Oscar will be gone at the end of this year? This is his 6th year on the list, so we've invested quite a bit of time in him. He may even seek a new home himself, but I reckon his leg speed is an issue, particularly in our set up. He often got caught out on a lead in 2018 and when our midfield's pressure drops, it leaves him exposed, without sufficient leg speed to close the gap.

I think we'll win this comfortably with or without Oscar. The Crows are bog ordinary. It's more our pressure around the stoppages and in our forward half that I'm concerned with.

'Rightly traded out Frost"?? I am more convinced than ever this was the WRONG move, Frost in spite of faults would easily have got a game in this side> His form for hawks has been solid!

[Lord Nev 13,512]

42 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

He must have pictures of Goody. I am a Melksham fan but this year he has been awful. Very selfish player and wouldn't chase to save his life.

Same, his goal kicking accuracy seems good and before this year he was probably our best kick going inside 50, not sure what's happened this year but just seems to be all about kicking goals and nothing else.

[Adam The God 30,259]

3 minutes ago, picket fence said:

'Rightly traded out Frost"?? I am more convinced than ever this was the WRONG move, Frost in spite of faults would easily have got a game in this side> His form for hawks has been solid!

Frost is unpredictable. You need predictability in zone defences in any sport really.

[picket fence 17,169]

7 minutes ago, A F said:

Frost is unpredictable. You need predictability in zone defences in any sport really.

So is our footy team!!

[Adam The God 30,259]

25 minutes ago, picket fence said:

So is our footy team!!

Well, adding Frost's impersonation of a headless chicken sprinting out of defence only worsens that unpredictability.

As for performance of our team from week to week, we are definitely unpredictable.

[rjay 24,928]

2 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

My gripe with dropping OMac isn't that I think OMac played well. He didn't. 

It's about structure.

I think our best long-term plan is for OMac, or someone else who can play that role better than him, to be the "second" defender (May is the "first" defender, taking the opposition's best key forward, and Lever is "third", zoning off, intercepting, playing a little freer than the other two).

We've seen plenty of examples of asking Lever to be the "second" defender which haven't worked. We've also seen examples of asking Frost or Smith to be the "second" defender: because they're both unreliable teammates, that hasn't worked well either.

OMac has flaws, indeed some significant ones that IMO mean he can't be a long-term candidate for our best 22, but the structure with him in the side has had the best look to it. And our defence has been our best performing part of the ground for the past month with OMac in it.

So I'd prefer us to be playing to our preferred structure, even if we're unhappy with OMac, unless/until there is a proper OMac replacement to play in his stead. And that is not Tomlinson (nor is it TMac).

I think on the current list Petty is our best long term bet for that position.

Strong kid, good hands and has that bit of mongrel that Oscar doesn't...

Unfortunate that he is injured this year.

[Deemania since 56 6,638]

17 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

May will carve him up.

Totally.

[Deemania since 56 6,638]

1 hour ago, picket fence said:

'Rightly traded out Frost"?? I am more convinced than ever this was the WRONG move, Frost in spite of faults would easily have got a game in this side> His form for hawks has been solid!

We all knew that Frosty's game was under some scrutiny but we could rely upon him; he was our backline excitement machine who worked hard, got better and better at his craft, made impacts across a game like no other in very positive terms. The trade to the Squawks heralded from the first moment a significant lag in our capabilities, in which most of our supporters prepared for a serious and heartfelt loss. Such a loss has been proven - even in this topsy-turvy season. He is now more reliable than ever under Clarkson's coaching - his skills and anticipation have greatly improved. Sad time for the MFC - retaining OMac to appease TMac, and sacrificing at the first external call our beloved Frosty. Wish him well but wish he was still available - his presence opened doors for Lever to 'float' the backline in interception and covered the double-handling of opposition forwards for Nev and May. Poor decision to trade the Iceman. 

 

[Deemania since 56 6,638]

37 minutes ago, A F said:

Well, adding Frost's impersonation of a headless chicken sprinting out of defence only worsens that unpredictability.

As for performance of our team from week to week, we are definitely unpredictable.

All the other chickens have gone home to roost because they do not forage the danger points quite like Frosty could. Headless spectators and critics are a more apt consideration; Frosty was doing things that he would soon master. 

[binman 42,968]

1 hour ago, jnrmac said:

 I am a Melksham fan but this year he has been awful. Very selfish player and wouldn't chase to save his life.

Me too jnr, and agree with his form thius year and that he plays selfish football. His body language was woeful in the first few games.

100% should have been dropped 3 weeks ago, for team culture reasons if nothing else.

The problem of not having done so is that he has been better in the last 3 weeks - not great, but better. So dropping him now makes no sense and sends a weird message to the rest of the team (play average and you are on notice, address the issues, improve and we drop you).

Just one more example the bizzaro approach to selection Goodwin has taken this year.

[Deemania since 56 6,638]

17 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

I like the selections personally. 

Would have brought in Hunt or Rivers for a bit of speed perhaps. But Adelaide arent a quick side either.

Yes, speed is a true advantage and Hunt tends to play good footy against the Crows 

[Lord Nev 13,512]

2 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Looking again at the teams I can't believe we dropped Hannan but kept Jones.  At least Hannan chases, tackles, looks for targets and has a few goal assists.  Haven't looked at stats, just trusting my eyes.

Usually I'd say you're right, but the last two weeks:

Hannan - 2 tackles, 0 goals, 10 disposals, 1 goal assist, 1 one percenter, 0 marks inside 50 - TOTAL

Jones - 4 tackles, 1 goal, 27 disposals, 0 goal assists, 0 one percenters, 1 mark inside 50 - TOTAL

I know it's a Demonland trend atm to trash Jones, and I'm not saying he's been good, but he hasn't been as bad as some have made out and I reckon he's edging Hannan for form atm.

 

[Lucifers Hero 39,808]

29 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

Usually I'd say you're right, but the last two weeks:

Hannan - 2 tackles, 0 goals, 10 disposals, 1 goal assist, 1 one percenter, 0 marks inside 50 - TOTAL

Jones - 4 tackles, 1 goal, 27 disposals, 0 goal assists, 0 one percenters, 1 mark inside 50 - TOTAL

I know it's a Demonland trend atm to trash Jones, and I'm not saying he's been good, but he hasn't been as bad as some have made out and I reckon he's edging Hannan for form atm.

I did say I hadn't looked at the stats...

Even so, not sure comparing stats is valid as Hannan plays as a fwd and Jones as a wing man/midfielder so he should have much higher stats.

In case you ask I wasn't suggesting Hannan take on Jones' wingman role; more his position in the 22 and juggle the magnets to fit him in, especially as we have so many inside mids being played out of position and Jones is one of them. 

Edited August 5, 2020 by Lucifer's Hero

[Lord Nev 13,512]

19 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

I did say I hadn't looked at the stats...

Even so, not sure comparing stats is valid as Hannan plays as a fwd and Jones as a wing man/midfielder so he should have much higher stats.

In case you ask I wasn't suggesting Hannan take on Jones' wingman role; more his position in the 22 and juggle the magnets to fit him in, especially as we have so many inside mids being played out of position and Jones is one of them. 

Sure, but even so Jones still has more goals and marks inside 50, so bit hard to defend Hannan's form atm. I didn't bring out all the stats, just the ones relevant to the forward half and the pressure there. I really like Hannan, and his couple of games before those ones were really good IMO, but he dropped off a cliff after that.

As I mentioned, I don't think Jones has been good as such, but he's been nowhere near as poor as some are trying to make out and he's contributed more than Hannan the last 2 games. I would have been looking more at Jackson (0 tackles in 2 weeks) and Melksham (1 tackle in 2 weeks) given our lack of forward pressure than Jones at this stage.

Unless Jones lifts I can't see him playing against North, but it still boggles the mind that others like Gus, Harmes and Melksham can get away with things week after week.

Edit - And just to add, their heat map percentages are identical.

Edited August 5, 2020 by Lord Nev

[cantstandyasam 700]

3 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Looking again at the teams I can't believe we dropped Hannan but kept Jones.  At least Hannan chases, tackles, looks for targets and has a few goal assists.  Haven't looked at stats, just trusting my eyes.

I haven't noticed Hannan these past 2 games. Still would rather him over Jones.

[Melb-A-Toast 257]

When was the last time a McDonald wasn't in the side? Could it be over a decade?

[Optimus D 283]

Do not understand how Brayshaw continues to play I cannot see what value he brings to the side. Surely he must be on the thinnest of ice. Adelaide and Roo's games are ideal games to run himself into some form. Lets hope he starts by doing something tonight.

[Adam The God 30,259]

3 hours ago, Deemania since 56 said:

All the other chickens have gone home to roost because they do not forage the danger points quite like Frosty could. Headless spectators and critics are a more apt consideration; Frosty was doing things that he would soon master. 

Not in my opinion. Not after 8 years in the system.

[Axis of Bob 11,812]

1 hour ago, Melb-A-Toast said:

When was the last time a McDonald wasn't in the side? Could it be over a decade?

Round 23 last year. 9 games ago. 

But, given the last 6 months, yeah, it probably counts as a decade! ?