Farewell Jesse Hogan

[layzie 34,043]

1 minute ago, SFebes said:

Sure is, that's why we're here isn't it? Name another he broke though, was a serious question as I can't think of another.

Did he break the Adelaide camp saga or at least some part of it?

[rjay 25,161]

12 minutes ago, SFebes said:

McClure gets about 1 in 20 right. A self confessed "news breaker" but breaks it after the clubs or players break it first. Can you name a time other than McGovern he has got a hole in one? He's just another try hard wannabe who clearly irritates them all on Talking Footy.

Adelaide camp...

He clearly has inside info at the Crows.

 

Edited August 30, 2018 by rjay

[SFebes 4,884]

Just now, daisycutter said:

nothing. he's still under contract

Contracts mean SFA these days DC, McGovern still has 2 to go, many other examples. I'm not sure what he'd do, but you'd weigh it up for sure.

[SFebes 4,884]

1 minute ago, rjay said:

Adelaide camp...

He clearly has inside info at the Crows

Ah OK, thought that was Caro and M.R.?

[Diamond_Jim 12,629]

GWS tried the numerous talls route with Lobb, Patton and Cameron plus Munford in the ruck. They were all high quality.

Did it work... most would say no.

Adelaide did much the same and were found wanting against Richmond but it did take them to a GF.

When we started this thread the big question mark was over Weideman. That question mark is still there albeit that it has decreased significantly.

Nice problem to have.

[Redleg 41,627]

8 minutes ago, SFebes said:

If FREO made Jesse an offer of $1.5m x 7, what do you think he would do? From memory currently on ~$500,00 per year at Dees.

Think you are under by at least $300k a year.

[old55 23,715]

14 minutes ago, binman said:

I can absolutely see the dees playing Weed, T Mac and Hogan together in the forward line and fully expect, if all 3 are fit, to see them line up in the forward line round 1 next year. I think they have shown their hand this year. 

I understand why some might query the wisdom of 3 bigs up forward, particularly with small forward lines being all the rage atm, as i don't think there are many examples of it working but TMac and Hogan are such aerobic beasts that they can get around the ground, offering down the line options, and Weed can play as the classic full forward leading from the square.

With Weed and Tmac also providing great chop out duties for Max there would be big chunks of the game where only two of them would actually be in the forward line at the same time. 

Hogan for me is the CHF, Weed full forward and Tmac the third tall. Huge nightmare for defensive units and opposition coaches as not only do you need height and strength you need players with motors to match Tmac and Hogan.

Throw in a team that gets huge inside 50 numbers and hopefully improved delivery of the ball into the forward line and you have a huge offensive weapon. 

Bring. It. On.

We played all 3 in R 6, 7 & 8 this year and then abandoned that plan.

Weed is a improved since then and can be expected to improve more next year, and there will be rule changes - but is that enough to make it work?

[SFebes 4,884]

1 minute ago, Redleg said:

Think you are under by at least $300k a year.

$800,000 you reckon? Interesting. In that case, I'd trade him for sure ?

[Redleg 41,627]

Think we are going to see a lot of players' names thrown up in trade rumours this year.

[Diamond_Jim 12,629]

12 minutes ago, SFebes said:

If FREO made Jesse an offer of $1.5m x 7, what do you think he would do? From memory currently on ~$500,00 per year at Dees.

and that is a big reason why you trade this year.

Other than taking the compensatory pick (around 15 assuming we finish top 4 next year) we would have to match and then trade.... assuming we could match.

Even an offer of $1.2M x 6 would be a hard task for us to match I suspect.

Edited August 30, 2018 by Diamond_Jim

[SFebes 4,884]

1 minute ago, Diamond_Jim said:

and that is a big reason why you trade this year.

Other than taking the compensatory pick (around 15 assuming we finish top 4 next year) we would have to match and then trade.... assuming we could match.

Even an offer of $1.2M x 6 would be a hard task for us to match I suspect.

Yep, I'm starting to see what people are saying now, interesting. Only if he wants to go though, I wouldn't force him out.

[binman 43,921]

8 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

We played all 3 in R 6, 7 & 8 this year and then abandoned that plan.

Weed is a improved since then and can be expected to improve more next year, and there will be rule changes - but is that enough to make it work?

I think so. Weed was average in that period. 

[Diamond_Jim 12,629]

10 minutes ago, SFebes said:

Yep, I'm starting to see what people are saying now, interesting. Only if he wants to go though, I wouldn't force him out.

the alternative of course is to ask JH to re-contract now...... it's all about balance and next year the balance moves dramatically his way.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

6 hours ago, beelzebub said:

The seeds are there because they are there. You can glibly deny it til the cows come home.

A thread on anyone isn't warranted. Nice deflection. I don't attempt to paint all with one brush as you would.

I didn't deny there weren't 'seeds'.  My point is the 'seeds' are there because others are trying to connect dots that just aren't there.  Clearly Jesse doesn't to go home, we don't want him to go and his manager has said the same thing.  It's the media who go "Hogan is from WA, I reckon he might go home one day" that get these rumours going.  You can start anything if you like.

And you are the dill that said 'anything is possible'.  I was just going by your inane rules as to why we should start a thread on anyone if 'anything is possible'.  

I applaud how well you are clutching to a sinking ship, but the Hogan going home stuff is quickly running out of steam.  In fact, the only ones keeping it going are posters like you who refuse to concede.

[SFebes 4,884]

3 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

the alternative of course is to ask JH to re-contract now...... it's all about balance and next year the balance moves dramatically his way.

If I were the Dees I'd be putting a contract to him now, it'll save the club a headache next year. I see the good and bad in JH, if he stays fine, if he leaves, I won't lose sleep, that's the industry it is these days and there's been many examples of good players leave other clubs. 

[Diamond_Jim 12,629]

6 minutes ago, SFebes said:

If I were the Dees I'd be putting a contract to him now, it'll save the club a headache next year. I see the good and bad in JH, if he stays fine, if he leaves, I won't lose sleep, that's the industry it is these days and there's been many examples of good players leave other clubs. 

it is certainly worth considering. The other problem is that of actual worth as against perceived worth. As one of three forwards what we are willing to pay JH may be a factor less than what a one forward club such as Freo might pay.

Not much use if we assess him at 4x $1M and Freo offer 6 x $1.3M. Then we only have the we might win a flag card to play.

[SFebes 4,884]

7 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

it is certainly worth considering. The other problem is that of actual worth as against perceived worth. As one of three forwards what we are willing to pay JH may be a factor less than what a one forward club such as Freo might pay.

Not much use if we assess him at 4x $1M and Freo offer 6 x $1.3M. Then we only have the we might win a flag card to play.

$1m is a lot IMO, I even think $800,000 is a lot if Redleg is correct. For a bloke who hasn't performed against better sides. I don't think he'll go, but all parties should definitely assess, as they should. Chris Scott came out last week and said even Dangerfield is tradable for the right price.

[beelzebub 23,383]

18 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

I didn't deny there weren't 'seeds'.  My point is the 'seeds' are there because others are trying to connect dots that just aren't there.  Clearly Jesse doesn't to go home, we don't want him to go and his manager has said the same thing.  It's the media who go "Hogan is from WA, I reckon he might go home one day" that get these rumours going.  You can start anything if you like.

And you are the dill that said 'anything is possible'.  I was just going by your inane rules as to why we should start a thread on anyone if 'anything is possible'.  

I applaud how well you are clutching to a sinking ship, but the Hogan going home stuff is quickly running out of steam.  In fact, the only ones keeping it going are posters like you who refuse to concede.

What am I refusing to concede ?

He may not go home. He might.

Until it's over it ain't over. We /you/ anyone can't debate the merits or even likelihood of an offer(s)  until they surface. They aren't going to surface until we finish with finals ( with flag )

There are a number of different realities in footy. The h/a season.  Finals.. Trade/draft circus... preseason .  Each has it's own climate and peculiarities. Those most left of field environment I would suggest is trade week. 

If Jesse stays ..all well and good but exactly where and how he plays is a , imho, a vexed question. If he goes... again all well and good...what do we get.

Who here would seriously bet their house he stays ? Brave

[deehughman 10]

Hogan is value is high. I would keep him unless some stupdi deal was on the table eg. two top 10 picks.

I would be tempted to play him in defence. 

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,417]

For his last contract Hogan held all cards, the go home factor and his potential was there for all to see. No one is doubting he he has talent, the debate hinges on how much, and is that talent good enough to impact big games. There are two sides to this discussion, those that continually state how many goals he’s kicked, marks he’s taken and then those that point out that they are largely against sides which won’t be playing next week. Those that say “imagine how much we would of beaten the Eagels by if Hogan was playing” and those that thought his absence would actually strengthened our chances of winning because of our teams dynamics changing. Our victories this year against Eagles/GWS  this year and Crows/Eagles last year are surely more than just a coincidence. Obviously that doesn’t mean we win every game Hogan’s not in the side but it’s something we as supporters and footy department are fully aware of. Why is it that our midfield which apparently is largely to blame when Hogan plays poorly is so instrumental in our victories when he’s not playing, have we seen Hogan’s best? For supposedly the best young forward in competition he has some big flaws in his craft. Is there any chance he’s not the player we all thought he’d be when we first drafted him. His career will be and his next contract should be determined by his performance’s in big games. 

 

Edited August 30, 2018 by Bombay Airconditioning

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,417]

1 hour ago, Win4theAges said:

He wants to stay end of story.

Period.

The amount of money will be the end of the story IMO.

[Gator 17,505]

1 hour ago, daisycutter said:

fortunately both tmac and hoges make good utilities and can play multiple positions. neither need to be dedicated forwards.

I'm interested in "highest and best use"", not watering down a player's best position to squeeze in someone else.

Salem wasn't great in the midfield, but is great down back.  Brayshaw wasn't great as a high half forward or on a back flank, but is great on ball.  

Yes, players can be juggled, but invariably water finds its own level and the course you're advocating rarely is sustainable.

[Axis of Bob 11,874]

42 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

What am I refusing to concede ?

He may not go home. He might.

Until it's over it ain't over. We /you/ anyone can't debate the merits or even likelihood of an offer(s)  until they surface. They aren't going to surface until we finish with finals ( with flag )

There are a number of different realities in footy. The h/a season.  Finals.. Trade/draft circus... preseason .  Each has it's own climate and peculiarities. Those most left of field environment I would suggest is trade week. 

If Jesse stays ..all well and good but exactly where and how he plays is a , imho, a vexed question. If he goes... again all well and good...what do we get.

Who here would seriously bet their house he stays ? Brave

This is possibly the biggest load of rubbish I have read on Demonland. Not so much the message (which is near on indecipherable) but the actual collection of words in the screen.

I assume you are attempting to say that because Jesse hasn't been traded to WA yet it means that he can still get traded WA, and the way to fix that is to trade him to WA.

It's like the People's Front of Judea, if they were all high.

Edited August 30, 2018 by Axis of Bob

[Moonshadow 17,677]

1 hour ago, Wiseblood said:

I didn't deny there weren't 'seeds'.  My point is the 'seeds' are there because others are trying to connect dots that just aren't there.  Clearly Jesse doesn't to go home, we don't want him to go and his manager has said the same thing.  It's the media who go "Hogan is from WA, I reckon he might go home one day" that get these rumours going.  You can start anything if you like.

And you are the dill that said 'anything is possible'.  I was just going by your inane rules as to why we should start a thread on anyone if 'anything is possible'.  

I applaud how well you are clutching to a sinking ship, but the Hogan going home stuff is quickly running out of steam.  In fact, the only ones keeping it going are posters like you who refuse to concede.

Sheesh, Wise. Why all the agro and condescension? Some of us are discussing Hogan's hypothetical value. Do you think the FD don't weigh up his worth? I do not believe Bub is being disrespectful. None of us want him to leave. 

You make it sound that by shouting down free speech (a term which i generally dislike), you win. That's how Stuie used to operate, you know... Just sayin'

Edited August 30, 2018 by Moonshadow

[Wiseblood 24,637]

11 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Sheesh, Wise. Why all the agro and condescension? Some of us are discussing Hogan's hypothetical value. Do you think the FD don't weigh up his worth? I do not believe Bub is being disrespectful. None of us want him to leave. 

You make it sound that by shouting down free speech (a term which i generally dislike), you win. That's how Stuie used to operate, you know... Just sayin'

Hardly Moonie. As the above post suggests I'm not the only one who thinks debating the hypothetical value of a contracted, loyal player is a little ridiculous.