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I think I've worked it out...?

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19 hours ago, kev martin said:

You are right. Our backline is doing the job.

May is doing his job. Lockhart, Oscar, and Hibberd have been dropped at some stage. Lever is only getting a game because he's on big bucks and Salem who hasn't improved off half back is the only other player not to be dropped. If not for May we would have the worst backline in the league. Nothing is working sack every coach and start again.

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53 minutes ago, WERRIDEE said:

May is doing his job. Lockhart, Oscar, and Hibberd have been dropped at some stage. Lever is only getting a game because he's on big bucks and Salem who hasn't improved off half back is the only other player not to be dropped. If not for May we would have the worst backline in the league. Nothing is working sack every coach and start again.

Agree about May., he is playing accountable football.

We have a bit of a backline flood and crowding of the zones going.

This is why I think our backline is working ok, though at the expense of energy to the midfield group.

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6 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

The point I was making, if you are sick of the Club and your only avenue to see games is on the web or tv, don't watch it, then we won't  have pages and pages of 'I'm sick of this'

It was a poor game, the previous 3 games, the connection and conversion was on the improve

I posted some of the issues, such as players not being in top form etc

This site is infamous for blowing one way then the other depending on t h e result

Suggest you crack at Bartlett about his 'wingeing'.

Tell him to stop watching and that he is not the type of fan you want  in the MFC.

 

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6 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

The point I was making, if you are sick of the Club and your only avenue to see games is on the web or tv, don't watch it, then we won't  have pages and pages of 'I'm sick of this'

It was a poor game, the previous 3 games, the connection and conversion was on the improve

I posted some of the issues, such as players not being in top form etc

This site is infamous for blowing one way then the other depending on t h e result

SACK THE COACHES!

You heard it first from Saty

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2 hours ago, dieter said:

Can you please elaborate...

I used to play golf with Plapps best mate. He told me that Goody offered his resignation when the players went to the aflpa secretly wrt to the preseason training camp (the one that Melb Storm do) without discussing with anyone at the club. From memory there were only a handful players who opposed (Led by Tmac, included Hogan, Salem and I can’t remember who else).

His resignation was not accepted by the club obviously - wouldn’t go into much more detail.

 

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Has anyone noticed that every game this round has been a blowout? Something in the ether.  ( Clarkson also talked about 'strange coincidences', namely that his side had played like shysters since the Covid huddle bubble toils and troubles..) 

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7 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

This site is infamous for blowing one way then the other depending on t h e result

Agree. Probably the same as 17 other AFL fan sites.

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3 hours ago, kev martin said:

Suggest you crack at Bartlett about his 'wingeing'.

Tell him to stop watching and that he is not the type of fan you want  in the MFC.

 

Bartlett was talking about one game, I hope Goodwin took the paint of the walls, nobody is disagreeing it was horrible, we deserve better

I for one hope it's not repeated

B1ut I will still be watching, coz I am not sick of the team

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3 hours ago, CYB said:

I used to play golf with Plapps best mate. He told me that Goody offered his resignation when the players went to the aflpa secretly wrt to the preseason training camp (the one that Melb Storm do) without discussing with anyone at the club. From memory there were only a handful players who opposed (Led by Tmac, included Hogan, Salem and I can’t remember who else).

His resignation was not accepted by the club obviously - wouldn’t go into much more detail.

 

Does not surprise me one bit if true.

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On 7/31/2020 at 12:05 AM, FireInTheBennelly said:

Heroes wear helmets!!!

Harmes needs to be played back into form and stay there. He's the best tagger in the comp. Half back, no. Wing, no. HFF, no. Take the number 1 mid every week and let's see what happens. Hell, might even win a clearance.

This is 100% correct. Harmes is notr a naturally smart footy player, when he was assigned a player to tag, they took him to contests, they put him around the ball, he can win a clearance.. had a great 2018 doing this.. why in teh name of hades has this stopped?

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Satyriconhome said:

Bartlett was talking about one game, I hope Goodwin took the paint of the walls, nobody is disagreeing it was horrible, we deserve better

I for one hope it's not repeated

B1ut I will still be watching, coz I am not sick of the team

It is his first public criticism of the team.

Assume he would of said '(censored)' privately or shared within his group and with other board members during his tenure. We are not really playing like achieving  the objectives the club told the supporters we are aiming for over the next 5 years.

Without addressing the clubs on-field problems that have been there for a long time. (such as; playing the 4 quarters, controlling the momentum within the game, responding when we are challenged, having a functional forward line, developing drafted players, making good decisions, having AFL standard skills, being a 'hard' team to play against, etcetera) the club will suffer, membership will suffer and objectives will not be reached.

People who have shots at the team aren't sick of the team but are sick of the results. 

Most will keep their interest but will they stay financial supporters? 

The board want us to be a powerhouse again.

PS. I think most of us will still be watching.

Not sure if Goodwin is the type of person to 'take the paint off'. He would more likely set processes into action.

Let's hope playing the bottom teams helps us get our game right.

 

Edited by kev martin

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Posted (edited)

The issue is....we improved in the middle in the second half of 2018 once Gus and Harmes started playing more time in and around the middle with Viney out injured for quite a while during most of the period leading up to finals.  Chunk also beginning to spend slightly more time resting forward or off HB.

Gus offered a bit of the inside / outside mid we had been missing to that point when we had Chunk (inside), Viney (inside) and Clarry (inside) playing most of the starting 3 for the first half of 2018 and of course prior to that (2017).  Whenever those three played together for the most part of a match we got plenty of contested but suffered with genuine clean clearances and were often smothered by teams who would sit off these three waiting for them to gather then tackle the [censored] outta them, win their fair share, spread to outliers and then off to the races.  None of those three quick enough to cover any speedier outside mids once they got it.

Harmes slowly started taking on the game's best mid and shutting them down as well as getting them the other way on occasions pushing hard forward.

Does anyone recall seeing the movie Seabiscuit?  Well if you did, in his famous championship match race with War Admiral, Seabiscuit wasn't great out in front, even though he was super quick and bolted out of the blocks, as he tended to get bored and lose concentration.  So his rider in this race (Woolf?) was under instruction to allow War Admiral to come alongside.  That he did with a super quick gain along the back straight pulling up alongside Seabiscuit with ease after Seabiscuit bolted out of the blocks as he often did.  Surely War Admiral would zip past Seabisuit and win at that incredible closing speed!?

But as War Admiral came alongside, Seabiscuit looked him in the eye, sized him up, and then said that's enough mate. Taking off to show him who was boss and win this legendary race by 4 lengths.  To me this is Harmes in a nut shell.  Get him zoned in and focused on a tough challenge, prod him to stick it to that player and give some back, and away he goes.  Allow him to roam in areas of the ground he isn't familiar with and just go shoulder to shoulder to defend an opponent and he looks right out of it (disinterested?).

Is Harmes our Fritsch of 2019?

So many errors of judgement by SG.  So many blunders, year after year.  I've seen some reasonable set ups, structures and balanced line ups that SG has put on the park on occasions, mostly in that second half of 2018.  Only to see them disappear just as quickly a month or so later.  I wonder if he even knows them with all the changes to players and roles we see from week to week.

Edited by Rusty Nails
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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

So many errors of judgement by SG.  So many blunders, year after year.  I've seen some reasonable set ups, structures and balanced line ups that SG has put on the park on occasions, mostly in that second half of 2018.  Only to see them disappear just as quickly a month or so later.

Or they were put in place against his "better judgement" at his assistants' urging, only for Goodwin to dismantle them at the first sign of imperfection. "Your fancy new system saw us outscored in one quarter ... plainly it's b*llsh*t."

Or "yeah, that's all good on paper, and we're winning games, but let's just try going back to ferocious attack on the ball ... you know, our brand?"

The infamous head rub of Jennings may have revealed the dynamic.

Edited by Mazer Rackham

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1 hour ago, Mazer Rackham said:

Or they were put in place against his "better judgement" at his assistants' urging, only for Goodwin to dismantle them at the first sign of imperfection. "Your fancy new system saw us outscored in one quarter ... plainly it's b*llsh*t."

Or "yeah, that's all good on paper, and we're winning games, but let's just try going back to ferocious attack on the ball ... you know, our brand?"

The infamous head rub of Jennings may have revealed the dynamic.

Hopefully it's not like this MR.  If so then it's no wonder we are all over the shop.   Is this your assessment or have you heard things internally along the line?

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1 hour ago, Rusty Nails said:

Hopefully it's not like this MR.  If so then it's no wonder we are all over the shop.   Is this your assessment or have you heard things internally along the line?

Purely me surmising .... reading between the lines if you will.

I have no inside knowledge whatsoever, but I do get concerned by things I see and hear about being stats-driven, which to me is the tail wagging the dog. Cargo cult science.

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I honestly think AFL football is just one big  junket for the majority of players and the idea of winning a flag that hasn’t been won for nearly six decades is trivial. 
The club still hangs its hat on the ‘history’ of the club and expects players who didn’t grow up barracking for the MFC and have only been around in the last three decades to actually give a stuff about it. The players have other more important things to think about like getting likes on instagram or buying new shoes and even cooking onions multiple ways. 
I really am questioning the desire, the absolute hunger to achieve greatness and win flags by this group. 
I’m happy to be proven wrong but and want to be but there just seems to a lack of intent and menace in the club. 

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10 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

The issue is....we improved in the middle in the second half of 2018 once Gus and Harmes started playing more time in and around the middle with Viney out injured for quite a while during most of the period leading up to finals.  Chunk also beginning to spend slightly more time resting forward or off HB.

Gus offered a bit of the inside / outside mid we had been missing to that point when we had Chunk (inside), Viney (inside) and Clarry (inside) playing most of the starting 3 for the first half of 2018 and of course prior to that (2017).  Whenever those three played together for the most part of a match we got plenty of contested but suffered with genuine clean clearances and were often smothered by teams who would sit off these three waiting for them to gather then tackle the [censored] outta them, win their fair share, spread to outliers and then off to the races.  None of those three quick enough to cover any speedier outside mids once they got it.

Harmes slowly started taking on the game's best mid and shutting them down as well as getting them the other way on occasions pushing hard forward.

Does anyone recall seeing the movie Seabiscuit?  Well if you did, in his famous championship match race with War Admiral, Seabiscuit wasn't great out in front, even though he was super quick and bolted out of the blocks, as he tended to get bored and lose concentration.  So his rider in this race (Woolf?) was under instruction to allow War Admiral to come alongside.  That he did with a super quick gain along the back straight pulling up alongside Seabiscuit with ease after Seabiscuit bolted out of the blocks as he often did.  Surely War Admiral would zip past Seabisuit and win at that incredible closing speed!?

But as War Admiral came alongside, Seabiscuit looked him in the eye, sized him up, and then said that's enough mate. Taking off to show him who was boss and win this legendary race by 4 lengths.  To me this is Harmes in a nut shell.  Get him zoned in and focused on a tough challenge, prod him to stick it to that player and give some back, and away he goes.  Allow him to roam in areas of the ground he isn't familiar with and just go shoulder to shoulder to defend an opponent and he looks right out of it (disinterested?).

Is Harmes our Fritsch of 2019?

So many errors of judgement by SG.  So many blunders, year after year.  I've seen some reasonable set ups, structures and balanced line ups that SG has put on the park on occasions, mostly in that second half of 2018.  Only to see them disappear just as quickly a month or so later.  I wonder if he even knows them with all the changes to players and roles we see from week to week.

No way of telling how good any of our midfielders really are with Gawn putting it down their throats.

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45 minutes ago, McQueen said:

I honestly think AFL football is just one big  junket for the majority of players and the idea of winning a flag that hasn’t been won for nearly six decades is trivial. 
The club still hangs its hat on the ‘history’ of the club and expects players who didn’t grow up barracking for the MFC and have only been around in the last three decades to actually give a stuff about it. The players have other more important things to think about like getting likes on instagram or buying new shoes and even cooking onions multiple ways. 
I really am questioning the desire, the absolute hunger to achieve greatness and win flags by this group. 
I’m happy to be proven wrong but and want to be but there just seems to a lack of intent and menace in the club. 

I doubt if players in any teams these days care a fig about the past (with maybe the exception of the odd son in a father-son pair, though even the father these days may have played for more than one team).  But trying to motivate players with club history is doubly difficult for the MFC because of our lack of success since 1964 - a date indistinguishable to young blokes from 1864.  MFC needs to find other ways to motivate players.

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1 hour ago, McQueen said:

I honestly think AFL football is just one big  junket for the majority of players and the idea of winning a flag that hasn’t been won for nearly six decades is trivial. 
The club still hangs its hat on the ‘history’ of the club and expects players who didn’t grow up barracking for the MFC and have only been around in the last three decades to actually give a stuff about it. The players have other more important things to think about like getting likes on instagram or buying new shoes and even cooking onions multiple ways. 
I really am questioning the desire, the absolute hunger to achieve greatness and win flags by this group. 
I’m happy to be proven wrong but and want to be but there just seems to a lack of intent and menace in the club. 

Can't argue with that although there would be a few exceptions i'm sure.  This group (in general not all) appears to be ok with just putting the boots on, running out and collecting their salary.

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15 hours ago, Demon3 said:

This is 100% correct. Harmes is notr a naturally smart footy player, when he was assigned a player to tag, they took him to contests, they put him around the ball, he can win a clearance.. had a great 2018 doing this.. why in teh name of hades has this stopped?

This is how most coaches fail. They come up with a gameplan and then try to fit their players into roles.

A successful coach will identify the perfect role for each player to utilise their skills/strengths, while working on their deficiencies. In the latter stages of a players career they will have gained enough ability and preparedness to play different roles.

Fritsch backline, Brayshaw wing, Harmes backline. These are all examples of trying to push a player into an unsuitable role. Sure there may have been reasons for doing it, but it's not the way a successful coach goes about it. For mine you could even add Salem as a defender to this. He was an out and out mid, moved to the backline and is now stagnating. He could've been our perfect outside mid, but I doubt he'll ever get serious game time in that role.

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