1 minute ago, McQueen said:

Under some decent tutelage for once, Gawn has improved out of sight so I'm hoping/trusting that the likes of Stafford and Macca can do similar with Spencer. He played a strong game against the Cats last year in our win at KP and he's got the mongrel to go with the team ethos.

I reckon Max would be over the moon with this news and he'd be hoping Spencer can begin to really impact consistently so the poor bastard can get a decent chop-out for once.

Tongue was firmly in cheek, I've got no issue with retaining Spencer.

1 minute ago, McQueen said:

Under some decent tutelage for once, Gawn has improved out of site so I'm hoping/trusting that the likes of Stafford and Macca can do similar with Spencer. He played a strong game against the Cats last year in our win at KP and he's got the mongrel to go with the team ethos.

I reckon Max would be over the moon with this news and he'd be hoping Spencer can begin to really impact consistently so the poor bastard can get a decent chop-out for once.

Max would be loving the fact he's got the same bloke to pants at training every week. 

So much of Gawn's improvement came from getting his body strong and confident. Spencer has the strength, but probably not the confidence. I hope he can develop it with a good run of footy, even if I don't expect much. Spence really has had a rough run with his body but he's getting to the stage where I'm not sure he's ever going to get through a preseason without something going wrong.

I'd love to be playing 2 rucks regularly but I can't see Spencer and Gawn ever been anything more than needed in case of emergency. Not unless Spencer improves so much in the ruck that he's worth playing >50% in the ruck, as he'll always be below average forward. Gawn is probably only just average forward, and better sneaking forward from the ruck than starting there.

The King's are the great hope for Gawny. Mitch is a long way off. Max is a chance but needs to get physical in the ruck and be way more consistent forward for Casey.

4 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Max would be loving the fact he's got the same bloke to pants at training every week. 

So much of Gawn's improvement came from getting his body strong and confident. Spencer has the strength, but probably not the confidence. I hope he can develop it with a good run of footy, even if I don't expect much. Spence really has had a rough run with his body but he's getting to the stage where I'm not sure he's ever going to get through a preseason without something going wrong.

I'd love to be playing 2 rucks regularly but I can't see Spencer and Gawn ever been anything more than needed in case of emergency. Not unless Spencer improves so much in the ruck that he's worth playing >50% in the ruck, as he'll always be below average forward. Gawn is probably only just average forward, and better sneaking forward from the ruck than starting there.

The King's are the great hope for Gawny. Mitch is a long way off. Max is a chance but needs to get physical in the ruck and be way more consistent forward for Casey.

I'm not as concerned about the forward ability of Spencer but more so the rucking advantage that we need to maintain for our much improved clearance brigade. The big body of Spencer is a much better hope than the King boys at this stage.

 

11 minutes ago, McQueen said:

I'm not as concerned about the forward ability of Spencer but more so the rucking advantage that we need to maintain for our much improved clearance brigade. The big body of Spencer is a much better hope than the King boys at this stage.

 

Good back up first ruck option but to get into the seniors he has to start marking the ball around the ground and getting involved at stoppages.

I don't think it's out of the question he can do this.  Not many recognize how quick he is and he likes the physical stuff.  His kicking looks awful but it's actually quite reliable now.  One of our biggest issues as a team is no effective second ruckman.  We lose so much when Max is out of the ruck and I think if Spence can stay involved around the ground they could play together.  It would allow Gawn to play forward more where he is a genuine threat and it would mean we are genuinely competitive in the ruck especially when Spence is rucking against the oppositions second ruck. It might help Gawn to stay fresh and help his career in a number of ways.

TBH I can't see it happening but there is a chance.  Spence is a lot better than many give him credit for and having him with the club is a big positive.

2 minutes ago, Baghdad Bob said:

Good back up first ruck option but to get into the seniors he has to start marking the ball around the ground and getting involved at stoppages.

I don't think it's out of the question he can do this.  Not many recognize how quick he is and he likes the physical stuff.  His kicking looks awful but it's actually quite reliable now.  One of our biggest issues as a team is no effective second ruckman.  We lose so much when Max is out of the ruck and I think if Spence can stay involved around the ground they could play together.  It would allow Gawn to play forward more where he is a genuine threat and it would mean we are genuinely competitive in the ruck especially when Spence is rucking against the oppositions second ruck. It might help Gawn to stay fresh and help his career in a number of ways.

TBH I can't see it happening but there is a chance.  Spence is a lot better than many give him credit for and having him with the club is a big positive.

Agree.  I think Pedersen has him covered overall at present because he has those around the ground assets, but "Betty" must be a better option than say Frost in this role.

2 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

 

Max King needs to pull his finger out, although he will always be more of a forward than a ruck IMO. Mitch King is injured and will take a few more years at least.

 

So........ a 20 year old 202cm ruckman forward needs to pull his finger out ? 

5 minutes ago, nutbean said:

So........ a 20 year old 202cm ruckman forward needs to pull his finger out ? 

Yes. He's a forward/ruck not a pure ruck. 3rd year on the list. Hasn't developed his body to the standard. Can't regularly impact VFL games up forward the way Hulett and Weideman can in year 1. If he could halve a few more contests in the ruck and get involved more as a forward he'd be doing very well.

I'm not saying he should be playing regular senior football, but for his own sake Max needs to start playing consistently well at VFL level. His VFL reviews - whilst often positive - certainly hint at that.

Every successful team needs good foot soldiers. Good on spence - hope he gets some reward for his efforts.

gee it's handy being super tall isn't it! You get to play AFL for 7 years despite doing zero damage, simply because you are a required backup plan. Very handy indeed

2 hours ago, DavidNeitz9 said:

Next season is Spencer's 10th at Melbourne and he's only played 36 games, no way should he have been given more than a year extension

He is not an AFL footballer, or rather, he shouldn't be. The only reason he is is because besides Gawn, we have no other viable options as cover atm.

We seriously need another decent ruck brought on to the list, or time to develop one. That's Spencer's only saving grace. But whilst still on the list, i will continue to support him.

2 hours ago, Fifty-5 said:

I don't think it's out of the question that Gawn and Spencer play together sometime this year.  I'm on record saying this is not on, but if Pedersen is missing ...

 

We beat Geelong last year doing it.

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

Max would be loving the fact he's got the same bloke to pants at training every week. 

So much of Gawn's improvement came from getting his body strong and confident. Spencer has the strength, but probably not the confidence. I hope he can develop it with a good run of footy, even if I don't expect much. Spence really has had a rough run with his body but he's getting to the stage where I'm not sure he's ever going to get through a preseason without something going wrong.

I'd love to be playing 2 rucks regularly but I can't see Spencer and Gawn ever been anything more than needed in case of emergency. Not unless Spencer improves so much in the ruck that he's worth playing >50% in the ruck, as he'll always be below average forward. Gawn is probably only just average forward, and better sneaking forward from the ruck than starting there.

The King's are the great hope for Gawny. Mitch is a long way off. Max is a chance but needs to get physical in the ruck and be way more consistent forward for Casey.

 

14 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Yes. He's a forward/ruck not a pure ruck. 3rd year on the list. Hasn't developed his body to the standard. Can't regularly impact VFL games up forward the way Hulett and Weideman can in year 1. If he could halve a few more contests in the ruck and get involved more as a forward he'd be doing very well.

I'm not saying he should be playing regular senior football, but for his own sake Max needs to start playing consistently well at VFL level. His VFL reviews - whilst often positive - certainly hint at that.

 

Short memory?

You do realise Gawn wasn't tracking as well as Max King at the same age..?

I wish I were tall. Then I'd be able to get on an AFL list and stay there forever without having to play a single game.

We should have waited till the end of the year IMO. This will look like a dud decision if he does his knee again.

I was waiting for the "he is a dud" brigade to come rushing out....but I can only see three totally negative and a couple of ambivalent posts.

To me he is a must, at least until the Kings, or one of them, get up to pace.

Well done Spencil.

14 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

 

We beat Geelong last year doing it.

and that makes a grand total of one....

Now Spencer may become a late bloomer ( very very late) but to date, he doesn't take enough marks, he doesn't kick enough goals, he doesn't impact enough contests - what he does ok is contest in the ruck.

At this stage I think a Gawn/Pedersen combo offers much more than Gawn/Spencer. 

As others have said , he is purely insurance.

5 minutes ago, Mach5 said:

 

 

Short memory?

You do realise Gawn wasn't tracking as well as Max King at the same age..?

I meant a chance to play a few games here and there if he improved. In terms of being a regular in the 22 he's a fair way off. As the only appropriately sized forward/ruck on the list it's possible for Max King to be both close to a game and close to delisting at the same time.

Despite missing most of his first year recovering from an ACL Gawny played 4 games in his second year - and in a pretty decent (if up and down) side. Missed his entire 3rd year with another ACL but in his 4th year played 13 games. I'm not sure how that equates to tracking the same way as Max King who is yet to debut in his 3rd year 

12 minutes ago, Fat Tony said:

We should have waited till the end of the year IMO. This will look like a dud decision if he does his knee again.

Analysis lacking imagination.

Spencer's manager: "Jake is UFA this year and I've had some inquiries.  He really wants to stay the course with the Demons."

4 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Analysis lacking imagination.

Spencer's manager: "Jake is UFA this year and I've had some inquiries.  He really wants to stay the course with the Demons."

Tigers and Dimma would be pulling their hair out at this very moment.

Just now, Fifty-5 said:

Analysis lacking imagination.

Spencer's manager: "Jake is UFA this year and I've had some inquiries.  He really wants to stay the course with the Demons."

I understand Spencer is a free agent, but so what if he walked?  He is an ordinary player who is replaceable. We should have waited until the end of the year rather than run the risk that he wouldn't get injured.

2 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Analysis lacking imagination.

Spencer's manager: "Jake is UFA this year and I've had some inquiries.  He really wants to stay the course with the Demons."

We've only offered him a 1 year deal. Doesn't sound like the inquiries from other clubs would have set him up for life. If Mitch King didn't do his knee, Spencer may have been let go.

 

 

Just now, mo64 said:

We've only offered him a 1 year deal. Doesn't sound like the inquiries from other clubs would have set him up for life. If Mitch King didn't do his knee, Spencer may have been let go.

 

 

Maybe (Re: King). But we've secured insurance. One year makes complete sense for a ready-made back-up.

15 minutes ago, H_T said:

Tigers and Dimma would be pulling their hair out at this very moment.

If the Tigers want him we can now trade him.  As an UFA we couldn't.  We've got all the options now but I reckon Jake is backing himself to make it.

Gotta love the man.  He's a ripper.

3 minutes ago, Baghdad Bob said:

If the Tigers want him we can now trade him.  As an UFA we couldn't.  We've got all the options now but I reckon Jake is backing himself to make it.

Gotta love the man.  He's a ripper.

Yes. Absolutely backing himself to make it. To be able to train as an understudy to Max, play when Max needs a rest in a developing side on the rise - I just couldn't think of anywhere else I'd be right now. 

 

58 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

Agree.  I think Pedersen has him covered overall at present because he has those around the ground assets, but "Betty" must be a better option than say Frost in this role.

I agree Pedo's got him covered in some areas but Jake has him covered in others.  Pedo can't get taller and ever ruck as well as Jake but Jake has a chance to improve in the areas Pedo is good at.

Jake is quicker, he's got more aggression, he can ruck better and he can get involved around the ground as well as Pedo.  He can't take a mark like Pedo and he can't kick as well.

But it's not as clear cut as many think. Jake needs to take marks forward and demand an opposition tall.