3 hours ago, Lord Nev said:

Jennings would be the one to ask, he was the brain behind the 2 players coming off the back of the square that we were no longer able to use. He was let go by the club for not being able to adapt to that.

May be a minor change overall, but it made a decent dent in our game plan.

Jennings wasn’t let go because he couldn’t adapt. He has been doing his certificate 4 in coaching and wants to coach his own team in his own right and will eventually coach an AFL club. 

4 minutes ago, Demon Forever said:

Jennings wasn’t let go because he couldn’t adapt. He has been doing his certificate 4 in coaching and wants to coach his own team in his own right and will eventually coach an AFL club. 

No he won't 

2 minutes ago, Matt Demon said:

No he won't 

Happy to put a membership on it when it happens

34 minutes ago, Demon Forever said:

Happy to put a membership on it when it happens

Well I hope you 2 are alive IF and when it happens

1 hour ago, Demon Forever said:

Jennings wasn’t let go because he couldn’t adapt. He has been doing his certificate 4 in coaching and wants to coach his own team in his own right and will eventually coach an AFL club. 

Jennings was let go because he has a walk in meat freezer in his house

1 hour ago, Demon Forever said:

Jennings wasn’t let go because he couldn’t adapt. He has been doing his certificate 4 in coaching and wants to coach his own team in his own right and will eventually coach an AFL club. 

You can believe that if you wish.

1 hour ago, Demon Forever said:

will eventually coach an AFL club

Not sure, but it won't be for a lack of trying.

5 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

We had largely stopped that by finals last year hadn't we? When Harmes/Viney/Oliver could work 2 ways at centre bounces unlike this year when they were underdone for the first month or so. Even last year many questioned if it was actually helping us.

I'd say Jennings was let go because of more of our overall structures and game plan rather than the bounces. There's a stoppage coach who's full time job it is to monitor that area of play, if we were largely undone by the 15 seconds post stoppage he'd be the first to go.

 

Oh yeah, not trying to imply that our setup at bounces was why he was let go, but I think his failure to adapt and innovate effectively this year ended up being the reason, and to me that was just the easiest example to provide.

 

So where is the official announcement on Todd Viney?

I have always thought something odd has been happening with the MFC even since Roos came in. Though we improved under Roos from a very low bar it still was modest improvement with some inexplicably bad performances and woeful player language at key moments during his tenure. Very little cultural change was evident. The capitulation against Geelong in Roos final game was very telling too me. A profound slap in the face if there ever was one. Goodwin now seems to be getting some of the same.  The players just don’t give a faaark and there still appears a disconnect between players and officialdom. The current movement of key personnel and Goodwin’s fragility ATM makes me believe many outstanding issues from the Schwab days had been swept under the carpet and not addressed properly. Why did PJ resign prematurely?  Whether the changes are ruthless enough to work out or not remains to be seen. 

Edited September 6, 20195 yr by america de cali

6 hours ago, Baghdad Bob said:

Whilst I think there is a lot in what you say I think it's easy to forget how good we were at the back end of 2018.  We didn't lack speed and we didn't often get caught out.  We were caught out this year because all of our midfield didn't have a preseason.  All of them.

As for our ball use going forward I think that is very problematic when you have half your team out and the majority of the blokes that deliver it forward missing most of preseason - no practice = less than optimal skills.  I agree we'd be better with more pace, I think small forwards and outside pace is lacking, but you put 9 first 22 players back into the team that played NM in the final round and give the mids a preseason and we are not having this conversation.

As for game plan I think it's interesting.  The Doggies have come alive in the back end of the season playing our 2018 footy.  Essendon played some very good footy with that style.  Brisbane tried to match Geelong at the Gabba with the "down the line defensive" stuff and were losing by 20 odd points at three quarter time.  They played our style footy in the last quarter and won brilliantly.  I'm not convinced that our style of footy is wrong or is dead, it clearly needs fit and skilful players to execute it.

We need to improve on 2018, we need to hone game plans, we need to address weaknesses in our list.  But more importantly than all that we need a good PS, fit players and continuity.  It's no surprise that Brisbane and Geelong finished top 2 this year.  Neither club had an injury really and the 22 had fantastic continuity which is something we just haven't had, even in 2018 we struggles for continuity.  Continuity is totally underestimated by most.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is the wrist slashing and view that we are a horrible footy club in crisis and destitute of players is a complete emotional overreaction to a season from hell.  Much didn't go right but the infrastructure is there for a very powerful rebound.  I don't think there would be one club that has written us off for 2020.

Interesting post mate. 

I'm not sure I agree that chaos isn't dead, but it'll be very interesting to see how we go against quicker sides next year with a fit list. (And yep, we'll need to address our outside run deficiencies)

Collingwood blew us off the park last year with outside run, but a good proponent of getting the ball on the outside is a team like GWS, who we managed to pressure in that final game of 2018 and never allowed them to really get going (all those missed shots from Green helped too).

There's absolutely no doubt that chaos cannot be played without a fit list and that is something we certainly lacked this year.

It's obvious we get exposed on the outside on the bigger MCG, but it could well be merely a fitness thing (rather than a pace thing) that allows a team to bring manic pressure to the ball carrier and never enable them to get it on the outside. It's debatable whether you actually need pace for this or just simply switched on, fit players.

36 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

You can believe that if you wish.

You will see. I will bring this post up again and don’t want to be “the told you so” man but.......

8 minutes ago, A F said:

Interesting post mate. 

I'm not sure I agree that chaos isn't dead, but it'll be very interesting to see how we go against quicker sides next year with a fit list. (And yep, we'll need to address our outside run deficiencies)

Collingwood blew us off the park last year with outside run, but a good proponent of getting the ball on the outside is a team like GWS, who we managed to pressure in that final game of 2018 and never allowed them to really get going (all those missed shots from Green helped too).

There's absolutely no doubt that chaos cannot be played without a fit list and that is something we certainly lacked this year.

It's obvious we get exposed on the outside on the bigger MCG, but it could well be merely a fitness thing (rather than a pace thing) that allows a team to bring manic pressure to the ball carrier and never enable them to get it on the outside. It's debatable whether you actually need pace for this or just simply switched on, fit players.

Chaos game is based on a 22 man team , for AF all playing and believing in one another and the game plan. Aside from all the PS and inseason interuptions, we had too many individuals playing selfish unaccountable football. Richmond suffered similar if not worse injuries than us and still finished top 4. Yes they probably have a bit more top end talent but are a testament to what is required to play the chaos game. 

Even in 2018, you could tell whether the dees were going to win or not within the first 5 minutes of the game. We lack that 100%, unquestionable commitment to the GP and team, which doesnt happen overnight. With the horrendous year and coaching changes, I wouldn't expect a big change in 2020, hence why I think making the finals is going to be much harder than people think. 

 

7 minutes ago, Demon Forever said:

You will see. I will bring this post up again and don’t want to be “the told you so” man but.......

What will you be saying that about? I wasn't saying he doesn't have designs on being a senior coach, I'm well aware of his level of ambition, I'm disagreeing with you about the circumstances of his departure.

44 minutes ago, CYB said:

Chaos game is based on a 22 man team , for AF all playing and believing in one another and the game plan. Aside from all the PS and inseason interuptions, we had too many individuals playing selfish unaccountable football. Richmond suffered similar if not worse injuries than us and still finished top 4. Yes they probably have a bit more top end talent but are a testament to what is required to play the chaos game. 

Even in 2018, you could tell whether the dees were going to win or not within the first 5 minutes of the game. We lack that 100%, unquestionable commitment to the GP and team, which doesnt happen overnight. With the horrendous year and coaching changes, I wouldn't expect a big change in 2020, hence why I think making the finals is going to be much harder than people think. 

 

Could well be right that our commitment is questionable.

Agree that this could just be about growing up (as much of our core have played under 100 games), but a healthy pre season and healthy list to choose from for much of 2020 and we will be in a much stronger position than 2019.

Agree that it will be a lot harder than people think too.

Watch Jack Viney walk next year as a FA.

35 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

So where is the official announcement on Todd Viney?

Should be any day along the announcements of

Petracca wants out

There's division between the captains

Richardson is ready to walk

Qnd whatever else the Soothsayers come up with 

13 hours ago, DubDee said:

you would have preferred Jones as sole captain this year?  wow

Do we know if Todd excused himself at any time when Jack's name was up for discussion ?

Presumption here is that he did not.

anyOne ever know of a person peopLe who always are Involved in, generally Starting trouble/Incidents at  pubs and walks away while others are left without ank Knowledge of why they are arguing.

 

 

11 minutes ago, Pennant St Dee said:

anyOne ever know of a person peopLe who always are Involved in, generally Starting trouble/Incidents at  pubs and walks away while others are left without ank Knowledge of why they are arguing.

 

 

Had a couple?

1 hour ago, olisik said:

Watch Jack Viney walk next year as a FA.

Lol, you're hilarious.

6 minutes ago, A F said:

Lol, you're hilarious.

Lol

Maybe a second rounder

41 minutes ago, Sorry kids said:

Maybe a second rounder

For Jack?

As a FA, I think 2nd round compo. If we trade now we could try pry a mid to late first rounder. Clubs like Essendon are desperate for inside mids.

2 hours ago, america de cali said:

I have always thought something odd has been happening with the MFC even since Roos came in. Though we improved under Roos from a very low bar it still was modest improvement with some inexplicably bad performances and woeful player language at key moments during his tenure. Very little cultural change was evident. The capitulation against Geelong in Roos final game was very telling too me. A profound slap in the face if there ever was one. Goodwin now seems to be getting some of the same.  The players just don’t give a faaark and there still appears a disconnect between players and officialdom. The current movement of key personnel and Goodwin’s fragility ATM makes me believe many outstanding issues from the Schwab days had been swept under the carpet and not addressed properly. Why did PJ resign prematurely?  Whether the changes are ruthless enough to work out or not remains to be seen. 

I might be wrong but I thought PJ stayed with the club a bit longer than initially agreed upon. Don't forget he was retired from this caper when he came on board.

That said I don't disagree that we can't seem to stick the landing in becoming a club that has a fight till we die kind of mentality, more of a look great when everything's going well but when the sh*t hits the fan pack it all in and accept our lot.