Demons Grand Plan for Yarra Park Training HQ

[DeleteUser 638]

2 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

The local member for the State seat of Melbourne, in which Yarra Park resides, is Ellen Sandell (Greens party). She's already been on radio complaining about it.

It would be good politics for Gosch's park to be restored as "proper" parkland when we leave.

My suspicion (with no evidence to back it up) is that getting out of poker machines might have been a pre-condition to getting State and/or Federal funding for the project. The Western Bulldogs got federal money for the redevelopment of Whitten Oval on that condition. It's the perfect time to be seeking State and Federal support with both governments heading towards elections within the next 11 months (or sooner).

On the first point, on what basis was she complaining?

Virtue signalling, dog whistling. Standard politics of course.

I wonder if there'd be the same uproar if it was a different club?

Am watching this from afar and saw the ABC breakfast show whizz through of the front pages of the majors and saw the Sun front. Very impressive for the club anyway.

I suppose it all comes down to being really clear about what is in scope and what it means for public amenity. Good point on Gosch's.

[Moonshadow 17,678]

5 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

My suspicion (with no evidence to back it up) is that getting out of poker machines might have been a pre-condition to getting State and/or Federal funding for the project. The Western Bulldogs got federal money for the redevelopment of Whitten Oval on that condition. It's the perfect time to be seeking State and Federal support with both governments heading towards elections within the next 11 months (or sooner).

That seems to make sense La Dee. With reasonable proposals, it's a good time to be seeking govt grants

[Copuchas 763]

4 minutes ago, CBDees said:

The current President of the “East Melbourne Group” is possibly the inner suburb’s biggest NIMBY!

Yes, Murray's already on the job!

It may well be that this is a pincer play between Bartlett and McGuire (and the new Lord Mayor Sally Capp who's a Collingwood Board member) to get traction on the sensible outcome which would be to cover over the Richmond - Flinders Street rail corridor.

 

[Copuchas 763]

8 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

The local member for the State seat of Melbourne, in which Yarra Park resides, is Ellen Sandell (Greens party). She's already been on radio complaining about it.

It would be good politics for Gosch's park to be restored as "proper" parkland when we leave.

My suspicion (with no evidence to back it up) is that getting out of poker machines might have been a pre-condition to getting State and/or Federal funding for the project. The Western Bulldogs got federal money for the redevelopment of Whitten Oval on that condition. It's the perfect time to be seeking State and Federal support with both governments heading towards elections within the next 11 months (or sooner).

and the Federal member is Adam Bandt!   So it certainly looms as a battle!  What will be interesting to hear will be Guy's perspectives on the concept, having seemingly flipped from a pro-development bulldozer to a development naysayer.   No guarantee he gets in of course...

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,950]

15 minutes ago, timbo said:

On the first point, on what basis was she complaining?

Virtue signalling, dog whistling. Standard politics of course.

I wonder if there'd be the same uproar if it was a different club?

Am watching this from afar and saw the ABC breakfast show whizz through of the front pages of the majors and saw the Sun front. Very impressive for the club anyway.

I suppose it all comes down to being really clear about what is in scope and what it means for public amenity. Good point on Gosch's.

To be fair, it was just a "sound grab" for the news, so I don't know everything she might have said. But the one line that made it to air was about Yarra Park being a park for the community to use.

[DeleteUser 638]

14 minutes ago, Copuchas said:

and the Federal member is Adam Bandt!   So it certainly looms as a battle!  What will be interesting to hear will be Guy's perspectives on the concept, having seemingly flipped from a pro-development bulldozer to a development naysayer.   No guarantee he gets in of course...

I've got a bridge in Terabithia to sell anyone who thinks Guy is not still pro development. He will say anything to get in power.

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

There will be a massive push for this to host a lot of Women's Football. This will appease the lefties at Yarra Council. If done right, this could be huge for the club. We will no doubt partner with a lot of community groups and clubs and offer them access to the ground. That is how these things work, 

[Deestar9 1,712]

11 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

It's just not gonna happen unfortunately. Even if it did preseason would be an issue with the MCG hosting cricket

Why ? 

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,950]

5 minutes ago, Leoncelli_36 said:

There will be a massive push for this to host a lot of Women's Football. This will appease the lefties at Yarra Council. If done right, this could be huge for the club. We will no doubt partner with a lot of community groups and clubs and offer them access to the ground. That is how these things work, 

We shouldn't have to worry about Yarra Council as Yarra Park is not within their boundary; it's within the City of Melbourne.

[SFebes 4,884]

11 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

It's just not gonna happen unfortunately. Even if it did preseason would be an issue with the MCG hosting cricket

I dont think there will be an Aussie cricket team for much longer after coughing up 481 in an ODI last night, unless you're referring the Bushrangers! ?

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

3 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

We shouldn't have to worry about Yarra Council as Yarra Park is not within their boundary; it's within the City of Melbourne.

Fantastic news. I just saw quotes from other mentioning the City of Yarra. I expect we can make this work. There is plenty to play out though. 

[binman 44,201]

4 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

We shouldn't have to worry about Yarra Council as Yarra Park is not within their boundary; it's within the City of Melbourne.

Exactmundo. A quirk really. As is the fact that the CoM stretches across almost to Kensington

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

1 hour ago, timbo said:

The maxim, at least in terms of efficiency of transport and environmental impact in a city context, is completely correct.

But let's not let facts get in the way of ideology, eh?

I don't recall mentioning my personal opinion of the merits or otherwise of bicycles vs cars.

I am hammering on councils' over zealous condemnation of cars.

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

51 minutes ago, Copuchas said:

and the Federal member is Adam Bandt!   So it certainly looms as a battle!  What will be interesting to hear will be Guy's perspectives on the concept, having seemingly flipped from a pro-development bulldozer to a development naysayer.   No guarantee he gets in of course...

Guy doesn't have perspectives. Or policy positions. Or even a philosophy. He is a policy vacuum who fills the space with whatever seems like a good vote grabber.

[DeleteUser 638]

20 minutes ago, Mazer Rackham said:

I don't recall mentioning my personal opinion of the merits or otherwise of bicycles vs cars.

I am hammering on councils' over zealous condemnation of cars.

Well, there's a lot to be said for zealously reducing our reliance on cars.

Retracting my snark - sorry.

[Lucifers Hero 40,487]

Jolimont tracks and station are already sunken well below street/park level. It is effectively underground as it runs under Wellington Pde to the East.

With clever design (and maybe lowering tracks a bit further) only 3/4 stories of the proposed 6 would not be visible above ground level.  Furthermore, with the increasingly popular 'green roofs' architecture the building could easily be camouflaged from the street and to blend into its parkland surrounds.  And for those worried about losing trees, a replanting program should cover it. 

Lobby groups will lobby.  But there is a lot more for the community to gain from this than to lose.  Just needs to be worked through with them.

A Red and Blue colour scheme on the externals of the building would work very well don't you think...

Edited June 20, 2018 by Lucifer's Hero

[SFebes 4,884]

Is this the area they are talking about? I don't know the city very well.

[SFebes 4,884]

Seems there's lots of whingers calling up SEN. We haven't had a home for year so just [censored] off

[CBDees 3,167]

8 minutes ago, SFebey said:

Is this the area they are talking about? I don't know the city very well.

????? This is the area talked about. Cut off from the majority of East Melbourne residents by rail tracks and popular primarily with dog-walkers! ?????

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,950]

1 minute ago, CBDees said:

????? This is the area talked about. Cut off from the majority of East Melbourne residents by rail tracks and popular primarily with dog-walkers! ?????

The little bit of East Melbourne which is right next to the proposed site (ie, that bit south of Wellington Road and west of Hoddle Street) includes Berry St. Is there still the old "Berry Street Babies Home" there? And if so, does the MFC still support it? If the Home is still there, now would be a very good time for the club to make sure that it does support it and if it has been all along, to get maximum kudos for it (in a way which doesn't seem superficial or self-serving.)  

[Copuchas 763]

22 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Jolimont tracks and station are already sunken well below street/park level. It is effectively underground as it runs under Wellington Pde to the East.

With clever design (and maybe lowering tracks a bit further) only 3/4 stories of the proposed 6 would not be visible above ground level.  Furthermore, with the increasingly popular 'green roofs' architecture the building could easily be camouflaged from the street and to blend into its parkland surrounds.  And for those worried about losing trees, a replanting program should cover it. 

Lobby groups will lobby.  But there is a lot more for the community to gain from this than to lose.  Just needs to be worked through with them.

A Red and Blue colour scheme on the externals of the building would work very well don't you think...

you've obviously never worked in railway engineering LH!   There's a tunnel portal one end of the area being contemplated (with West Richmond station the other end) and Jolimont station (heritage listed?) the other.  The tracks are going nowhere.....

[Lucifers Hero 40,487]

2 minutes ago, Copuchas said:

you've obviously never worked in railway engineering LH!   There's a tunnel portal one end of the area being contemplated (with West Richmond station the other end) and Jolimont station (heritage listed?) the other.  The tracks are going nowhere.....

True, I have no idea about engineering. 

I guess I took the dialogue so far to mean literally over the Jolimont station.

Given the limitations you mention, is it feasible to build over the tracks to the city end of Jolimont station (and leave it intact)?  Again, in a way that reduces a building's street mass and landscaped into its surrounds. 

[Jara 1,153]

1 hour ago, MT64 said:

And the government HAS to include Spring Street as well as Federal. The Federals have pumped millions into Geelong, Essendon, North and of course the filth.

Maybe my memory's playing tricks, but I seem to recall they also put a lot of money into the Western Bulldogs (not to mention $30 mill to Foxtel to increase coverage of women's sport) 

We're the oldest club, we started the league and haven't had a proper home for decades; should be able to mount a pretty good argument.

[Copuchas 763]

5 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

True, I have no idea about engineering. 

I guess I took the dialogue so far to mean literally over the Jolimont station.

Given the limitations you mention, is it feasible to build over the tracks to the city end of Jolimont station (and leave it intact)?  Again, in a way that reduces a building's street mass and landscaped into its surrounds. 

The station butts right up against the Wellington Pde Sth road over-bridge so there's no space down that end.   

The planning issue here is that nobody to date has proposed an economically feasible solution that addresses all issues.   Total elimination of car parking from Yarra Park is a laudable objective but is it realistic to force all MCG sporting precinct patrons on to public transport?  I'd suggest not.   Richmond station is an ugly eyesore that would benefit from redevelopment of some kind.  The railway reservation between Richmond and Flinders Street is a vast area and unattractive.   Most of it could be placed underground (or the cheaper option is to roof over it) but given the insistence that it's mainly green space that's created, there's no commercial proposition on which this can take place.   I think the issue that the MFC will have is that their project will get lost in the larger debate about what to do.

[daisycutter 29,799]