1978 - The Dennis Jones era

[Supermercado 2,802]

1970s fans, explain the Dennis Jones coaching regime to me. I've just started doing a research deep dive into 1978 and there's an almost Mark Neeld level of insanity going on.

- He was appointed after three years out of senior coaching and had been sitting on the committee that presumably appointed him. Previous coaching experience with Prahran 15 years earlier (one losing second division grand final + one prelim), Central Districts seven years earlier (finals in the last of his four years) and West Perth in 1973/1974 (grand final in his first year, didn't make the finals in his second and left). I know he had more experience than a lot of people who got senior roles in that era but seems a bit jobs for the boys.

- Ian Thorogood was one of his assistants after two years taking Carlton to 1st and 6th on the ladder. Seems like he'd have been a better option. Did he not want to take on another senior job?

- Bob Skilton was reported to be one of the lowest paid coaches in the league, then Jones was said to be one of the highest. My reading of the situation is that he became one of the few full time coaches in the league because he had to give up a good job to take the role. A precursor for the next few years where we'd try and buy everyone in sight.

- Immediately banned players from wearing thongs, t-shirts or tracksuits. 

- Fell out with Laurie Fowler twice (which to be fair to Jones was apparently not hard to do), causing him to quit the club both times before quickly coming back.

- Presided over the most insane scoring I've ever seen, including:

• Conceding 100+ points in 20 of 22 weeks, 150+ five times and +140 another three times
• Losing 68-147 (!) in Round 1, winning 167-57 (!!) in Round 2, then five weeks later losing 141-204 (!!!!!!!)
• Losing 12 in a row in the middle of the year, including kicking 2.14.26 against Carlton and publicly describing it as the worst game he'd ever seen

- Spent much of his time complaining about umpiring

- Responded to nearly throwing away a big lead against Geelong with the playful statement "if we’d lost the game I would have cut their throats"

- After losing to South Melbourne, Swans coach Des Tuddenham said we'd "run out of legs" and Jones said his side had "run out of ability"

- Made the players sing the song in the visitors' dressing rooms of the Western Oval after their eighth 10+ goal loss of the season

- When he said there was money for recruiting (though they didn't buy anyone worthwhile before the season) his philosophy was “if you get enough stones you’ll eventually smash a window”, which doesn't sound like the sort of person you'd put in charge of a budget

- Celebrated a late season win by stomping on pamphlets handed out by a reform group that wanted to sack him.

You can tell by the team list that they were trying to find new players, and he did try and lower expectations by all but saying (in contemporary language) that they needed to rebuild, but the new administration got in at the end of the year and he basically quit before he was sacked anyway. 

How was this appointment seen at the time, and what was the tipping point that led to fans turning on him? This is an era I'd like to learn more about, there's a lot of focus on the Barassi years but the 70s seem to be ignored. I'm sure those of you who lived through it will say that it's forgotten for a good reason.

[Call Me What You Will 751]

From my memory of this dark era, this is an excellent summary. I think it was Garry Baker who turned up to the first training in full beard, t-shirt and thongs! 

[durango 2,023]

I was part of the reform group and also a trainer at the MFC he was a dope who was on the board before convincing the board to appoint him as coach.  He believed that fitness was playing football from day one of training so the players just did not run hard because they had no fitness base to backup the football program. He did not work on their skills but did circuit training like in the 50's.

A pathetic coach and poor tactician at the end of the season he still believed he was the best coach in the VFL

[kallangurdemon 551]

the only good thing about Dennis was that he only had the one season.Sadly he has now passed on .

[Moonshadow 17,677]

Sounds very Neeldian.

Those R1 and R2 scores are crazy.

Imagine him coaching now!

[Supermercado 2,802]

12 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Sounds very Neeldian.

Those R1 and R2 scores are crazy.

Imagine him coaching now!

The AFL would give him life membership for conceding such outrageous scores.

[Moonshadow 17,677]

10 hours ago, Supermercado said:

The AFL would give him life membership for conceding such outrageous scores.

According to Wikipedia the round 2 scores were Melb 24.23 (167) to Fitz 23.19 (157)

[loges 6,767]

That's almost a shot at goal for every minute of play.

[Queanbeyan Demon 6,865]

Robbie Flower said that the least said about that year the better. 

[Cranky Franky 2,091]

He was an ex Melbourne player who had some success in coaching in WA.  He had a pretty crap playing list & he was a pretty crap coach.

[Nasher 33,617]

38 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

According to Wikipedia the round 2 scores were Melb 24.23 (167) to Fitz 23.19 (157)

Yep: https://afltables.com/afl/stats/games/1978/061119780408.html

[durango 2,023]

13 minutes ago, Cranky Franky said:

He was an ex Melbourne player who had some success in coaching in WA.  He had a pretty crap playing list & he was a pretty crap coach.

He coached in SA

[Deemania since 56 6,717]

12 hours ago, Supermercado said:

1970s fans, explain the Dennis Jones coaching regime to me. I've just started doing a research deep dive into 1978 and there's an almost Mark Neeld level of insanity going on.

- He was appointed after three years out of senior coaching and had been sitting on the committee that presumably appointed him. Previous coaching experience with Prahran 15 years earlier (one losing second division grand final + one prelim), Central Districts seven years earlier (finals in the last of his four years) and West Perth in 1973/1974 (grand final in his first year, didn't make the finals in his second and left). I know he had more experience than a lot of people who got senior roles in that era but seems a bit jobs for the boys.

- Ian Thorogood was one of his assistants after two years taking Carlton to 1st and 6th on the ladder. Seems like he'd have been a better option. Did he not want to take on another senior job?

- Bob Skilton was reported to be one of the lowest paid coaches in the league, then Jones was said to be one of the highest. My reading of the situation is that he became one of the few full time coaches in the league because he had to give up a good job to take the role. A precursor for the next few years where we'd try and buy everyone in sight.

- Immediately banned players from wearing thongs, t-shirts or tracksuits. 

- Fell out with Laurie Fowler twice (which to be fair to Jones was apparently not hard to do), causing him to quit the club both times before quickly coming back.

- Presided over the most insane scoring I've ever seen, including:

• Conceding 100+ points in 20 of 22 weeks, 150+ five times and +140 another three times
• Losing 68-147 (!) in Round 1, winning 167-57 (!!) in Round 2, then five weeks later losing 141-204 (!!!!!!!)
• Losing 12 in a row in the middle of the year, including kicking 2.14.26 against Carlton and publicly describing it as the worst game he'd ever seen

- Spent much of his time complaining about umpiring

- Responded to nearly throwing away a big lead against Geelong with the playful statement "if we’d lost the game I would have cut their throats"

- After losing to South Melbourne, Swans coach Des Tuddenham said we'd "run out of legs" and Jones said his side had "run out of ability"

- Made the players sing the song in the visitors' dressing rooms of the Western Oval after their eighth 10+ goal loss of the season

- When he said there was money for recruiting (though they didn't buy anyone worthwhile before the season) his philosophy was “if you get enough stones you’ll eventually smash a window”, which doesn't sound like the sort of person you'd put in charge of a budget

- Celebrated a late season win by stomping on pamphlets handed out by a reform group that wanted to sack him.

You can tell by the team list that they were trying to find new players, and he did try and lower expectations by all but saying (in contemporary language) that they needed to rebuild, but the new administration got in at the end of the year and he basically quit before he was sacked anyway. 

How was this appointment seen at the time, and what was the tipping point that led to fans turning on him? This is an era I'd like to learn more about, there's a lot of focus on the Barassi years but the 70s seem to be ignored. I'm sure those of you who lived through it will say that it's forgotten for a good reason.

Yep, forgotten for good reason - things across the board were very low, no expectations, few teams with which to align and associate with across that period, regretfully - and it was only a few years since 1964. 

[Moonshadow 17,677]

42 minutes ago, loges said:

That's almost a shot at goal for every minute of play.

A lot of high scores in that era. 150 points wasn't uncommon. There were a couple of 200+ too

[daisycutter 29,738]

13 hours ago, Supermercado said:

1970s fans, explain the Dennis Jones coaching regime to me. I've just started doing a research deep dive into 1978 and there's an almost Mark Neeld level of insanity going on.

- He was appointed after three years out of senior coaching and had been sitting on the committee that presumably appointed him. Previous coaching experience with Prahran 15 years earlier (one losing second division grand final + one prelim), Central Districts seven years earlier (finals in the last of his four years) and West Perth in 1973/1974 (grand final in his first year, didn't make the finals in his second and left). I know he had more experience than a lot of people who got senior roles in that era but seems a bit jobs for the boys.

- Ian Thorogood was one of his assistants after two years taking Carlton to 1st and 6th on the ladder. Seems like he'd have been a better option. Did he not want to take on another senior job?

- Bob Skilton was reported to be one of the lowest paid coaches in the league, then Jones was said to be one of the highest. My reading of the situation is that he became one of the few full time coaches in the league because he had to give up a good job to take the role. A precursor for the next few years where we'd try and buy everyone in sight.

- Immediately banned players from wearing thongs, t-shirts or tracksuits. 

- Fell out with Laurie Fowler twice (which to be fair to Jones was apparently not hard to do), causing him to quit the club both times before quickly coming back.

- Presided over the most insane scoring I've ever seen, including:

• Conceding 100+ points in 20 of 22 weeks, 150+ five times and +140 another three times
• Losing 68-147 (!) in Round 1, winning 167-57 (!!) in Round 2, then five weeks later losing 141-204 (!!!!!!!)
• Losing 12 in a row in the middle of the year, including kicking 2.14.26 against Carlton and publicly describing it as the worst game he'd ever seen

- Spent much of his time complaining about umpiring

- Responded to nearly throwing away a big lead against Geelong with the playful statement "if we’d lost the game I would have cut their throats"

- After losing to South Melbourne, Swans coach Des Tuddenham said we'd "run out of legs" and Jones said his side had "run out of ability"

- Made the players sing the song in the visitors' dressing rooms of the Western Oval after their eighth 10+ goal loss of the season

- When he said there was money for recruiting (though they didn't buy anyone worthwhile before the season) his philosophy was “if you get enough stones you’ll eventually smash a window”, which doesn't sound like the sort of person you'd put in charge of a budget

- Celebrated a late season win by stomping on pamphlets handed out by a reform group that wanted to sack him.

You can tell by the team list that they were trying to find new players, and he did try and lower expectations by all but saying (in contemporary language) that they needed to rebuild, but the new administration got in at the end of the year and he basically quit before he was sacked anyway. 

How was this appointment seen at the time, and what was the tipping point that led to fans turning on him? This is an era I'd like to learn more about, there's a lot of focus on the Barassi years but the 70s seem to be ignored. I'm sure those of you who lived through it will say that it's forgotten for a good reason.

good research, sm

you forgot to add to his achievements that he also coached us to the wooden spoon that year ?

 

[Supermercado 2,802]

10 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

According to Wikipedia the round 2 scores were Melb 24.23 (167) to Fitz 23.19 (157)

Yep, was a typo in my post. 167-57 wouldn't have been nearly as weird.

[IvanBartul13 2,564]

I was not around for this part of our history but my father who has watched the dees every week since the 60s has always said he was our worst coach ever and used to play teams with far too many talls (top heavy)